[ccwg-internet-governance] ccwg-internet-governance Digest, Vol 2, Issue 48

Stephanie Perrin stephanie.perrin at mail.utoronto.ca
Thu Jan 30 03:45:02 UTC 2014


I think that is an excellent definition, and it would be a mistake to try to make it more concise.
Stephanie Perrin
On 2014-01-29, at 5:41 PM, Phil Corwin wrote:

> My apologies for missing today's call. I had fully intended to participate but messed up the time conversion from UTC. In that regard, I would ask that initial notification of a call time and date be sent in a separate e-mail with a relevant subject header and not just mixed in with all the other e-mail traffic on this mailing list.
> 
> In regard to the question of defining ICANN for purposes of the CCWG Charter, I concur with Marilyn that the term should be regarded as encompassing the formal legal organization, its staff, and the participating community.
> 
> While the DNS is global in nature and ICANN has many international aspects to it -- including the board and staff composition, the GAC's participation, the makeup of the participating community, etc. -- it should not be referred to as an international organization. An "international organization" has a rather precise meaning (IGO or INGO) and ICANN does not fit it at this time -- see  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_organization . As a legal matter and as every contracted party and ICANN consultant knows, ICANN is a California non-profit corporation.
> 
> So one way to express this definition might be --  ICANN is a California non-profit corporation charged with technical coordination of the global domain name system. ICANN has offices around the globe and a Board and staff membership of international scope; its community is comprised of supporting organizations, advisory committees, and other individuals and entities whose makeup is likewise international in character.
> 
> I know that's a mouthful but I'm not sure that ICANN can be defined in a short catchphrase. 
> 
> Best regards.
> 
> Philip S. Corwin, Founding Principal
> Virtualaw LLC
> 1155 F Street, NW
> Suite 1050
> Washington, DC 20004
> 202-559-8597/Direct
> 202-559-8750/Fax
> 202-255-6172/cell
> 
> Twitter: @VlawDC
>  
> "Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org [mailto:ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of ccwg-internet-governance-request at icann.org
> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 4:06 PM
> To: ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> Subject: ccwg-internet-governance Digest, Vol 2, Issue 48
> 
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> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re: Group Charter - Definition (Ariel Manoff)
>   2. Re: Group Charter - Definition (Marilyn Cade)
>   3. Re: Group Charter - Definition (Michele Neylon - Blacknight)
>   4. Re: Group Charter - Definition (Michele Neylon - Blacknight)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 17:51:40 -0300
> From: "Ariel Manoff" <amanoff at vmf.com.ar>
> To: "'Michele Neylon - Blacknight'" <michele at blacknight.com>,
> 	<ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
> Subject: Re: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> Message-ID:
> 	<!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAKcI30+Zha1BkcLHDoLqgPXCgAAAEAAAAMEeUS9sP49BkQb7TxMiefoBAAAAAA==@vmf.com.ar>
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> I believe that the best definition for ICANN is "organization"- This word is used to designate complex entities that include multiple aspects We can say an "International Organization".
> 
> Hector
> 
> H?ctor Ariel Manoff
> Vitale, Manoff & Feilbogen
> Viamonte 1145 10? Piso
> C1053ABW Buenos Aires
> Rep?blica Argentina
> Te: (54-11) 4371-6100
> Fax: (54-11) 4371-6365
> E-mail: amanoff at vmf.com.ar
> Web: http://www.vmf.com.ar
> 
> 
> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org
> [mailto:ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org] En nombre de Michele Neylon - Blacknight Enviado el: mi?rcoles, 29 de enero de 2014 17:39
> Para: ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> Asunto: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> 
> All
> 
> In the draft charter the term "ICANN" appears several times.
> 
> On this evening's call I asked for clarification on this, as the term in of itself can be quite ambiguous.
> 
> Each of us has our own understanding of what ICANN is depending on what we're talking about or who we are talking to.
> 
> For an initiative with so many diverse groups etc., involved I feel it is important that we are clear about our usage of terminology and minimise the possible ambiguities.
> 
> So is ICANN?
> - the corporation (as Filiz pointed out, it can be sued and it can also enter into contracts)
> - ICANN Staff
> - ICANN the Community
> 
> Marilyn Cade picked up on this theme also and expanded on it. Her points were very valid and referred to the temporal nature of some elements, namely the Board and Staff have a certain degree of fluidity, while the Community doesn't.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Michele
> 
> 
> --
> Mr Michele Neylon
> Blacknight Solutions
> Hosting & Colocation, Domains
> http://www.blacknight.co/
> http://blog.blacknight.com/
> http://www.technology.ie
> Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
> Locall: 1850 929 929
> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
> Fax. +353 (0) 1 4811 763
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon
> -------------------------------
> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland  Company No.: 370845
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ccwg-internet-governance mailing list
> ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ccwg-internet-governance
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 16:02:44 -0500
> From: Marilyn Cade <marilynscade at hotmail.com>
> To: "amanoff at vmf.com.ar" <amanoff at vmf.com.ar>, "'Michele Neylon -
> 	Blacknight'"	<michele at blacknight.com>,
> 	"ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org"
> 	<ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
> Subject: Re: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> Message-ID: <BAY169-W122B8E7ADC9D2E6AF13CFD9D3AC0 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> 
> I will think more, but frankly, I spent a lot of time on this when I was on the President's Strategy Committee [PSC], ICANN must be the community. 
> NOT staff. NOT Board. 
> Community.
> 
> 
> 
>> From: amanoff at vmf.com.ar
>> To: michele at blacknight.com; ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
>> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 17:51:40 -0300
>> Subject: Re: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
>> 
>> I believe that the best definition for ICANN is "organization"- This word is
>> used to designate complex entities that include multiple aspects We can say
>> an "International Organization".
>> 
>> Hector
>> 
>> H?ctor Ariel Manoff
>> Vitale, Manoff & Feilbogen
>> Viamonte 1145 10? Piso
>> C1053ABW Buenos Aires
>> Rep?blica Argentina
>> Te: (54-11) 4371-6100
>> Fax: (54-11) 4371-6365
>> E-mail: amanoff at vmf.com.ar
>> Web: http://www.vmf.com.ar
>> 
>> 
>> -----Mensaje original-----
>> De: ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org
>> [mailto:ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org] En nombre de Michele
>> Neylon - Blacknight
>> Enviado el: mi?rcoles, 29 de enero de 2014 17:39
>> Para: ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
>> Asunto: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
>> 
>> All
>> 
>> In the draft charter the term "ICANN" appears several times.
>> 
>> On this evening's call I asked for clarification on this, as the term in of
>> itself can be quite ambiguous.
>> 
>> Each of us has our own understanding of what ICANN is depending on what
>> we're talking about or who we are talking to.
>> 
>> For an initiative with so many diverse groups etc., involved I feel it is
>> important that we are clear about our usage of terminology and minimise the
>> possible ambiguities.
>> 
>> So is ICANN?
>> - the corporation (as Filiz pointed out, it can be sued and it can also
>> enter into contracts)
>> - ICANN Staff
>> - ICANN the Community
>> 
>> Marilyn Cade picked up on this theme also and expanded on it. Her points
>> were very valid and referred to the temporal nature of some elements, namely
>> the Board and Staff have a certain degree of fluidity, while the Community
>> doesn't.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Michele
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Mr Michele Neylon
>> Blacknight Solutions
>> Hosting & Colocation, Domains
>> http://www.blacknight.co/
>> http://blog.blacknight.com/
>> http://www.technology.ie
>> Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
>> Locall: 1850 929 929
>> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
>> Fax. +353 (0) 1 4811 763
>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon
>> -------------------------------
>> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty
>> Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland  Company No.: 370845
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> ccwg-internet-governance mailing list
>> ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ccwg-internet-governance
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> Este mensaje no contiene virus ni malware porque la protecci?n de avast! Antivirus est? activa.
>> http://www.avast.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> ccwg-internet-governance mailing list
>> ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ccwg-internet-governance
> 		 	   		  
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> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 21:04:02 +0000
> From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele at blacknight.com>
> To: "amanoff at vmf.com.ar" <amanoff at vmf.com.ar>,
> 	"ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org"
> 	<ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
> Subject: Re: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> Message-ID:
> 	<D1AC4482BED7C04DAC43491E9A9DBEC3902052D2 at BK-EXCHMBX01.blacknight.local>
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Hector
> 
> There's a subtle, yet very important difference though.
> 
> And that's what we need to clarify
> 
> Regards
> 
> Michele
> 
> 
> --
> Mr Michele Neylon
> Blacknight Solutions
> Hosting & Colocation, Domains
> http://www.blacknight.co/
> http://blog.blacknight.com/
> http://www.technology.ie
> Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
> Locall: 1850 929 929
> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
> Fax. +353 (0) 1 4811 763
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon
> -------------------------------
> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty
> Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland  Company No.: 370845
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ariel Manoff [mailto:amanoff at vmf.com.ar] 
> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 8:52 PM
> To: Michele Neylon - Blacknight; ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> Subject: RE: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> 
> I believe that the best definition for ICANN is "organization"- This word is used to designate complex entities that include multiple aspects We can say an "International Organization".
> 
> Hector
> 
> H?ctor Ariel Manoff
> Vitale, Manoff & Feilbogen
> Viamonte 1145 10? Piso
> C1053ABW Buenos Aires
> Rep?blica Argentina
> Te: (54-11) 4371-6100
> Fax: (54-11) 4371-6365
> E-mail: amanoff at vmf.com.ar
> Web: http://www.vmf.com.ar
> 
> 
> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org
> [mailto:ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org] En nombre de Michele Neylon - Blacknight Enviado el: mi?rcoles, 29 de enero de 2014 17:39
> Para: ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> Asunto: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> 
> All
> 
> In the draft charter the term "ICANN" appears several times.
> 
> On this evening's call I asked for clarification on this, as the term in of itself can be quite ambiguous.
> 
> Each of us has our own understanding of what ICANN is depending on what we're talking about or who we are talking to.
> 
> For an initiative with so many diverse groups etc., involved I feel it is important that we are clear about our usage of terminology and minimise the possible ambiguities.
> 
> So is ICANN?
> - the corporation (as Filiz pointed out, it can be sued and it can also enter into contracts)
> - ICANN Staff
> - ICANN the Community
> 
> Marilyn Cade picked up on this theme also and expanded on it. Her points were very valid and referred to the temporal nature of some elements, namely the Board and Staff have a certain degree of fluidity, while the Community doesn't.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Michele
> 
> 
> --
> Mr Michele Neylon
> Blacknight Solutions
> Hosting & Colocation, Domains
> http://www.blacknight.co/
> http://blog.blacknight.com/
> http://www.technology.ie
> Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
> Locall: 1850 929 929
> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
> Fax. +353 (0) 1 4811 763
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon
> -------------------------------
> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland  Company No.: 370845
> 
> _______________________________________________
> ccwg-internet-governance mailing list
> ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ccwg-internet-governance
> 
> 
> ---
> Este mensaje no contiene virus ni malware porque la protecci?n de avast! Antivirus est? activa.
> http://www.avast.com
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 21:05:15 +0000
> From: Michele Neylon - Blacknight <michele at blacknight.com>
> To: Marilyn Cade <marilynscade at hotmail.com>, "amanoff at vmf.com.ar"
> 	<amanoff at vmf.com.ar>, "ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org"
> 	<ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
> Subject: Re: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> Message-ID:
> 	<D1AC4482BED7C04DAC43491E9A9DBEC3902052DE at BK-EXCHMBX01.blacknight.local>
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> 
> Marilyn
> 
> And I'd tend to agree with you, but my fear (or concern) is that unless it is clearly laid down in writing then it leaves it open to interpretation and potential abuse.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Michele
> 
> 
> --
> Mr Michele Neylon
> Blacknight Solutions
> Hosting & Colocation, Domains
> http://www.blacknight.co/
> http://blog.blacknight.com/
> http://www.technology.ie
> Intl. +353 (0) 59  9183072
> Locall: 1850 929 929
> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
> Fax. +353 (0) 1 4811 763
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon
> -------------------------------
> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty
> Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland  Company No.: 370845
> 
> From: Marilyn Cade [mailto:marilynscade at hotmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 9:03 PM
> To: amanoff at vmf.com.ar; Michele Neylon - Blacknight; ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org
> Subject: RE: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
> 
> 
> I will think more, but frankly, I spent a lot of time on this when I was on the President's Strategy Committee [PSC],
> 
> ICANN must be the community.
> 
> NOT staff. NOT Board.
> 
> Community.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> From: amanoff at vmf.com.ar<mailto:amanoff at vmf.com.ar>
>> To: michele at blacknight.com<mailto:michele at blacknight.com>; ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
>> Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2014 17:51:40 -0300
>> Subject: Re: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
>> 
>> I believe that the best definition for ICANN is "organization"- This word is
>> used to designate complex entities that include multiple aspects We can say
>> an "International Organization".
>> 
>> Hector
>> 
>> H?ctor Ariel Manoff
>> Vitale, Manoff & Feilbogen
>> Viamonte 1145 10? Piso
>> C1053ABW Buenos Aires
>> Rep?blica Argentina
>> Te: (54-11) 4371-6100
>> Fax: (54-11) 4371-6365
>> E-mail: amanoff at vmf.com.ar<mailto:amanoff at vmf.com.ar>
>> Web: http://www.vmf.com.ar
>> 
>> 
>> -----Mensaje original-----
>> De: ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org>
>> [mailto:ccwg-internet-governance-bounces at icann.org] En nombre de Michele
>> Neylon - Blacknight
>> Enviado el: mi?rcoles, 29 de enero de 2014 17:39
>> Para: ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
>> Asunto: [ccwg-internet-governance] Group Charter - Definition
>> 
>> All
>> 
>> In the draft charter the term "ICANN" appears several times.
>> 
>> On this evening's call I asked for clarification on this, as the term in of
>> itself can be quite ambiguous.
>> 
>> Each of us has our own understanding of what ICANN is depending on what
>> we're talking about or who we are talking to.
>> 
>> For an initiative with so many diverse groups etc., involved I feel it is
>> important that we are clear about our usage of terminology and minimise the
>> possible ambiguities.
>> 
>> So is ICANN?
>> - the corporation (as Filiz pointed out, it can be sued and it can also
>> enter into contracts)
>> - ICANN Staff
>> - ICANN the Community
>> 
>> Marilyn Cade picked up on this theme also and expanded on it. Her points
>> were very valid and referred to the temporal nature of some elements, namely
>> the Board and Staff have a certain degree of fluidity, while the Community
>> doesn't.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Michele
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Mr Michele Neylon
>> Blacknight Solutions
>> Hosting & Colocation, Domains
>> http://www.blacknight.co/
>> http://blog.blacknight.com/
>> http://www.technology.ie
>> Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072
>> Locall: 1850 929 929
>> Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090
>> Fax. +353 (0) 1 4811 763
>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/mneylon
>> -------------------------------
>> Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty
>> Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> ccwg-internet-governance mailing list
>> ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ccwg-internet-governance
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> Este mensaje no contiene virus ni malware porque la protecci?n de avast! Antivirus est? activa.
>> http://www.avast.com
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> ccwg-internet-governance mailing list
>> ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-internet-governance at icann.org>
>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ccwg-internet-governance
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