<p dir="ltr">Sent from my Asus Zenfone2<br>
Kindly excuse brevity and typos.<br>
On 11 Oct 2015 15:10, &quot;Avri Doria&quot; &lt;<a href="mailto:avri@acm.org">avri@acm.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;.<br>
&gt; The  co-chairs read the signs, tell us where they think we are and we<br>
&gt; (or maybe the members) let them know if they got it right.<br>
&gt;<br>
SO:</p>
<p dir="ltr">Your statement above is consistent with what I have in mind when I pose the question; It&#39;s important to hear what the Co-Chairs are observing so we can be clear on what we already have consensus on, what is pending and their suggested approach on how to arrive at a workable solution that is roughly acceptable. </p>
<p dir="ltr">We have written so much, occasional observation(interpretation) of what has been discussed from Co-Chairs is important. We are heading into Dublin and I think it&#39;s important to have a clear idea of items we expect to completely resolve during the face2face.</p>
<p dir="ltr">&gt; Or at least that is how I thought it worked.<br>
&gt;</p>
<p dir="ltr">SO:<br>
I believe we are in agreement of how it works. I have the privilege of chairing within other organisations as well so I believe I have an idea of the role of Co-Chairs. </p>
<p dir="ltr">Regards<br></p>
<p dir="ltr">&gt; avri<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; On 11-Oct-15 00:47, Seun Ojedeji wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Hello Avri,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Thanks for your response, I will not really attempt to address your<br>
&gt; &gt; view so this does not distract from the essence of starting this thread.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; I think we have quite a number of differing individual opinion and it<br>
&gt; &gt; gets so high at times that we miss the directions from the Co-Chairs.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; I will really appreciate that the Co-Chairs specifically provide<br>
&gt; &gt; response to this question so we have an idea of what page we are<br>
&gt; &gt; officially at in this process.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Regards<br>
&gt; &gt; PS: Co-Chairs may also just put a stamp on what Avri has said if<br>
&gt; &gt; that&#39;s their understanding as well.<br>
&gt; &gt; Sent from my Asus Zenfone2<br>
&gt; &gt; Kindly excuse brevity and typos.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; On 10 Oct 2015 20:32, &quot;Avri Doria&quot; &lt;<a href="mailto:avri@acm.org">avri@acm.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt; &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:avri@acm.org">avri@acm.org</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     Hi,<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     (I know this was addressed to the co-chairs and i am not one, yet I<br>
&gt; &gt;     presume to have an opinion on the subject)<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     As far as I understood we are, in parallel:<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     a. analyzing  and trying to respond to the comments, including<br>
&gt; &gt;     those by<br>
&gt; &gt;     the Board, made about defects in explanation and design in the SM<br>
&gt; &gt;     model<br>
&gt; &gt;     of Draft 2<br>
&gt; &gt;     b. analyzing the MEM counter proposal made by the Board<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     I disagree with your claim that working on the SM model is<br>
&gt; &gt;     impractical.<br>
&gt; &gt;     It is still the model that responds to the largest number of community<br>
&gt; &gt;     concerns and best meets the CWG requirements.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     The suggestion by Steve D. is just that, a suggestion. I do not<br>
&gt; &gt;     believe<br>
&gt; &gt;     that there is a consensus in the group, at least not yet, about taking<br>
&gt; &gt;     that path.  Many, myself among them, have argued that we are not<br>
&gt; &gt;     comfortable with putting off the major accountability changes that are<br>
&gt; &gt;     required by the loss of NTIA. Yes, we need to prune and make sure that<br>
&gt; &gt;     the changes we work on are necessary for WS1, but given the<br>
&gt; &gt;     uncertainties about the post transition and any possible WS2, we must<br>
&gt; &gt;     make sure that the WS1 solution is sufficient.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     avri<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     On 10-Oct-15 14:53, Seun Ojedeji wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; Dear Co-Chairs,<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; FWIW, I think at this point, it will be good to have an<br>
&gt; &gt;     understanding<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; of where we are heading from the Co-Chairs. In some discussions it<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; seem we have understood and agreed that a model that implies a<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; structural change is impractical during this transition phase hence<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; the suggestion made by Steve.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; Yet in other discussions it seem we are going ahead with the<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; structural change model irrespective of the concerns raised from<br>
&gt; &gt;     parts<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; of the community and board.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; In other to prepare towards Dublin and contribute in a<br>
&gt; &gt;     meaningful way,<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; I think a summary of where we are presently and what is expected<br>
&gt; &gt;     to be<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; achieved in Dublin will be helpful. I apologise if this has already<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; been shared, and in that case a pointer will be appreciated.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; Regards<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; Sent from my Asus Zenfone2<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; Kindly excuse brevity and typos.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; On 10 Oct 2015 19:37, &quot;Stephen Deerhake&quot; &lt;<a href="mailto:sdeerhake@nic.as">sdeerhake@nic.as</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:sdeerhake@nic.as">sdeerhake@nic.as</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt; &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:sdeerhake@nic.as">sdeerhake@nic.as</a> &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:sdeerhake@nic.as">sdeerhake@nic.as</a>&gt;&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Paul,<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Perhaps the Board chair is articulating a minority viewpoint?<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Afterall, the<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Board will have to vote on the matter of sending/not sending the<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     output of<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     the CCWG on to NTIA.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Stephen Deerhake<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     -----Original Message-----<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     From: <a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     [mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org">accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org</a>&gt;&gt;] On<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Behalf Of Paul<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Rosenzweig<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Sent: Saturday, October 10, 2015 6:05 AM<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     To: &#39;Bruce Tonkin&#39; &lt;<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a>&gt;&gt;&gt;; &#39;Accountability Cross<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Community&#39; &lt;<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Subject: Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Blog post on the Accountability work<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     headed to<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Dublin<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     With respect Bruce, I share Anne&#39;s view that this is not<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     accurate.  The<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Board chair has stated unequivocally that the Board will not<br>
&gt; &gt;     submit a<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Membership based proposal.  That is contrary to the<br>
&gt; &gt;     statement that<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     the Board<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     will submit any proposal it receives from the CCWG &quot;as is.&quot;<br>
&gt; &gt;     That is<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     categorically ruling out one type of &quot;as is&quot; proposal.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     If you are seriously telling me that even after all this<br>
&gt; &gt;     back and<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     forth the<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Board actually would submit a &quot;Membership only&quot; based<br>
&gt; &gt;     proposal to<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     the NTIA<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     then I would respectfully say that the Board has done a very<br>
&gt; &gt;     poor<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     job of<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     communicating.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     So ... answer this question please as directly as you are<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     willing:  If,<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     today, the CCWG having considered but declined to accept the<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Board&#39;s input<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     were to submit a proposal based upon a Membership organization<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     would the<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Board transmit it to the NTIA as the ICANN proposal?<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Paul<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Paul Rosenzweig<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     <a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     O: +1 (202) 547-0660 &lt;tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20547-0660&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20547-0660&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     M: +1 (202) 329-9650 &lt;tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20329-9650&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20329-9650&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     VOIP: +1 (202) 738-1739 &lt;tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20738-1739&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Skype: paul.rosenzweig1066<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Link to my PGP Key<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     -----Original Message-----<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     From: Bruce Tonkin [mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au">Bruce.Tonkin@melbourneit.com.au</a>&gt;&gt;]<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Sent: Friday, October 9, 2015 10:03 PM<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     To: &#39;Accountability Cross Community&#39;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Subject: Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Blog post on the Accountability work<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     headed to<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Dublin<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Hello Paul,<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Regarding:<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;       <a href="https://www.icann.org/news/announcement-3-2015-02-12-en">https://www.icann.org/news/announcement-3-2015-02-12-en</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     The statement still holds.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     The Board has provided input on a draft document so far, and has<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     stated all<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     along that it would raise any concerns along the way and not<br>
&gt; &gt;     wait<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     for a<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     final proposal to raise any concerns.<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Regards,<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Bruce Tonkin<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     <a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;      <a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     <a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;      <a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community</a><br>
&gt; &gt;     &gt;<br>
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