<p dir="ltr">I think what Avri was pointing out was that there is undue discussion happening on a US based holiday which isn't the case for other nations, and I think she finds that unfair. <br>
I don't think she was being offensive. </p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On 20 Nov 2015 12:25, "Kavouss Arasteh" <<a href="mailto:kavouss.arasteh@gmail.com">kavouss.arasteh@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Avri,<br>
It is selfish that you said you do not worry about other Nations, holiday.<br>
Why other Nations should be worried about your holiday.<br>
This is offensive and humiliation<br>
Pls correct your statement before I escalate it to the highest level in the world including media<br>
Kavouss.<br>
<br>
.<br>
.<br>
.<br>
<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<br>
<br>
> On 19 Nov 2015, at 19:23, Avri Doria <<a href="mailto:avri@acm.org">avri@acm.org</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> Hi,<br>
><br>
> I would point out that we have not worried about other nations' holidays<br>
> quite as much as we seem to be worrying about this one.<br>
><br>
> Perhaps if we schedule it for the nether hours (0100 - 0600) in the<br>
> continental US, it won't interfere with anyone's holiday schedule.<br>
><br>
> avri<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
>> On 19-Nov-15 10:55, Paul Rosenzweig wrote:<br>
>> Nigel<br>
>><br>
>> I use "close to the border" to accommodate the possibility that our<br>
>> co-chairs, who are non-American, simply did not realize how utterly<br>
>> unrealistic that proposal is for a holiday meeting. I, for one, will not<br>
>> attend nor even consider attending and I'm on the borderline of urging my<br>
>> fellow Americans to boycott.<br>
>><br>
>> As for the broader point about the rapid pace of what we are doing, I<br>
>> actually have a bit of sympathy for the co-chairs. They are under immense<br>
>> pressure to keep this moving from ICANN and NTIA and they (and others in the<br>
>> community) are possessed of the mistaken belief that there is something<br>
>> magical about our current time line, as if failing to meet it will turn us<br>
>> all into pumpkins. As to =that= aspect of it, I agree with you that it is<br>
>> quite deliberate; quite exclusionary; and quite unfortunate.<br>
>><br>
>> To be candid, I would not object to the pace if I did not perceive that it<br>
>> was actually creating error -- error in process and error in substance. On<br>
>> the process side we have:<br>
>><br>
>> -- Cutting comment period from traditional 40 days to 21 (for a report that<br>
>> will SIGNIFICANTLY diverge from the two earlier drafts in many ways, thereby<br>
>> increasing, rather than decreasing the need for thoughtful review by the<br>
>> community);<br>
>> -- Reducing comment period for non-English speakers to 9 days;<br>
>> -- Effectively eliminating ability of dissenters to formally voice<br>
>> objections by scheduling.<br>
>><br>
>> On the substantive side we have:<br>
>> -- Put off development of the IRP ("the crown jewel" of our proposal) to a<br>
>> post-transition implementation team;<br>
>> -- Moved to finalize a draft report by TOMORROW 2359 UTC when there is still<br>
>> utter lack of consensus on two critical issues, viz:<br>
>> -- Role of GAC/ST-18<br>
>> -- Mission statement of ICANN (the "other critical pillar") of our<br>
>> proposal.<br>
>><br>
>> Perhaps these concerns can be fixed in the drafting, but I doubt it. We are<br>
>> now perilously close to acting in a way that calls the fundamental<br>
>> legitimacy of our work product into question. The phrase in carpentry is<br>
>> "measure twice; cut once"<br>
>><br>
>> I apologize to the list for the somewhat angry tone of this note -- but the<br>
>> Thanksgiving call proposal is for me just the straw that breaks the camel's<br>
>> back.<br>
>><br>
>> Paul<br>
>><br>
>> Paul Rosenzweig<br>
>> <a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a><br>
>> O: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20547-0660" value="+12025470660">+1 (202) 547-0660</a><br>
>> M: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20329-9650" value="+12023299650">+1 (202) 329-9650</a><br>
>> VOIP: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20738-1739" value="+12027381739">+1 (202) 738-1739</a><br>
>> Skype: paul.rosenzweig1066<br>
>> Link to my PGP Key<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> -----Original Message-----<br>
>> From: Nigel Roberts [mailto:<a href="mailto:nigel@channelisles.net">nigel@channelisles.net</a>]<br>
>> Sent: Thursday, November 19, 2015 9:48 AM<br>
>> To: <a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a><br>
>> Subject: Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Timeline and next steps (updated)<br>
>><br>
>> Paul<br>
>><br>
>> What do you mean 'close to the border'.<br>
>><br>
>> I know I'm only a Participant, and not a Member, but I don't care if its<br>
>> deliberate or not.<br>
>><br>
>> What matters is the EFFECT not the motivation.<br>
>><br>
>> So I say it *IS* exclusionary.<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Since, to borrow a phrase, "I have to work for a living".<br>
>> (In other words I have an already-scheduled meeting)<br>
>><br>
>> These deadlines are artificial, and DESIGNED to be exclusionary, so why are<br>
>> you surprised?<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>>> On 19/11/15 14:39, Paul Rosenzweig wrote:<br>
>>> Really? You are going to have a critical review call on Thanksgiving<br>
>>> day? I know this is a bit US-centric of me but this goes beyond the<br>
>>> bounds of my tolerance. I have no standing to object, but this is<br>
>>> pretty close to the border of being deliberately exclusionary.<br>
>>><br>
>>> Paul<br>
>>><br>
>>> Paul Rosenzweig<br>
>>><br>
>>> <a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com</a><br>
>>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:paul.rosenzweigesq@redbranchconsulting.com">paul.rosenzweigesq@redbranchconsulting.com</a>><br>
>>><br>
>>> O: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20547-0660" value="+12025470660">+1 (202) 547-0660</a><br>
>>><br>
>>> M: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20329-9650" value="+12023299650">+1 (202) 329-9650</a><br>
>>><br>
>>> VOIP: <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20738-1739" value="+12027381739">+1 (202) 738-1739</a><br>
>>><br>
>>> Skype: paul.rosenzweig1066<br>
>>><br>
>>> Link to my PGP Key<br>
>> <<a href="http://www.redbranchconsulting.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=articl" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.redbranchconsulting.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=articl</a><br>
>> e&id=19&Itemid=9><br>
>>> *From:*León Felipe Sánchez Ambía [mailto:<a href="mailto:leonfelipe@sanchez.mx">leonfelipe@sanchez.mx</a>]<br>
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, November 19, 2015 8:21 AM<br>
>>> *To:* Accountability Cross Community<br>
>>> <<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org">accountability-cross-community@icann.org</a>><br>
>>> *Cc:* cc staff all <<a href="mailto:cc-staff@lists.ibiblio.org">cc-staff@lists.ibiblio.org</a>><br>
>>> *Subject:* [CCWG-ACCT] Timeline and next steps (updated)<br>
>>><br>
>>> An earlier version of this email was sent mistakenly so please disregard<br>
>>> the earlier version and have this version as the final version.<br>
>>><br>
>>> =================<br>
>>><br>
>>> Dear all,<br>
>>><br>
>>> As indicated on call #68, we have designed a detailed roadmap of key<br>
>>> dates and milestones toward finalizing theThird Draft Proposal that we<br>
>>> invite you to read and mark in your calendars.<br>
>>><br>
>>> In order to meet our 30 November deadline, it will be important that we<br>
>>> all comply with this calendar of deliverables to ensure feedback and<br>
>>> edits are incorporated into the Third Proposal in a prompt and<br>
>>> appropriate fashion:<br>
>>><br>
>>> 20-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Full Proposal content is delivered to CCWG by 23:59 UTC<br>
>>><br>
>>> 21-23 Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> CCWG Co-Chairs and Rapporteurs gather feedback from Working Party<br>
>>> groups, legal counsel and Advisors<br>
>>><br>
>>> 23-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> CCWG final comments on Full Proposal content due by 23:59 UTC<br>
>>><br>
>>> 24-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Weekly call #69<br>
>>><br>
>>> 24-25-Nov 15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Back and forth and finalizing content with Co-Chairs, Writing team<br>
>>> holding the pen<br>
>>><br>
>>> 25-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Content due to translation / formatting by 23:59 UTC<br>
>>><br>
>>> 26-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Additional CCWG-ACCT call (call #70)<br>
>>><br>
>>> 30-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Begin Phase 2 of Consideration by Chartering Organizations<br>
>>><br>
>>> 30-Nov-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Begin professional proofreading/final editing<br>
>>><br>
>>> 12 -Dec-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Translations ready<br>
>>><br>
>>> 20-Dec-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Delivery of final proofreading/editing<br>
>>><br>
>>> 21-Dec-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> End of public comment and first close for Chartering Organizations to<br>
>>> indicate support for recommendations<br>
>>><br>
>>> 24-Dec-15<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> Staff summary of public comments and Chartering Organization support for<br>
>>> recommendation<br>
>>><br>
>>> Please note that in consideration of the work load, we recommend holding<br>
>>> an additional next week on Thursday 26 November at 14:00-16:00 UTC. For<br>
>>> US-based colleagues, the timeslot was selected so that it is early in<br>
>>> day for you in consideration of the U.S. holiday.<br>
>>><br>
>>> We recognize that we are operating under tight deadlines to produce our<br>
>>> Third Draft Proposal and as always, thank you for your cooperation and<br>
>>> hard work.<br>
>>><br>
>>> Best regards<br>
>>><br>
>>> Mathieu, Thomas, León<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>> Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list<br>
>>> <a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org</a><br>
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>> _______________________________________________<br>
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>><br>
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