<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>I respect we have different approaches to data. Without stating too much, bridgebay is a Washington State not a California SEC registered entity.</div><div><br></div><div>Addressing an entity paying for work/ audit- there was an incident in CA I recall where an entity was sent by an institution to prepare an analysis of a site. The vendor stated he gave a favorable report because he wanted work and referrals from the company that owned the site. </div><div><br></div><div>As it turned out three months earlier someone looking at the site hired their own vendor to review the property. That independent report showed damages and concerns the host hired vendors report did not show.</div><div><br></div><div>Needless to say, four months later Northridge earthquake hit and the site foundation broke. The independently commissioned report had shown damage . The property hired analysts report did not.</div><div><br></div><div>Hence I advise parties, recommend your own. Let the community select three entities that can be researched transparently.</div><div><br></div><div>There is no perfect answer. With all the issues and difficulties in disclosure already from ICANN is money the issue to expect more cooperation from?</div><div><br></div><div>Carrie Devorah</div><div><a href="http://Www.centerforcopyrightintegrity.com">Www.centerforcopyrightintegrity.com</a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On Mar 23, 2015, at 8:55 AM, Seun Ojedeji <<a href="mailto:seun.ojedeji@gmail.com">seun.ojedeji@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><p dir="ltr">I beg to differ Carrie, I don't understand the rationale behind your claim that an audit will lack independence (credibility) because ICANN is paying. Please tell me which audit company does free auditing without being paid....most organisations that use external auditors pay them from the same company money and that does not diminish the vl credibility of the report.</p>
<p dir="ltr">I think we may be introducing so much unrealistic examples in this process.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Regards</p>
<p dir="ltr">sent from Google nexus 4<br>
kindly excuse brevity and typos.</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 23 Mar 2015 12:40, "Carrie" <<a href="mailto:carriedev@gmail.com">carriedev@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto"><div>The fact that ICANN's Board oversees the audit is a statement that the audit is NOT an independent independent audit. Does ICANN pay for that audit too? I expect they do hence people that pay tend to get the results they seek so from the contractor wanting more work hence the question of the auditing entity, do they do work for Board members and other related affiliates and associations too.</div><div> </div><div>Sincerely</div><div>Carrie Devorah</div><div><a href="http://Www.centerforcopyrightintrgrity.com" target="_blank">Www.centerforcopyrightintrgrity.com</a> <br><br>Sent from my iPhone</div><div><br>On Mar 23, 2015, at 5:46 AM, "Paul Rosenzweig" <<a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com" target="_blank">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><a name="14c466f4758134b8__MailEndCompose"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Thanks. I did mean something more, but I appreciate the pointer …<u></u><u></u></span></a></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">P<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Paul Rosenzweig<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweigesq@redbranchconsulting.com" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0563c1">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">O: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20547-0660" value="+12025470660" target="_blank">+1 (202) 547-0660</a><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">M: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20329-9650" value="+12023299650" target="_blank">+1 (202) 329-9650</a><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">VOIP: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20738-1739" value="+12027381739" target="_blank">+1 (202) 738-1739</a><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Skype: paul.rosenzweig1066<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><a href="http://www.redbranchconsulting.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=19&Itemid=9" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0563c1">Link to my PGP Key</span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><a href="http://www.rsaconference.com/events/us15/register?utm_source=inhouse&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=signature-us2015" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d;text-decoration:none"><image002.jpg></span></a><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> Samantha Eisner [<a href="mailto:Samantha.Eisner@icann.org" target="_blank">mailto:Samantha.Eisner@icann.org</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2015 5:30 AM<br><b>To:</b> Paul Rosenzweig; 'Jordan Carter'; 'Arun Sukumar'<br><b>Cc:</b> 'Accountability Cross Community'<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Meeting with CCWG Advisors<u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Hi Paul - <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">I recognize that you may be discussing a different type of audit than a straight audit of financials, but I thought it was of value to point out that ICANN has, for many years, been subject to an audit of its financial records performed by an independent auditor. Each year’s audited financial statements is available from the ICANN historical financials page at <a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/historical-en" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/governance/historical-en</a>. The ICANN Board’s Audit Committee oversees the auditor selection and reporting process. <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">In addition, to the extent the surplus you raise is then placed into a reserve fund, principles for the management of the operating fund and reserve fund are included within ICANN’s investment policy (<a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/investment-policy-2014-07-30-en?routing_type=path" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/investment-policy-2014-07-30-en?routing_type=path</a>), which is regularly reviewed. <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Best, <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Sam<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From: </span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">Paul Rosenzweig <<a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com" target="_blank">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a>><br><b>Date: </b>Sunday, March 22, 2015 at 12:57 PM<br><b>To: </b>'Jordan Carter' <<a href="mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz" target="_blank">jordan@internetnz.net.nz</a>>, 'Arun Sukumar' <<a href="mailto:arun.sukumar@nludelhi.ac.in" target="_blank">arun.sukumar@nludelhi.ac.in</a>><br><b>Cc: </b>'Accountability Cross Community' <<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Meeting with CCWG Advisors<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p></div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Dear Jordan</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">This is a very useful point – one, that I’ve been making in other contexts for a while. Two things we should consider requiring:</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Conduct and publicly release a five-year forensic audit. Before entrusting ICANN with greater autonomy, it should provide evidence that its financial and management decisions have been sound and comport with accepted business practices.</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Conduct an annual outside audit. ICANN should be required to contract with an internationally recognized auditing firm (such as Deloitte, Dettica, PricewaterhouseCoopers, Ernst & Young, or KPMG) to conduct and publicly release an annual audit of the organizations. The costs should be paid by ICANN and the new IANA consortium and the auditing firm should be eligible only if it does not have a pre-existing contract with ICANN.</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">One other point: If, as seems to be the case, ICANN’s current fee structure creates an excess of income over expenses, thought should be given to requiring a rebate of some sort --- it is not wise for a “non-profit” to routinely run a surplus as that will be an inducement to expand the mission into new areas where the $ can usefully be spent.</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Paul</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Paul Rosenzweig</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweigesq@redbranchconsulting.com" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563c1">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</span></a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">O: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20547-0660" value="+12025470660" target="_blank">+1 (202) 547-0660</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">M: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20329-9650" value="+12023299650" target="_blank">+1 (202) 329-9650</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">VOIP: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20738-1739" value="+12027381739" target="_blank">+1 (202) 738-1739</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Skype: paul.rosenzweig1066</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><a href="http://www.redbranchconsulting.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=19&Itemid=9" target="_blank"><span style="color:#0563c1">Link to my PGP Key</span></a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><a href="http://www.rsaconference.com/events/us15/register?utm_source=inhouse&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=signature-us2015" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d;text-decoration:none"><image003.jpg></span></a><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f497d"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black"> Jordan Carter [<a href="mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz" target="_blank">mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz</a>] <br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, March 22, 2015 9:37 AM<br><b>To:</b> Arun Sukumar<br><b>Cc:</b> Accountability Cross Community<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Meeting with CCWG Advisors</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Another question which came up in the discussion this afternoon, is the question of "following the money" - what does economic influence translate into in terms of power within ICANN, and how is the CCWG taking account of this?<u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">It's an important question that I am not sure we've spent much time on yet.<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">bests<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Jordan<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">On 22 March 2015 at 11:34, Arun Sukumar <<a href="mailto:arun.sukumar@nludelhi.ac.in" target="_blank">arun.sukumar@nludelhi.ac.in</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></span></p><blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Valerie D'Costa, an advisor to the CCWG, raised a couple of interesting and important questions on process and substance. I hope this is a faithful reproduction. <u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">On process:<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">1. What should be the role of advisors? Should they offer advice on the basis of unanimity or "rough consensus", or just provide input independently? <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">2. Should advisors restrict their role to responding to questions that have been flagged by the CCWG and routed through the chairs? Or should they/ can they flag issues they feel are important - weighed from their expertise. <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">On substance:<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">1. How is the accountability process taking stock of the evolving "global internet community", given that it is going to be driven by numbers from the developing world? <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">2. Taking off from Q1, is the CCWG evaluating the future capacity of ICANN to be truly representative in the years to come?<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">arun</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888"> </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">-- </span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><div><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">-</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">@<a href="http://www.twitter.com/arunmsukumar" target="_blank">arunmsukumar</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">Senior Fellow, <a href="http://www.ccgdelhi.org" target="_blank">Centre for Communication Governance</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">National Law University, New Delhi</span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">Ph: <a href="tel:%2B91-9871943272" target="_blank">+91-9871943272</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="color:black"><br>_______________________________________________<br>Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org" target="_blank">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a><br><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community</a><u></u><u></u></span></p></blockquote></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><br><br clear="all"><u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">-- <u></u><u></u></span></p><div><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="color:black">Jordan Carter<br><br>Chief Executive <br><b>InternetNZ</b><br><br>04 495 2118 (office) | <a href="tel:%2B64%2021%20442%20649" value="+6421442649" target="_blank">+64 21 442 649</a> (mob)<br><a href="mailto:jordan@internetnz.net.nz" target="_blank">jordan@internetnz.net.nz</a><br>Skype: jordancarter<br><br><i>A better world through a better Internet </i><u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org" target="_blank">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a></span><br><span><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community</a></span><br></div></blockquote></div><br>_______________________________________________<br>
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