<html><head><base href="x-msg://46/"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Thanks to all of you for the usual discussion. I would encourage you to continue it. Our next agenda has an item on JAS on it. We will have to try and decide on a way forward. Any discussion prior to the meeting that can help do that is useful.<div><br></div><div>Stéphane<br>
<br><div><div>Le 19 janv. 2011 à 22:25, carlos dionisio aguirre a écrit :</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div class="hmmessage" style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma; "><div><div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">I particularly believe: </font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">On a cross community Wg we have two chartering organizations, with equal capacities and possibilities to see, and to have opinion about the same object under discussion.</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">When the consensus is obtained, all works well.</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">The problem arise when we have two different and irreconcilable positions.</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">What are the solution for this cases?. </font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">The absense of operating principles and procedures for this Cross Community WG need to be solve for the future. JAS is a first example, but could be more in the future.</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">We can´t to ask opinion of the ICANN legal councilor in each opportunity that this cases happen, Or promote a second round of discussions after to be taken resolution?. </font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">On the other side, we need to accept the possibility of differents points of view. In fact inside our council the resolution was taken for the mayority, not for unanimity.</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">my two cents</font></div></div><h3 style="font-family: Tahoma; font-size: 10pt; "><font face="Verdana, Geneva, Arial, Sans-serif">Carlos Dionisio Aguirre</font></h3><div style="font-family: Tahoma; font-size: 10pt; ">NCA GNSO Council - ICANN<br>former ALAC member by LACRALO</div><div style="font-family: Tahoma; font-size: 10pt; ">Abogado - Especialista en Derecho de los Negocios</div><div style="font-family: Tahoma; font-size: 10pt; ">Sarmiento 71 - 4to. 18 Cordoba - Argentina -<br>*54-351-424-2123 / 423-5423<br><a href="http://ar.ageiadensi.org" target="_blank">http://ar.ageiadensi.org</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br></div><br><br><br><br><div id="SkyDrivePlaceholder" style="font-family: Tahoma; font-size: 10pt; "></div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> From:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:Jeff.Neuman@neustar.us">Jeff.Neuman@neustar.us</a></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> To:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:stephane.vangelder@indom.com">stephane.vangelder@indom.com</a>;<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:council@gnso.icann.org">council@gnso.icann.org</a></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> CC:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:ocl@gih.com">ocl@gih.com</a></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 09:38:42 -0500</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Subject: RE: [council] JAS</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> I do not believe option 2 will yield any real concrete results as like you say there is nothing in the bylaws that contemplates or discusses cross working groups. It would seem to me that a cross working group that operates under two separate charters ceases to be a cross working group and becomes two independent groups that may address some similar topics.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> I view number 1 as the only viable option if the nature of the cross working group is to survive here. However, I am not so sure that having 2 independent groups here is such a bad outcome.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> In my opinion, we cannot be bullied into accepting a charter proposed/adopted by another group when the charter approved by the other group addressing topics beyond the scope of the GNSO simply to keep the cross working group. That sets a really bad precedent.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Jeffrey J. Neuman<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Neustar, Inc. / Vice President, Law & Policy</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> The information contained in this e-mail message is intended only for the use of the recipient(s) named above and may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient you have received this e-mail message in error and any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete the original message.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> -----Original Message-----</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> From:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:owner-council@gnso.icann.org">owner-council@gnso.icann.org</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[mailto:owner-council@gnso.icann.org] On Behalf Of Stéphane Van Gelder</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2011 9:29 AM</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> To: GNSO Council</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Cc: Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Subject: [council] JAS</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Councillors,</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> FYI, ALAC Chair Olivier Crépin Leblond has reached out to me to discuss the JAS situation.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Unofficially, because this has not been ratified by ALAC yet, it is looking unlikely that they will accept our modified charter.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Some within ALAC are calling for either the version of the charter that was approved by ALAC to be maintained, or for the JAS group to work under 2 separate charters.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> The second option seems surreal to me, and what I communicated to Olivier is that I see two ways forward:</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> 1. ALAC and the GNSO sit down together and manage to find common ground on a mutually acceptable charter. This does present some complexities for us though, as any changes to the charter that we approved during our last teleconference meeting would no doubt need a new motion.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> 2. We both refer the problem to ICANN's general Counsel.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Because we are dealing with a cross community group and these do not really have any clearly defined status in ICANN at the moment, this problem is one that we may not feel confident to tackle alone, hence my second proposal.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> I will keep the Council informed of any further development on this front. Also, please note that an update from ALAC on the JAS situation is included in the agenda I have drafter for our next meeting. The Council leaders are currently working on this draft, which will then be submitted to the Council, as usual.</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Thanks,</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">> Stéphane</font><br><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Tahoma" size="2">><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></font><br></div></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>