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    Dear Alexander,<br>
    <br>
    how do you get around countering this type of gaming of the system?
    As several people have said from the experience of the current
    round, it's that the rich multinationals will find a way around
    restrictions, but local communities will find the restriction so
    hard to navigate that the restriction will eventually work against
    them. Short of a much more in depth and expensive due diligence
    process to find out who the real applicants are, I do not know how
    to check that.<br>
    Kindest regards,<br>
    <br>
    Olivier<br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 21/08/2018 15:49, Alexander Schubert
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
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        <p class="MsoNormal"><a name="_MailEndCompose"
            moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Well,
              <o:p></o:p></span></a></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">As
            I pointed out: you always find cheap office space in some
            small-city suburb of such “underserved area”, and cheap
            labor. So just a company registration, physical office and
            one or two employees: that costs less than US $5k per year.
            Easy to maintain 2 or 3 years – to fake “legitimacy”. Yes.
            If you are a billion dollar U.S. corporation and need office
            space in the prime business district of the capital and
            university degree top employees: that costs a LOT of money.
            But to fake a local operation – you do not need that. You
            rent a small “store” for US $50 per month and employ two
            part time secretaries – and voila: you have a local
            “operation”. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Alexander<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
            Maureen Hilyard [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:maureen.hilyard@gmail.com">mailto:maureen.hilyard@gmail.com</a>] <br>
            <b>Sent:</b> Dienstag, 21. August 2018 15:33<br>
            <b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin">alexander@schubert.berlin</a><br>
            <b>Cc:</b> CPWG <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org"><cpwg@icann.org></a><br>
            <b>Subject:</b> Re: [CPWG] [GTLD-WG]
            [registration-issues-wg] Subsequent Procedures<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal">So perhaps some criteria that clarifies a
            legitimate operation in an "underserved region" might be
            needed?<o:p></o:p></p>
        </div>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Aug 21, 2018 at 1:57 AM,
              Alexander Schubert <<a
                href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin" target="_blank"
                moz-do-not-send="true">alexander@schubert.berlin</a>>
              wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
            <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
              1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
              6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
              <p class="MsoNormal">Hi,<br>
                <br>
                Please have an eye on "potential abuse". While aiding
                "underserved areas" in and of itself is a noble course -
                please always factor in that this might get abused by
                tricksters.<br>
                <br>
                In the case of locally owned and operated geo-applicants
                for local geo-names: that's a good idea. But:<br>
                <br>
                There is precedence that "portfolio applicants" are
                utilizing offshore legal entities as applicant vehicles.
                So we can't simply offer "incentives" (e.g. reduced
                application fees; or applicant support) to entities
                based in certain jurisdictions per se.<br>
                <br>
                We had limited "abuse" in the 2012 round - because back
                then virtually nobody outside the inner ICANN circles
                was aware about the opportunity - and nobody imagined
                the fortunes that could be made (and in many cases WHERE
                made). This will radically change in 3 years when the
                2nd round launches. People will examine the fringe cases
                in the 2012 round - and create clever schemes to "make
                money fast".<br>
                <br>
                So the question: How exactly do we make sure that an
                application is a genuine "underserved area" operation?
                Just because they have a legal entity registered there,
                and rent a cheap shared office space and have two
                employees (for $US 150 each per month) sitting there
                staring holes into the wall?<br>
                <br>
                <br>
                Thanks,<br>
                <br>
                Alexander<o:p></o:p></p>
              <div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
                    <br>
                    <br>
                    <br>
                    -----Original Message-----<br>
                    From: GTLD-WG [mailto:<a
                      href="mailto:gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a>]
                    On Behalf Of Maureen Hilyard<br>
                    Sent: Dienstag, 21. August 2018 02:34<br>
                    To: Roberto Gaetano <<a
                      href="mailto:roberto_gaetano@hotmail.com"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">roberto_gaetano@hotmail.com</a>><br>
                    Cc: Holly Raiche <<a
                      href="mailto:h.raiche@internode.on.net"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">h.raiche@internode.on.net</a>>;
                    CPWG <<a href="mailto:cpwg@icann.org"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">cpwg@icann.org</a>>;
                    Christopher Wilkinson <<a
                      href="mailto:cw@christopherwilkinson.eu"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">cw@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>>;
                    Vanda Scartezini <<a
                      href="mailto:vanda.scartezini@gmail.com"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">vanda.scartezini@gmail.com</a>><br>
                    Subject: Re: [GTLD-WG] [CPWG]
                    [registration-issues-wg] Subsequent Procedures<br>
                    <br>
                    I agree Roberto about the differences in
                    "underserved" areas. Because they are on the outside
                    edge of the circle of developed and even developing
                    countries, there are specific reasons for their
                    "underserved-ness" which makes them different from
                    each other..<br>
                    <br>
                    When it comes to the next round, I agree that each
                    underserved region should really come up with a
                    business plan of its own in relation to how it can
                    make pertinent use of any new gTLDs.<br>
                    <br>
                    I look at my own region and we need to put a lot
                    more effort into our ISOC chapter and our Pacific
                    ALSes to help them understand what we are talking
                    about when we mention new gTLDs and other internet
                    governance issues that they need to know about if
                    our region is to make more meaningful and productive
                    use of the Internet.<br>
                    <br>
                    So little time and so much to do...<br>
                    <br>
                    M<br>
                    <br>
                    On Mon, Aug 20, 2018 at 8:00 AM, Roberto Gaetano
                    < <a href="mailto:roberto_gaetano@hotmail.com"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">roberto_gaetano@hotmail.com</a>>
                    wrote:<br>
                    <br>
                    > Maureen and Vanda,<br>
                    > I think that we all have ideas about how to
                    address some issues that <br>
                    > are related to the fact that there are some
                    underserved (so far) <br>
                    > geopolitical regions. As a matter of fact, if
                    we do a thorough <br>
                    > analysis the “underserved” areas are not only
                    geopolitical, but also of different kind.<br>
                    > The question is whether the next round does
                    have as objective to <br>
                    > address in priority these areas, or whether is
                    only based on <br>
                    > maximisation of the profit.<br>
                    > I remember a similar discussion 20+ years ago,
                    when I was working at <br>
                    > ETSI, about the coverage of the GMS in Africa.
                    The answer I got back <br>
                    > then is that “there is no business case in
                    Africa”. Seen in 2018, this <br>
                    > position is ridiculous, but aren’t we
                    reproducing the same cultural <br>
                    > pattern today with TLDs?<br>
                    > Cheers,<br>
                    > Roberto<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > On 08.08.2018, at 19:13, Maureen Hilyard <<a
                      href="mailto:maureen.hilyard@gmail.com"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">maureen.hilyard@gmail.com</a>><br>
                    > wrote:<br>
                    ><br>
                    > So - the point here is just one: MAKE HUGE
                    PROMOTION IN SOUTH <br>
                    > HEMISPHERE<br>
                    ><br>
                    > And focus on making a splash in the Pacific
                    region as well..<br>
                    ><br>
                    > On Wed, Aug 8, 2018 at 4:40 AM, Vanda
                    Scartezini < <br>
                    > <a href="mailto:vanda.scartezini@gmail.com"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">vanda.scartezini@gmail.com</a><br>
                    ><br>
                    > wrote:<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > Some comments on Christopher points<br>
                    ><br>
                    > a) Community Priority Evaluations<br>
                    > what was relevant during 2012 was the fact that
                    all the effort asked <br>
                    > for community to prove support ( ltos of money
                    to do this around the <br>
                    > world ) was ignored during the analysis period
                    and several community ( <br>
                    > I have promoted few) faced auction though their
                    competitors had no <br>
                    > prove of community interest.<br>
                    > Then, if we will impose some demands to
                    community we need to make sure <br>
                    > those items will be considered and none without
                    similar qualifications <br>
                    > will be compete with them.<br>
                    ><br>
                    > b)metrics<br>
                    > Metrics for end users are security, respect to
                    privacy and " continuity".<br>
                    > If organization has no capacity to support
                    initial investment so it <br>
                    > will fail in a couple years and all registrant
                    had done to promote the <br>
                    > new domain will be waste of money.<br>
                    ><br>
                    > I have been promoting here 2012 round. But it
                    was this, myself talking <br>
                    > with several organizations to enter. We had a
                    reasonable success but <br>
                    > the reality was there was NO PROMOTION of 2012
                    round in the South Hemisphere.<br>
                    > Nothing in digital news in local languages.
                    ICANN came one day to Sao <br>
                    > Paulo Brazil and I asked people to join - we
                    got 50 attendees . We had <br>
                    > 8 ( from<br>
                    > 11 applied in Brazil)  that attended this
                    meeting . Nothing else was <br>
                    > done in South America.<br>
                    > When I have done a survey in 2015 talking with
                    big companies around <br>
                    > South America I found just 1 that said they
                    have no intention to apply <br>
                    > if there was another round, all others
                    responded YES, they had <br>
                    > interest, please alert us, if there will be
                    another round.<br>
                    > So - the point here is just one: MAKE HUGE
                    PROMOTION IN SOUTH <br>
                    > HEMISPHERE<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Vanda Scartezini<br>
                    > Polo Consultores Associados<br>
                    > Av. Paulista 1159<o:p></o:p></p>
                </div>
              </div>
              <p class="MsoNormal">> <<a
href="https://maps.google.com/?q=Av.+Paulista+1159&entry=gmail&source=g"
                  target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://maps.google.com/?q=Av.+Paulista+1159&entry=gmail&source=g</a>>,
                <o:p></o:p></p>
              <div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">> cj<br>
                    > 1004<br>
                    > 01311-200- Sao Paulo, SP, Brazil<br>
                    > Land Line: +55 11 3266.6253<br>
                    > Mobile: + 55 11 98181.1464<br>
                    > Sorry for any typos.<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > On 8/8/18, 07:49, "GTLD-WG on behalf of
                    wilkinson christopher" < <br>
                    > <a
                      href="mailto:gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a>
                    on behalf of <br>
                    > <a href="mailto:cw@christopherwilkinson.eu"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">cw@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>>
                    wrote:<br>
                    ><br>
                    >    Good afternoon:<br>
                    ><br>
                    >    I generally concur with Holly's priorities
                    in addition to my <br>
                    > questions regarding Competition and
                    Jurisdiction.<br>
                    ><br>
                    >    Regards<br>
                    ><br>
                    >    CW<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > El 8 de agosto de 2018 a las 7:09 Holly Raiche
                    <<br>
                    ><br>
                    > <a href="mailto:h.raiche@internode.on.net"
                      moz-do-not-send="true">h.raiche@internode.on.net</a>>
                    escribió:<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > Folks<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Having gone through the Report and Appendix C,
                    the issues that ALAC<br>
                    ><br>
                    > has been concerned with before and - I am
                    suggesting - should <br>
                    > concentrate on in its response include:<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > Community Priority Evaluations<br>
                    > These applicants had priority, but the
                    definition was narrow and few<br>
                    ><br>
                    > applications made it through on this. The
                    definition needs to be <br>
                    > revisited, and the evaluation more transparent
                    and predictable- and <br>
                    > finalised BEFORE evaluation<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > Metrics<br>
                    > Unde the general heading, the question is asked
                    whether there should<br>
                    ><br>
                    > be success metrics.  We said - and I believe
                    should continue to say - <br>
                    > have metrics as to what success looks like from
                    an ALAC perspective.<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > PICS<br>
                    > Under global public interest, the question is
                    asked whether there<br>
                    ><br>
                    > should continue to be PICS.  They are there
                    because we argued for them <br>
                    > - and still should<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > Applications from outside the US/Europe We
                    expressed concern that most <br>
                    > of the applications came from the US<br>
                    ><br>
                    > and, to a lesser extent, Europe.  We said this
                    came down to a number <br>
                    > of factors, including<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Length and complexity of Applicant Guidebook -
                    it should be more<br>
                    ><br>
                    > accessible, comprehensible, in different
                    languages<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Need for applicant support - maybe a dedicated
                    round for developing<br>
                    ><br>
                    > countries<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Possibility of variable fees<br>
                    > IDNs<br>
                    > The report mentions need for further work to be
                    done on Universal<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Acceptance<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    > Happy to discuss<br>
                    ><br>
                    > Holly<br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ><br>
                    ></p>
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