<div dir="ltr">I am afraid the jurisdictional problems that are faced by certain users located in certain countries are not hypothetical. They are real problems. As we know about the case of .IR was a very serious case, and it is still dragging .... how much uncertainty.IR registrants who are mainly from the private sector should go through? Why? And it happened because of ICANN jurisdiction nothing else. I am not for discussions about changing ICANN's incorporation. But immunity I believe should be discussed. If you don't see the problem, it does not mean it does not exist. The reason it seems like it is not the problem is that those who face them don't know where to go to raise it! </div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 19 December 2016 at 14:49, Phil Corwin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:psc@vlaw-dc.com" target="_blank">psc@vlaw-dc.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="white" lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div class="m_-1798115635396776285WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I believe that requesting views regarding “<i>providing possible jurisdictional immunity”</i> are both misleading and outside the scope of this WG.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">ICANN based upon the MSM is of necessity an entity that is private in nature in which civil society, academia, business, and other private parties formulate
policy and governments have a secondary role to provide advice. The only entities I know other than nation-states that enjoy any degree of jurisdictional immunity are International Intergovernmental Organizations (IGOs) established by treaty, and in those
organizations governments have the controlling role. Hence, pursuit of any type of jurisdictional immunity is equivalent to an effort to change the fundamental nature of ICANN, as well as being in violation of the key condition of the IANA transition, which
is that ICANN would not become an IGO. In addition, providing ICANN with jurisdictional immunity would insulate it from legal process and hence undermine accountability.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Finally, as I know based upon my current tenure as Co-Chair of the WG looking at access to curative rights processes by IGOs, when we sought expert legal advice
on the recognized scope of immunity for IGOs we learned that such immunity is not absolute and that the scope is based upon the specific fact situation involved as well as the national court in which the immunity is claimed. Hence, going down this road would
require a tremendous amount of additional legal research dealing with a variety of hypothetical scenarios in separate national jurisdictions.
<u></u><u></u></span></p><span class="">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">Philip S. Corwin, Founding Principal</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">Virtualaw LLC</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">1155 F Street, NW</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">Suite 1050</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">Washington, DC 20004</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">202-559-8597/Direct</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">202-559-8750/Fax</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">202-255-6172/Cell</span></b><b><span style="color:navy"><u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy"><u></u> <u></u></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">Twitter: @VlawDC</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:navy">"Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey</span></i></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</span><div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext"> <a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-<wbr>community-bounces@icann.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-<wbr>community-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>parminder<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, December 19, 2016 8:10 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:accountability-cross-community@icann.org" target="_blank">accountability-cross-<wbr>community@icann.org</a><span class=""><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Jurisdiction Proposed Questions and Poll Results<u></u><u></u></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Saturday 17 December 2016 12:40 AM, Mueller, Milton L wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div><div><div class="h5">
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<pre>SNIP <u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>John Laprise's wording was much, much better: <u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>"What are the advantages or disadvantages, if any, relating to changing ICANN’s jurisdiction*, particularly with regard to the actual operation of ICANN’s policies and accountability mechanisms?"<u></u><u></u></pre>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
This formulation does not include possibilities of jurisdictional immunity. <br>
<br>
Something like <br>
<br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<pre>"What are the advantages or disadvantages, if any, relating to changing ICANN’s jurisdiction*, <b><i>or providing possible jurisdictional immunity,</i></b> particularly with regard to the actual operation of ICANN’s policies and accountability mechanisms?"<u></u><u></u></pre>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
would be better.<br>
<br>
parminder <br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<pre><u></u> <u></u></pre>
<pre>______________________________<wbr>_________________<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org" target="_blank">Accountability-Cross-<wbr>Community@icann.org</a><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/accountability-cross-<wbr>community</a><u></u><u></u></pre>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div></div><div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center">
<hr size="1" width="100%" noshade style="color:#a0a0a0" align="center">
</div><span class="">
<p class="MsoNormal">No virus found in this message.<br>
Checked by AVG - <a href="http://www.avg.com" target="_blank">www.avg.com</a><br>
Version: 2016.0.7924 / Virus Database: 4664/13557 - Release Date: 12/08/16<br>
Internal Virus Database is out of date.<u></u><u></u></p>
</span></div>
</div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Accountability-Cross-Community mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Accountability-Cross-Community@icann.org">Accountability-Cross-<wbr>Community@icann.org</a><br>
<a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/accountability-cross-community" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/accountability-cross-<wbr>community</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Farzaneh </div>
</div>