<div dir="ltr">on what basis exploring the immunity of ICANN hampers multistakeholder model? And we have not even explored how ICANN accountability can be made better or worse if it receives immunity. We can't just shut down the conversation with presumptions. We need to explore this issue. </div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 19 December 2016 at 14:59, Nigel Roberts <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:nigel@channelisles.net" target="_blank">nigel@channelisles.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Phil is entirely correct.<br>
<br>
We have dedicated 20 years since the IFWP of 1998-9 to creating a multistakeholder model.<br>
<br>
We cannot seek to change that in pursuit of a perceived immunity that would make ICANN unaccountable.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 19/12/16 19:49, Phil Corwin wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
I believe that requesting views regarding “/providing possible<br>
jurisdictional immunity”/ are both misleading and outside the scope of<span class=""><br>
this WG.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
ICANN based upon the MSM is of necessity an entity that is private in<br>
nature in which civil society, academia, business, and other private<br>
parties formulate policy and governments have a secondary role to<br>
provide advice. The only entities I know other than nation-states that<br>
enjoy any degree of jurisdictional immunity are International<br>
Intergovernmental Organizations (IGOs) established by treaty, and in<br>
those organizations governments have the controlling role. Hence,<br>
pursuit of any type of jurisdictional immunity is equivalent to an<br>
effort to change the fundamental nature of ICANN, as well as being in<br>
violation of the key condition of the IANA transition, which is that<br>
ICANN would not become an IGO. In addition, providing ICANN with<br>
jurisdictional immunity would insulate it from legal process and hence<br>
undermine accountability.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Finally, as I know based upon my current tenure as Co-Chair of the WG<br>
looking at access to curative rights processes by IGOs, when we sought<br>
expert legal advice on the recognized scope of immunity for IGOs we<br>
learned that such immunity is not absolute and that the scope is based<br>
upon the specific fact situation involved as well as the national court<br>
in which the immunity is claimed. Hence, going down this road would<br>
require a tremendous amount of additional legal research dealing with a<br>
variety of hypothetical scenarios in separate national jurisdictions.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br></span>
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*From:*<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-co<wbr>mmunity-bounces@icann.org</a><br>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-c<wbr>ommunity-bounces@icann.org</a>] *On Behalf Of<br>
*parminder<br>
*Sent:* Monday, December 19, 2016 8:10 AM<br>
*To:* <a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-community<wbr>@icann.org</a><br>
*Subject:* Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Jurisdiction Proposed Questions and Poll Results<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Saturday 17 December 2016 12:40 AM, Mueller, Milton L wrote:<br>
<br>
SNIP<br>
<br>
John Laprise's wording was much, much better:<br>
<br>
"What are the advantages or disadvantages, if any, relating to changing ICANN’s jurisdiction*, particularly with regard to the actual operation of ICANN’s policies and accountability mechanisms?"<br>
<br>
<br>
This formulation does not include possibilities of jurisdictional immunity.<br>
<br>
Something like<br>
<br>
<br></span>
"What are the advantages or disadvantages, if any, relating to changing ICANN’s jurisdiction*, */or providing possible jurisdictional immunity,/* particularly with regard to the actual operation of ICANN’s policies and accountability mechanisms?"<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
would be better.<br>
<br>
parminder<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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