<div dir="ltr"><div>Dear Bruce</div><div><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font><p style="background:white;margin:0cm 0cm 0pt;line-height:normal;vertical-align:middle"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:14pt">This discussion is not productive .It may mislead every one</span></p><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font><p style="background:white;margin:0cm 0cm 0pt;line-height:normal;vertical-align:middle"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:14pt">The independent objector is a process that exist and has nothing to do
with IRP </span></p><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font><p style="background:white;margin:0cm 0cm 0pt;line-height:normal;vertical-align:middle"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:14pt">I suggest that we do not open a new chapter</span></p><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font><p style="background:white;margin:0cm 0cm 6.75pt;line-height:normal;vertical-align:middle"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:14pt">There is no
direct link between independent objector and community mechanism as sole member</span></p><p style="background:white;margin:0cm 0cm 6.75pt;line-height:normal;vertical-align:middle"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:14pt">Kavouss
</span></p><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font><p style="background:white;margin:0cm 0cm 6.75pt;line-height:normal;vertical-align:middle"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";font-size:14pt"> </span></p><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font><p style="margin:0cm 0cm 10pt"><span lang="EN-US" style="line-height:115%;font-size:14pt"><font color="#000000" face="Calibri"> </font></span></p><font color="#000000" face="Times New Roman" size="3">
</font></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2015-07-20 18:41 GMT+02:00 Greg Shatan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com" target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">A California unincorporated association does not have all the characteristics of a "body corporate" -- it really only has the two you mention: limited liability and legal personality, pursuant to the California Corporations Code (which also sets out the law on partnerships, so it's not just about corporations). </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">There are a number of ways in which a California UA differs from a corporation: it doesn't need to reserve a name or file incorporation papers or go through any process with the state to come into existence (it can simply "register," but that is not a requirement), it doesn't need formal articles of incorporation or bylaws, it has more limited recordkeeping and reporting requirements, etc.</div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg</div></font></span></div><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jul 20, 2015 at 12:17 PM, Nigel Roberts <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:nigel@channelisles.net" target="_blank">nigel@channelisles.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid">Clearly so.<br>
<br>
But I'm failing to see what the distinction is between a corporation, and an unincorporated body having all the characteristics of a body corporate (i.e. limited liability and separate legal personality).<br>
<br>
But this is perhaps a debate for off-list.<span><br>
<br>
On 07/20/2015 04:54 PM, Burr, Becky wrote:<br>
</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><span>
Nigel, US law on unincorporated bodies is very different from UK law.<br>
<br>
<br>
J. Beckwith Burr<br>
Neustar, Inc. / Deputy General Counsel and Chief Privacy Officer<br>
1775 Pennsylvania Avenue NW, Washington, DC 20006<br></span>
Office: <a href="tel:%2B%201.202.533.2932" target="_blank" value="+12025332932">+ 1.202.533.2932</a> Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B1.202.352.6367" target="_blank" value="+12023526367">+1.202.352.6367</a> /<br>
<a href="mailto:becky.burr@neustar.biz" target="_blank">becky.burr@neustar.biz</a> / <a href="http://www.neustar.biz" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">www.neustar.biz</a><span><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 7/17/15, 3:11 PM, "Nigel Roberts" <<a href="mailto:nigel@channelisles.net" target="_blank">nigel@channelisles.net</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><span>
OK.. this is interesting.<br>
<br>
It has the limited liability you previously talked about, agreed. I've<br>
read the section.<br>
<br>
But if it has legal personality, it is then a body corporate, and is no<br>
longer "unincorporated", surely?<br>
<br>
I'd like you, please, to point me to the section in the statute that<br>
states these kind of associations have legal personality, and construe<br>
it for me, please, since I'm obvious being dim. (It's quite possible we<br>
have different understandings of the term "legal personality" here.)<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 17/07/15 14:06, Greg Shatan wrote:<br>
</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid"><span>
Nigel,<br>
<br>
Disagree in part. A California UA does have legal personality and does<br>
have limited liability.<br>
<br>
Greg<br>
<br></span><span>
On Fri, Jul 17, 2015 at 8:58 AM, Nigel Roberts <<a href="mailto:nigel@channelisles.net" target="_blank">nigel@channelisles.net</a><br></span><span>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:nigel@channelisles.net" target="_blank">nigel@channelisles.net</a>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
Well, I've looked at the sections of California Law that we have<br>
been referred to.<br>
<br>
I see nothin in the California law that contradicts what I wrote<br>
below, with the single exception that, as previously noted,<br>
California statute adds the gloss of a limited version of limited<br>
liability to the common-law concept of unincorporated associations.<br>
<br>
Do you not agree that the reality is that a California UA does NOT<br>
have legal personality but DOES have a form of limited liability<br>
granted by statute?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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