<div dir="ltr"><div><font face="Arial"><span name="Sivasubramanian M">Dear All,</span></font></div><div><font face="Arial"><span name="Sivasubramanian M">I am not clear of comments made by MR. Sivasubramanian M.</span></font></div><div><font face="Arial"><span name="Sivasubramanian M">In his message times 0154 UTC he mentioned Quote</span></font></div><div><font face="Arial"><span name="Sivasubramanian M"><br></span></font></div><div><font face="Arial"><span name="Sivasubramanian M"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">"<em>Notes: 2. Brief Discussion:<br></em></font><ul style="margin:0px;line-height:19.04px"><li><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><em>WS2 - no need to be in place before transition takes place but needs to take place</em> <em>post transition."</em></font></li></ul></blockquote><div>I fully agree that : <font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Three items need to be put in place as part of WS1. </font></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><ul style="margin:0px;list-style-type:disc"><li><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Recalling members of the ICANN board of directors.</font></li></ul><ul style="margin:0px;list-style-type:disc"><li><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Community empowerment over ICANN’s management.</font></li></ul><ul style="margin:0px;list-style-type:disc"><li><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Limiting the scope of ICANN’s activity. </font></li></ul></blockquote><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><div><ul style="margin:10px 0px 0px;line-height:19.04px"><li style="list-style-type:none;background-image:none"></li></ul><div><span style="line-height:19.04px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><br></font></span></div></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">However, I am not aware that it has been decided by CCWG that pre-transition changes to the Accountability framework is minimal with major improvements to discussed and carried out on an ongoing basis post transition. </font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><br></font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">In my view , it is highly desirable to think of s the above mentioned three items related to the Accountability framework as the inclusion of provisions to recall members of the Board, limiting the scope of ICANN's activity or even Community empowerment over ICANN management. </font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><br></font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Mr.<font face="Arial">Sivasubramanian M. continued in that message to indicate the following </font></font></div><div>Quote </div><div><br></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"> "<em>Within a well-considered and larger Accountability environment such changes could be effected in phases, in tune with a larger and clearer blue print, but without even a beginning on such a blue print, it is unwise to think of the changes as proposed for WS1. These provisions, if included pre-transition and in a rush, could prove counter productive"</em></font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Unquote</font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Again in my view thinking ,discussing and addressing of those three items </font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">are quite essential under WS1 and thus we are on proper track .</font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><br></font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">I do not agree the At best, WS 1 could discuss such changes but leave it for implementation post transition, after more elaborate thinking.On the contrary we need to take all possible measures for their implantation as soon as possible </font></div></div></span></font></div><div><font face="Arial"><span name="Sivasubramanian M"><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">MR. Sivasubramanian M. in his message times 07,15 UTC indicated</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Quote</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">"<em>We did discuss how Work Steam 1 and 2 would look at areas of Accountability improvements before and after transition but not how the exact items of improvements would be split between pre and post-transition. Also, though the following items were discussed, it is only in this message that the following items appear conclusively as items to be implemented before transition:</em></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><em><br></em></div><span class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;color:rgb(51,51,51);padding-left:1ex;font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><em>Recalling members of the ICANN board of directors.</em></font></li></ul><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><em>Community empowerment over ICANN’s management.</em></font></li></ul><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><em>Limiting the scope of ICANN’s activity. <br></em></font></li></ul></blockquote><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><em><br></em></div></span><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><em>Even if late, there may not be any harm in being thorough on the positive consequences of these sweeping changes, as also in thinking thorough probable unintended consequences.</em></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><em><br></em></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><em>Thank you"</em></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Unquote</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Here I fail to understand the objectives of the later part</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">In his view , should we discuss and implement the items below</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"> <em><font face="Trebuchet MS">Recalling members of the ICANN board of directors.</font></em></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><em>Community empowerment over ICANN’s management.</em></font></li></ul></div><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><em>Limiting the scope of ICANN’s activity.</em></font></li></ul><p style="margin-left:15px"><font face="Trebuchet MS">Or we should not discuss nor implement them?</font></p><p style="margin-left:15px"><font face="Trebuchet MS">In my view WE SHOULD DISCUSS, ADDRESS AND MAKE NECESSARY PROVISIONS FOR THEIR IMPLEMENTATION .</font></p><p style="margin-left:15px"><font face="Trebuchet MS">May I ask Jordan or Steve TO CLARIFY THE MATTER</font></p><p style="margin-left:15px">Kavouss </p></span></font></div><div><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif"><br></font></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2015-03-12 7:19 GMT+01:00 Sivasubramanian M <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:isolatedn@gmail.com" target="_blank">isolatedn@gmail.com</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">Dear Steve, Jordan and Mathew</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">We did discuss how Work Steam 1 and 2 would look at areas of Accountability improvements before and after transition but not how the exact items of improvements would be split between pre and post-transition. Also, though the following items were discussed, it is only in this message that the following items appear conclusively as items to be implemented before transition:</div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small"><span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Recalling members of the ICANN board of directors.</font></li></ul><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Community empowerment over ICANN’s management.</font></li></ul><ul style="margin:0px"><li style="margin-left:15px"><font face="trebuchet ms, sans-serif">Limiting the scope of ICANN’s activity. <br></font></li></ul></blockquote><div><br></div></span><div>Even if late, there may not be any harm in being thorough on the positive consequences of these sweeping changes, as also in thinking thorough probable unintended consequences.</div><div><br></div><div>Thank you.</div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div><br></div><div class="gmail_default"><ul style="margin:10px 0px 0px;line-height:19.04px;font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px"><li style="margin-left:15px;list-style-type:none;background-image:none"></li></ul></div></font></span></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br clear="all"><div><div><div dir="ltr"><a href="https://www.facebook.com/sivasubramanian.muthusamy" target="_blank">Sivasubramanian M</a></div></div></div></font></span><div><div class="h5">
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Mar 12, 2015 at 9:56 AM, Steve DelBianco <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:sdelbianco@netchoice.org" target="_blank">sdelbianco@netchoice.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid">
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:16px">
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<div>Siva — Back in December, we gathered consensus around this rationale between WS1 and WS2:</div>
<div>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 40px;padding:0px;border:currentColor">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Proposed rationale for designating Work Streams: (updated to reflect discussion thru 12-Jan)</div>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 40px;padding:0px;border:currentColor">
<div>Work Stream 1 is designated for accountability enhancement mechanisms that must be in place or committed to, before IANA transition occurs.</div>
<div><br>
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<div>WS1 mechanisms are those that, when in place or committed to, would provide the community with confidence that any accountability mechanism that would further enhance Icann's accountability would be implemented if it had consensus support from the community,
even if it were to encounter Icann management resistance or if it were against the interest of Icann as a corporate entity.</div>
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<div>All other consensus items could be in Work Stream 2, provided the mechanisms in WS1 are adequate to force implementation of WS2 items despite resistance from ICANN management and board.</div>
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<div>The legal team’s formulation between WS1 and WS2 legal questions fits with that proposal. </div>
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<div>—</div>
<div>
<div>Steve DelBianco</div>
<div>Executive Director</div>
<div>NetChoice</div>
<div><a href="http://www.netchoice.org/" target="_blank">http://www.NetChoice.org</a> and <a href="http://blog.netchoice.org/" target="_blank">http://blog.netchoice.org</a></div>
<div><a href="tel:%2B1.703.615.6206" target="_blank" value="+17036156206">+1.703.615.6206</a></div>
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<span style="font-weight:bold">From: </span>Sivasubramanian M<br>
<span style="font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Wednesday, March 11, 2015 at 7:54 PM<br>
<span style="font-weight:bold">To: </span>Accountability Cross Community<br>
<span style="font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>[CCWG-ACCT] Work Stream 1 and Work Stream 2: Comments based on impressions from Meeting Notes.<br>
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<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Hello</font></div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
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<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">I was not present for the Legal Sub Team call <a href="https://community.icann.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=52891852" target="_blank">https://community.icann.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=52891852</a>
on 10th March and have not listened to the recording either. This comment is based on the Introductory section of the Meeting Notes, which might not be points discussed at length during the Sub Team meeting, quoted below, and raised here as a point to consider
by the whole group:</font></div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid">
<font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Notes: 2. Brief Discussion:<br>
</font>
<ul style="margin:0px;line-height:19.04px">
<li><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">WS2 - no need to be in place before transition takes place but needs to take place post transition. </font></li></ul>
<font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><span style="line-height:19.04px"><br>
</span>Three items need to be put in place as part of WS1. </font>
<ul style="margin:0px;list-style-type:disc">
<li><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Recalling members of the ICANN board of directors.</font></li></ul>
<ul style="margin:0px;list-style-type:disc">
<li><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Community empowerment over ICANN’s management.</font></li></ul>
<ul style="margin:0px;list-style-type:disc">
<li><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Limiting the scope of ICANN’s activity. </font></li></ul>
</blockquote>
<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">
<div>
<ul style="margin:10px 0px 0px;line-height:19.04px">
<li style="list-style-type:none;background-image:none"></li></ul>
<div><span style="line-height:19.04px"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></span></div>
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<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">One of the several proposals for Work Stream 2 was based on the rationale that pre-transition changes to the Accountability framework is minimal with major improvements to discussed and carried out on an ongoing basis
post transition. </font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">With almost zero discussion on Work Stream 2, without even the formation of work stream 2, it is highly undesirable to think of such changes to the Accountability framework as the inclusion of provisions to recall members
of the Board, limiting the scope of ICANN's activity or even Community empowerment over ICANN management. </font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Within a well-considered and larger Accountability environment such changes could be effected in phases, in tune with a larger and clearer blue print, but without even a beginning on such a blue print, it is unwise
to think of the changes as proposed for WS1. These provisions, if included pre-transition and in a rush, could prove counter productive.</font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">I would propose the bare minimal improvements to the Accountability framework, if such improvements are to be made in a rush. At best, WS 1 could discuss such changes but leave it for implementation post transition,
after more elaborate thinking.</font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
<div><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif">Sivasubramanian M</font></div>
<div><span style="line-height:19.04px"><font face="trebuchet ms,sans-serif"><br>
</font></span></div>
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<div class="gmail_default" style="color:rgb(51,51,51);font-family:verdana,sans-serif;font-size:small">
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<div dir="ltr"><a href="https://www.facebook.com/sivasubramanian.muthusamy" target="_blank">Sivasubramanian M</a></div>
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</blockquote></div><br></div></div></div>
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