<div dir="ltr">hi all,<br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 3 March 2015 at 14:31, Seun Ojedeji <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:seun.ojedeji@gmail.com" target="_blank">seun.ojedeji@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir="ltr">Hi,</p>
<p dir="ltr">While I agree on the monopolistic analysis, I will just like to note that ICANN is not the only organisation in such situation; RIRs for instance is another example and they are ran by board.<br></p></blockquote><div>The RIRs are membership organisations. Their boards are elected by their members and the members essentially own the organisations - and so there is a powerful direct accountability mechanism already in place to deal with problems - a mechanism that ICANN lacks. <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir="ltr">
I think it will be dangerous OR at least not advisable to subject staff to direct accountability to the community. The best that could be done is to get the board to do it's job and I think the ultimate ability to remove a board member would be enough incentive for any board to deliver on it's mandate.</p></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I agree we can't have staff reporting to the community, but do think Jeff's posts give us food for thought.</div><div><br></div><div>Jordan</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<p dir="ltr">Regards<br>
sent from Google nexus 4<br>
kindly excuse brevity and typos.</p><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5">
<div class="gmail_quote">On 3 Mar 2015 05:30, "Jeff Neuman" <<a href="mailto:jeff.neuman@comlaude.com" target="_blank">jeff.neuman@comlaude.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a name="14bde1e5895f6927_14bdde698ff7a589__MailEndCompose"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">In a non-monopolistic environment, I would completely agree that a corporation’s board (whether for profit or not for profit) would
adequately address the situation, since customers (in the case of for-profit) or members (in the case of non-profit) would either cease purchasing the company’s products/services or cancel membership in a non-profit organization (as examples). For example,
if I am not happy with a company that has proven it cannot keep my information confidential, I can simply take my shopping elsewhere. If I am not happy with a non-profit because it is not serving my needs, I can go to other non-profits (or even form my own).<u></u><u></u></span></a></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">But here, in the monopolistic environment where contracted parties have no choice but to deal with ICANN, leaving these types of issues to the Board without other
meaningful redress is not enough accountability. After all, it is not as if the contracted parties could go elsewhere if dissatisfied with the operations of ICANN (or in this case the lack of security measures to protect information). Thus, we have a true
accountability problem.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">To summarize, in a monopolistic environment where demand for services are inelastic, relying on a board to hold staff accountable for these types of failures
in my opinion is not enough. Without the potential for losing customers or community participation because of such failures, there is little incentive for the board to act.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">These are just my personal opinions.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0f9347">Jeffrey J. Neuman</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0f9347">Senior Vice President </span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">|</span><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#c39209">Valideus
USA</span></b><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#c32830">
</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">| </span><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#c32830">Com Laude USA</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">1751 Pinnacle Drive, Suite 600<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">Mclean, VA 22102, United States<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">E:
</span><a href="mailto:jeff.neuman@valideus.com" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00b050">jeff.neuman@valideus.com</span></a><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#595959">
or </span><a href="mailto:jeff.neuman@comlaude.com" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00b050">jeff.neuman@comlaude.com</span></a><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00b050">
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">T: <a href="tel:%2B1.703.635.7514" value="+17036357514" target="_blank">+1.703.635.7514</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">M: <a href="tel:%2B1.202.549.5079" value="+12025495079" target="_blank">+1.202.549.5079</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">@Jintlaw<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Jordan Carter [mailto:<a href="mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz" target="_blank">jordan@internetnz.net.nz</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 2, 2015 8:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Jeff Neuman<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Other forms of Accountability?<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks Jeff for sharing this. I think the practical work going on in the Working Parties is dealing with many broader items than just the ICANN Board.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Your example posits an interesting question: is "accountability" focused on the governance level, or on operations?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">That is, is a staff level execution failure something the community or customers has accountability tools to deal with, beyond ensuring the Board holds CE to account?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">One way of looking at this example is that it's up to the Board to hold its Chief Executive responsible for delivering secure services and that that's where it lies. If the Board fails to do so, some of the mechanisms under debate would
help deal with that. Review and redress options would also provide some relief to those damaged.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thoughts?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Jordan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 3 March 2015 at 07:01, Jeff Neuman <<a href="mailto:jeff.neuman@comlaude.com" target="_blank">jeff.neuman@comlaude.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Removing Board Directors, while taking up most of the discussion for the last few weeks does not address most of the accountability issues we have with ICANN.
<br>
<br>
Not sure if you saw this article: <a href="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/03/02/icann_suffers_another_security_breach/" target="_blank">
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/03/02/icann_suffers_another_security_breach/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Which accountability measures do we have to safeguard us from this?<br>
<br>
Thanks.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0f9347">Jeffrey J. Neuman</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#0f9347">Senior Vice President </span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">|</span><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#c39209">Valideus
USA</span></b><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#c32830">
</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">| </span><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#c32830">Com Laude USA</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">1751 Pinnacle Drive, Suite 600</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">Mclean, VA 22102, United States</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">E:
</span><u><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00b050"><a href="mailto:jeff.neuman@valideus.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:#00b050">jeff.neuman@valideus.com</span></a></span></u><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#595959">
or </span><u><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00b050"><a href="mailto:jeff.neuman@comlaude.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:#00b050">jeff.neuman@comlaude.com</span></a></span></u><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#00b050">
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">T:
<a href="tel:%2B1.703.635.7514" target="_blank">+1.703.635.7514</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">M:
<a href="tel:%2B1.202.549.5079" target="_blank">+1.202.549.5079</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#4f4f4f">@Jintlaw</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
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</blockquote>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br clear="all">
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jordan Carter<br>
<br>
Chief Executive <br>
<b>InternetNZ</b><br>
<br>
<a href="tel:04%20495%202118" value="+6444952118" target="_blank">04 495 2118</a> (office) | <a href="tel:%2B64%2021%20442%20649" value="+6421442649" target="_blank">+64 21 442 649</a> (mob)<br>
<a href="mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz" target="_blank">jordan@internetnz.net.nz</a>
<br>
Skype: jordancarter<br>
<br>
<i>A better world through a better Internet </i><u></u><u></u></p>
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<br></blockquote></div>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr">Jordan Carter<br><br>Chief Executive <br><b>InternetNZ</b><br><br>04 495 2118 (office) | +64 21 442 649 (mob)<br><a href="mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz" target="_blank">jordan@internetnz.net.nz</a> <br>Skype: jordancarter<br><br><i>A better world through a better Internet </i><br><br></div></div></div></div>
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