[bc-gnso] ICANN hearings

Smith, Bill bill.smith at paypal-inc.com
Thu Dec 8 16:41:08 UTC 2011

Predictable statements, predictable replies.

On Dec 8, 2011, at 11:00 AM, "Phil Corwin" <psc at vlaw-dc.com<mailto:psc at vlaw-dc.com>> wrote:

Hearing started 10:45 and will end at 11:50 – not a whole lot of time for questioning.

Philip S. Corwin, Founding Principal
Virtualaw LLC
1155 F Street, NW
Suite 1050
Washington, DC 20004

"Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey

From: owner-bc-gnso at icann.org<mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org> [mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org] On Behalf Of Michael D. Palage
Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2011 10:26 AM
To: john at crediblecontext.com<mailto:john at crediblecontext.com>; 'Smith, Bill'; mike at rodenbaugh.com<mailto:mike at rodenbaugh.com>
Cc: 'Mike Roberts'; 'bc - GNSO list'
Subject: RE: [bc-gnso] ICANN hearings

They were delayed by an hour

From: owner-bc-gnso at icann.org<mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org> [mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org]<mailto:[mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org]> On Behalf Of john at crediblecontext.com<mailto:john at crediblecontext.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2011 10:12 AM
To: Smith, Bill; mike at rodenbaugh.com<mailto:mike at rodenbaugh.com>
Cc: Mike Roberts; bc - GNSO list
Subject: RE: [bc-gnso] ICANN hearings

Is this hearing being webcast?

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [bc-gnso] ICANN hearings
From: "Smith, Bill" <bill.smith at paypal-inc.com<mailto:bill.smith at paypal-inc.com>>
Date: Thu, December 08, 2011 5:58 am
To: "mike at rodenbaugh.com<mailto:mike at rodenbaugh.com>" <mike at rodenbaugh.com<mailto:mike at rodenbaugh.com>>
Cc: Mike Roberts <mmr at darwin.ptvy.ca.us<mailto:mmr at darwin.ptvy.ca.us>>, bc - GNSO list
<bc-gnso at icann.org<mailto:bc-gnso at icann.org>>

I've always maintained that it is easy to tell when you have consensus, for any reasonable definition of consensus. Given the continued disagreement, discussion, and debate regarding new gTLDs, it doesn't appear that we have consensus. If we did, I believe we'd see more head nodding and much less talking. Even here in the BC, we have discussed and submitted suggestions for "improvement" to the new system.

That's not a consensus agreement but something more like what was described in an earlier message that went something like this; if new gTLDs are a fait a complit, it's better that we help eliminate the worst aspects and improve it as best we can. That's fatalism, not consensus.

While ICANN claims to be a bottoms-up, consensus-based, multi-stakeholder organization, it has yet to navigate the difficult waters of actually become the organization it professes to be. In terms of consensus, as far as I know a simple majority in each of ICANN's constituencies would be sufficient to declare consensus, by a strict definition, on any issue at the GNSO Council. The vote would be unanimous.

So if our definition of consensus is a simple majority of those voting, ICANN is consensus-based. But if our definition is closer to unanimity, or lack of sustained, substantial objection by more than an insignificant minority, we don't have a consensus decision.

I'd be hard-pressed to sit before Congress and declare that we have reached consensus.

On Dec 7, 2011, at 11:37 PM, "icann at rodenbaugh.com<mailto:icann at rodenbaugh.com>" <icann at rodenbaugh.com<mailto:icann at rodenbaugh.com>> wrote:

> I disagree with your assessment of community support for the program. There
> was a supermajority vote which approved the new TLD principles, including
> support of the BC and IPC, because we believe that business users of the DNS
> would be better off with more domain name choices, more registration service
> providers, and IDN TLDs, . The ICANN Board was nearly unanimous in
> approving the current implementation plan. The BC is still in favor of new
> TLDs, even if we have some reservations about some of the implementation
> details. There is broad community support for them, even if there also
> remains some broad opposition from some business/IP groups who are noisily
> repeating some of the arguments that have been made by the BC and others
> repeatedly for years.
> So, I am not clear about what you would like the BC to say publicly at this
> point, perhaps you could circulate a draft?
> Thanks,
> Mike
> Mike Rodenbaugh
> tel/fax: +1.415.738.8087
> http://rodenbaugh.com
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-bc-gnso at icann.org<mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org> [mailto:owner-bc-gnso at icann.org] On Behalf Of
> Mike Roberts
> Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2011 2:38 PM
> To: bc - GNSO list
> Subject: [bc-gnso] ICANN hearings
> Reading over today's testimony, one can't help but have the feeling that
> ICANN is digging itself deeper and deeper into a bunker position from which
> it may not recover.
> I'm reminded of the gigantic underground cistern located near the Blue
> Mosque in Istanbul. Worth a trip if you haven't seen it.
> After the collapse of the Roman Empire, the Goths and so on came down the
> peninsula and ravaged the city. So walls were built. Then sieges were put
> in place and folks ran out of water. So at great expense the cistern was
> dug and covered over. Then longer sieges, etc. The invaders prevailed.
> The moral being that some ideas are so flawed that no amount of building
> walls thicker and cisterns deeper will carry the day.
> The Kurt Pritz testimony goes on for more than 15 pages trying to cover
> every possible contingency of bad behavior connected to new TLDs. And
> doesn't succeed.
> Even though the BC membership includes members with multiple relationships
> to ICANN, some of which are linked to proposed new TLDs, the core rationale
> for our constituency is to represent business users of the Domain Name
> System. Setting aside IDNs, which have their own rationale, I haven't seen
> any enthusiasm for new TLDs among users, and most of us have been opposed
> but willing to work on the details with ICANN because that seemed better
> than letting it happen without any input from us. What we have gotten for
> our trouble is Kurt claiming in his testimony that there is broad community
> support for new TLDs. That has never been the case.
> The ever greater accretion of protective bureaucracy to the program has
> produced a balance of costs and benefits - in the broad sense, including
> more than dollars and cents - that is seriously out of whack. It's time
> for us to acknowledge this, and say so publicly.
> - Mike

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