[ChineseGP] 答?: latest versions of CGP and JGP variant tables?
HiroHOTTA
hotta at jprs.co.jp
Fri Apr 24 08:50:25 UTC 2015
Dear Wang Wei,
On Fri, 24 Apr 2015 11:15:39 +0800
<wangwei at cnic.cn> wrote:
> Dear Hotta San, Dear All
>
> Yes, I think Yoneya' algorithm and terms work for us.
The above words ease me a lot:-)
> I think if everything goes smoothly, Han full-repertoire will be unified
> set = Chinese LGR-1 repertoire + Japanese LGR-1 repertoire + Korean LGR-1
> repertoire
agreed.
> Which means, Japanese LGR-1 doesn't have variants and basically accepts all
> the variants in Chinese LGR-1, and so do Korean LGR-1
> In that case, MSS will never be used.
confirmed. (my understanding was correct:-)
> MSS is defined as limited sub-set of CGP repertoire, which contains proposed
> variants and will be used to coordinate with J and K
confirmed. (my understanding was correct:-)
> It means, some specific code points in MSS, CGP might delete them or change
> their status according to the coordination result. (especially in the case
> like "机" and "機")
confirmed with thanks. (my understanding was correct:-)
> In that case, Han full-repertoire = Chinese LGR-2 repertoire + Japanese
> LGR-1 repertoire + Korean LGR-1 repertoire
here I understand that Chinese LGR-2 will be the same as Chinese
LGR-1 or just a small modification (if any) of Chinese LGR-1
depending on the requirements from J and/or K..
> Anyway, as Hotta mentioned, MSS is only an intermediate tool that is
> introduced to speed up Yoneya's algorithm.
confirmed. (my understanding was correct:-)
Thanks a lot, Wang wei.
Regards
Hiro
> Regards
> Wang Wei
>
> -----?件原件-----
> ?件人: hotta at jprs.co.jp [mailto:hotta at jprs.co.jp]
> ?送??: 2015年4月22日 13:23
> 收件人: 王?
> 抄送: KIM Kyongsok; Dongman Lee; Joe Zhang; Wang Wei; Kenny Huang; Yuri;
> Yoshiro YONEYA; Zhang Zhoucai; <qichao at cnnic.cn>; Zhiwei Yan;
> KoreanGP at icann.org; ChineseGP at icann.org; JapaneseGP at icann.org; ? ??; ???;
> ???
> 主?: Re: latest versions of CGP and JGP variant tables?
>
> Dear Wang Wei,
>
> I appreciate your effort in making the way easier and faster.
> I think I understand the purpose of the introduction of MSS, and you have my
> sympathy to some extent.
>
> Please see my observation and comments below.
> I need your and everybody's feedback.
>
> ===
>
> Here, let me use the technical terms in Yoneya's algorithm we tentatively
> agreed in Dallas.
>
> <premises>
>
> (1) Japanese LGR-1 definition is almost finished by JGP
> - Japanese LGR-1 repertoire : intersection of JPRS repertoire
> and MSR
> - Japanese LGR-1 variants : no variants
> - dispositions in Japanese LGR-1 : all characters in Japanese
> LGR-1 are 'allocatable'
> - Japanese LGR-1 WLE : no rules in WLE
>
> (2) JGP has tentatively decided that Japanese LGR-2 would basically
> accept all the variants defined in Chinese LGR-1 and Korean LGR-1
> (the appropriateness of this decision just needs to be confirmed
> after CGP and KGP define the variants)
>
> (3) Han full-repertoire = Chinese LGR-1 repertoire
> + Japanese LGR-1 repertoire
> + Korean LGR-1 repertoire
>
> <then let me conclude that>
>
> (A) Definition of MSS is not necessary for JGP.
>
> This is because
> - Japanese LGR-1 repertoire is already defined using JPRS
> repertoire and ICANN MSR
> - Japanese LGR-1 doesn't have variants
>
> To put it in the other way around, Japanese LGR-1 is not affected
> by the definition of MSS, no matter how MSS is defined.
>
> This means JGP does not object the current MSS proposal if (1)(2)(3)
> stand, no matter how MSS is defined.
>
> (B) Therefore, MSS can be defined as the union set of current MSS
> proposal and Japanese LGR-1 repertoire, if CGP and KGP also agree.
> And the definition of the variants within MSS can be discussed
> between CGP and KGP. JGP will observe the discussion and the
> result.
>
> Here, if Korean LGR-1 doesn't have variants and KGP decides to
> basically accept all the variants in Chinese LGR-1, it's pretty
> straight-forward to define the RootLGR Han variants, because
> variants are exactly the same as those defined in Chinese LGR-1.
>
> (C) JGP just wants to see the Han RootLGR repertoire and variants
> that can be automatically generated using Yoneya's algorithm and
> wants to confirm that there is no big problem in the generated
> Han RootLGR.
>
> (D) CGP's proposal using MSS seems to be an ingenuity to speed up and
> to avoid big backtrack of the LGR development, I think it works
> if C/J/K repertoires are defined soon (actually CGP and JGP have
> already defined their draft repertoire).
>
> (E) How about using Yoneya's algorithm and terms (such as LGR-1 and
> LGR-2) in explaining CJK activities and its output to the
> community and using MSS in speeding up the development?
>
> This is because
> - it is easier to understand
> - it looks more neutral/fair to all C, J, and K
> - MSS can be regarded as an intermediate tool that is introduced
> to speed up Yoneya's algorithm in the case CJK is confronting
> now.
>
> Regards,
> Hiro
>
> On Thu, 16 Apr 2015 23:38:18 +0800 (GMT+08:00)
> 王? <wangwei at cnic.cn> wrote:
> >
> > Dear All
> >
> > After the discussion in today‘s CGP meeting, Prof. ZHANG and Mr. QI Chao
> has produced a Minimum Shared Set (MSS) for C, J and K.
> >
> > The MSS is consisted of the following code point subset:
> >
> > A: IICore Base (9810, all fall in MSR)
> > B: Historically Registered Hanzi under .CN/TW/HK (7000/5292/4191, all
> > fall in MSR)
> > C: PRC National Normalized Hanzi along with their traditional variants
> > (8105/3489, some out of MSR)
> >
> > MSS=A+B+C-D-E
> >
> > D: code points in C, but not in MSR
> > E: Stroke or Radicals (31) LIDU?(5) Out of BMP(62)
> >
> >
> > finally, we got 12531 valid code points aggregate a Minimum Shared Set,
> based on which C, J and K could define their own variants, or adopt others
> variants.
> >
> > After all three GPs finish the variants generation and coordinaiton on
> > MSS, each GP still has the chance to add independent code points (with no
> variants) into MSS seperately, to from its own final repertoire.
> >
> > STEP1: MSS generated and accepted by three GPs, a mininum code points set
> shared by all of us.
> > STEP2: variants generated and coordinated based on MSS
> > STEP3: Add each GP's own independent and unrelated code points, form the
> final formal repertoire.
> >
> > Does this process work for you? please feel free to give your comments.
> >
> >
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > WANG Wei
> >
> > PS: special thanks for the hardwork of Mr. QI Chao
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----原始?件-----
> > ?件人: "KIM Kyongsok" <gimgs0 at gmail.com>
> > ?送??: 2015年4月16日 星期四
> > 收件人: "hotta at jprs.co.jp" <hotta at jprs.co.jp>
> > 抄送: "Wang Wei" <wangwei at cnic.cn>, "Dongman Lee" <dlee at cs.kaist.ac.kr>,
> > "Joe Zhang" <joezhang43 at hotmail.com>, "Wang Wei" <wangwei at cnnic.cn>,
> > "Kenny Huang" <huangksh at gmail.com>, Yuri <takamatsu at jprs.co.jp>,
> > "Yoshiro YONEYA" <yoshiro.yoneya at jprs.co.jp>, "Zhang Zhoucai"
> > <joe.zhang at unihan.com.cn>, "<qichao at cnnic.cn>" <qichao at cnnic.cn>,
> > "Zhiwei Yan" <yanzhiwei at cnnic.cn>, "KoreanGP at icann.org"
> > <KoreanGP at icann.org>, "ChineseGP at icann.org" <ChineseGP at icann.org>,
> > "JapaneseGP at icann.org" <JapaneseGP at icann.org>, "? ??"
> > <mjkim at kisa.or.kr>, "???" <isanjo at empas.com>, "???"
> > <partizan21 at naver.com>, "KIM Kyongsok" <gimgs0 at gmail.com>
> > 主?: latest versions of CGP and JGP variant tables?
> >
> >
> > Dear everybody:
> >
> >
> > KLGP is trying to prepare a repertoire and a variant table.
> >
> >
> > I would like to get the (or almost?) latest versions of CGP and JGP
> variant tables.
> >
> >
> > Thanks very much in advance.
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > ? ?? KIM, Kyongsok
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
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