[ccPDP4-IDNWG] NOTES | ccPDP4 IDN (full) WG and DES SG | 15 February 2022 (13:00 UT)
Joke Braeken
joke.braeken at icann.org
Tue Feb 15 14:31:28 UTC 2022
NOTES | ccPDP4 IDN (full) WG and DES SG | 15 February 2022 (13:00 UT)
1. Welcome
Welcome by Kenny Huang (.tw) Chair
2. Administrative matters
2.a. Formation of Confusing Similarities / leadership | 29 March kick-off 13:00 UTC
How many volunteers to date?
Kim displays a slide in zoom with the list of members to date, which Bart reads out loud
Kenny welcomes all that already stepped forward, and invites those interested to let the Secretariat know they wish to join
Anil: endorses the call by Kenny
Kenny: need to confirm the leader position now?
Bart: Svitlana is available as Vice Chair. We still need a Chair. Let’s defer to the first meeting by the subgroup. Volunteers are still welcome. Self-nomination or nomination by subgroup members, needs to be confirmed by Kenny and Anil as leaders of the ccPDP4-IDN full group.
Anil: deadline to (self)-nominate for the leadership position?
Kenny: deadline is the first meeting by the subgroup, on 29 March at 13 UTC.
2.b. ICANN73 – update to the community/GAC
Joint meeting between ccNSO and GAC. Tuesday, 8 March, 13:00-14:00 UTC as part of ICANN73.
Aim is to share progress to date, and to give a teaser for the more extensive session on ccPDP at the policy forum in June (ICANN74)
Link to public schedule: https://73.schedule.icann.org/meetings/RGsyFbNRyJjPpiDNh
By then the DS and main group have been completed, by then the VM-subgroups and CS-subgroups will be finalizing their work too.
Anil: Shall we now discuss the possible way to approach a joint meeting? The slides we intend to present? Perhaps get input from the entire WG on the proposed approach?
Bart: let’s use the basic overview of the subgroups. The subgroups will each have a slide, with the topics they will discuss or have discussed. We have 10 min time for this, so it will be a high level overview of the work to date. E.g. VM subgroup is still discussing. Proposal is to use the RZ-LGR to allow variants. Subgroup is still discussing. The DS will hopefully be done by ICANN73. Allude to the trigger events, indicate that there is a direct link with the retirement policy. Note the way it has been incorporated in the final doc. The CS-subgroup will kick off in March. As a next step, GAC will be informed there will be a more extensive session at ICANN74 in preparation for the public comments.
Explain the structure, explain the link with the EPDP effort. But also allude to the limitation of the ccPDP. This is about top levels, not second level domains.
Kenny: agrees. Also touch on the way we work with GNSO and see if we can synchronize.
Anil: agrees, thank you
3. Introduce Deselection Proposal – first reading
Explanation of recommendations
Seek feedback and input
Anil: thanks to all for joining the discussion today. DS subgroup and the full group meet today.
Slides gives an overview of how the retirement process of ccTLDs work. The DS subgroup needs to define the trigger event for an IDN ccTLD retirement.
High-level overview of ccTLD retirement process: Once there is a trigger event, the IANA Functions Operator sends a notice of retirement to the ccTLD Manager, with an invitation to discuss a retirement plan. The removal of the ccTLD from the root zone is foreseen to happen 5 years after the retirement notice. The ccTLD manager - together with PTI - can potentially agree to extend this deadline, with an additional 5 years.
Anil gives an overview of the relevant IDN ccTLD selection criteria, and the potential events, and the administrative matters by the DS-subgroup. The group kicked off on 28 Sept 2021. 7 meetings since then. Input by Sarmad and Jaap has been very helpful to the subgroup. Membership of the subgroup is listed on the final slide
Bart talks about what the DS-group will be proposing. Table of contents of the basic doc that the full group agreed on in September 2021.
Overall policy for IDN ccTLD selection builds on the input by the subgroups, feeding into the main document.
>>>> Section 0.
What happens once the name of a country is removed? The name of the territory itself. This is different than the removal of the name of the country code. 2 situations:
* Name changed drastically. E.g. Birma became Myamar (70ies)
* When a country dissolves. E.g. Netherlands Antilles no longer exist in and were replaced in 2010 with Aruba, Caracao, Sint Maarten and 3 municipalities. Other example: Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia
Any questions or comments on the text of this section?
None
Anna: when the territory is removed, can the name be used by another country?
Bart: once the name of the territory is gone, it is gone. Is a geopolitical question
Refers to a book on the history of countries and how they evolve. Best example is the Kingdom of Burgundy. It vanished and reappeared again 8 times, always in a different location. Long-term geopolitical changes.
Jiankang: trigger event for deselection. Normal reference to RFC? Or many other RFCs? Show text later?
3rd table in the presentation. Item 6.1. Is this description appropriate? IDN standard updated in future, older name already allocated will still be available in the new standards. Even in future, new RFCs will never update RFC5890 or 5891. Not very clear. Refine this description in future.
Bart: fully agrees. Note that this is still under discussion with the VM-subgroup. Reason for including it: one of the criteria in the basic doc is that the ccTLD needs to abide by the technical criteria. This is not reflected in the basic doc yet. Awaits the proposal from the VM-group. This table is just an aid for the full group to understand how the criteria relate to each other.
Ram: Is Jiankang saying that we should not have just those rfcs change isn't enough to be a trigger event?
Bart: Yes, there are various events that could help. There is a clear technical recommendation issue documented - recommendation 7 by the Technical WG.
Ram: Since the rfcs will evolve over time
Jiankang: thanks. All clear
Bart: does the group support?
No red marks
Bart: we will revisit next time. But will skip the explanation at that time
Jiankang: hello Ram, yes, those rfc updates are not enough to trigger
Ram: good
>>>> Section 1.3
Bart: criteria. And then looking at the required documentation. That is the procedural aspect. The subgroup proposes an additional section on the de-selection of IDN ccTLDs. Meaningful representation of the name of the territory, expressed in a non-latin script. The DS-group dealt with 3 situations:
Change name territory itself. (full name, short name, short form designation)
Recap of all criteria. Basic mechanism and proposal by DS-subgroup
The subgroup identified: name of territory is included in iso 3166. Whether or not there is a significant name change in ENG or French, that has no impact on the deselecton. Consequence of the proposed mechanism in 1.3.1.
Jiankang: Only when new rfc which might make the old names to not be valid idn strings., but new idn standards if there are new rfcs will try to be back-compatible. That means that old names will be kept to be valid in the best effort when IDN standards are updated.
Bart: does the group support?
No red marks
We will revisit, with editorial changes (e.g. it stil says 3 to 4 months)
Bart: mechanism. Procedural solution to the issue.
Svitlana: repetition “if the time”
Bart: yes, needs to be revised
Svitlana: if the language is disappearing, the country can request to delete the IDN ccTLD?
Bart: yes, possible
Svitlana: is a trigger event?
Bart: is more forced. By mutual agreement. We could include it. To maintain the coherence of the system
Bart: do you support 1.3.2?
No red marks
Svitlana: why is must in capital? (In RFC capital MUST MAY have special meaning)
Bart: could be in lower case. No special reason.
Ana: kazakhstan was going to change its alphabet from cyrillic to latin.
Svitlana: same with the moldova language.
Bart: if they would have an IDN, it should be deselected. However, it is proposed not to actively police this. Intention is not enough. It really needs to happen.
Ana: if it would change from cyrillic to latin, they would probably have special characters
Bart: it is still a change of script. If that is the case, in principle it should be de-selected.
There are also other criteria for IDNs
Jaap: ISO list received a letter from Kazachstan that they wanted to change the country code. 1 or 2 years ago. Changing the K into a Q. that is not happening. After that, there has not been any further communication regarding this. The designated language is still russian and kazach. If they want to abolish the current script, ICANN will hear from gvt or ccTLD manager.
Bart: quite an undertaking to change scripts
Elements in bold to be included in the glossary
Svitlana: needs to be 3 months consistently
Bart: do you support the text 1.3.3?
No red marks
Bart: must is capitalized. No special meaning though.
What happens if the SIP no longer supports the originally selected string? We discussed one or 2 cases extensively. If, at one point, the SIP - including the gvt - no longer support the string, it should be retired. That has consequences. Same mechanism: it should come from the SIP and the timing for doing so, is when a request with such a statement is submitted. It always includes the gvt with respect to support
Svitlana: who sends the request for deletion?
Bart: this is not about delegation. Goes back to the original request of the IDN ccTLD, in all cases the gvt is involved.
Svitlana: now understands difference between deselection and the deleting
Bart: page 28. Long paragraph to be split in 2
Bart: do you support?
No red marks
Kenny: that concludes the first reading. We will do a 2nd reading next time
4. Next meetings
1 March | 13:00 UTC – Full Group and DES proposal second reading
8 March | 13:00-14:00 UTC – ICANN73 Joint meeting: ccNSO-GAC
22 March | 14:00 UTC – Variant Management SG
29 March | 13:00 UTC – Confusing Similarities SG Kick-off (timing and meeting cadence will be discussed)
Kenny: reminder that you can still apply to be a member of the CS-SG. Also, we welcome nominations for the role of Chair or Vice chair for this subgroup
5. AOB
none
6. Closure
Thank you all! bye
Joke Braeken
joke.braeken at icann.org
From: ccPDP4-IDNWG <ccpdp4-idnwg-bounces at icann.org> on behalf of ccPDP4-IDNWG <ccpdp4-idnwg at icann.org>
Reply to: Kimberly Carlson <kimberly.carlson at icann.org>
Date: Thursday, 10 February 2022 at 14:24
To: "ccpdp4-des-sg at icann.org" <ccpdp4-des-sg at icann.org>, ccPDP4-IDNWG <ccpdp4-idnwg at icann.org>
Subject: [ccPDP4-IDNWG] REMINDER: ccPDP4 IDN WG and DES SG teleconference | 15 February @13:00 UTC
Dear all,
As a reminder, the joint meeting: ccPDP4 IDN (full) WG and DES SG teleconference has been scheduled for 15 February at 13:00 UTC.
Please be aware, this meeting is expected to run over an hour – approximately 75 minutes in total.
Agenda:
1. Welcome
2. Administrative matters
Formation of Confusing Similarities / leadership
29 March kick-off 13:00 UTC
ICANN73 – update to the community/GAC
3. Introduce Deselection Proposal – first reading
Explanation of recommendations
Seek feedback and input
4. Next meetings:
1 March | 13:00 UTC – Full Group and DES proposal second reading
8 March | 13:00-14:00 UTC – ICANN73 Joint meeting: ccNSO-GAC
22 March | 14:00 UTC – Variant Management SG
29 March | 13:00 UTC – Confusing Similarities SG Kick-off (timing and meeting cadence will be discussed)
5. AOB
6. Closure
Please find the call details below:
Join Zoom Meeting
https://icann.zoom.us/j/92206360833?pwd=RXZ1VlorTXM4YmxSQ0F5S0VGRmxDQT09 [icann.zoom.us]<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/icann.zoom.us/j/92206360833?pwd=RXZ1VlorTXM4YmxSQ0F5S0VGRmxDQT09__;!!PtGJab4!orLRx4OrbHRKnm8x5wuh7PQkuX_w85F7ovaEaZ_KjXPhuRtCxidouYumXZ_cNrjjdAKnvxZ4$>
Meeting ID: 922 0636 0833
Passcode: PDP4-Feb15
Wiki: https://community.icann.org/x/lgQiCw
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