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    <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Yes, sorry for
        innocently starting this up. But it has been interesting to see
        the level of interest. <br>
      </font></p>
    <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Marita</font><br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/26/2019 8:42 PM, Cheryl
      Langdon-Orr wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CADrRf+fQDOwU17next1YZGuBbdFThTompz_FB8dP_Mw03CAKfg@mail.gmail.com">
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      <div dir="auto">Well said JZ...</div>
      <br>
      <div class="gmail_quote">
        <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Apr 27, 2019, 04:11
          Jonathan Zuck <<a href="mailto:JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org"
            moz-do-not-send="true">JZuck@innovatorsnetwork.org</a>>
          wrote:<br>
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        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
          .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
          <div dir="ltr">
            <div
style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Folks,</div>
            <div
style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Let's
              table this discussion until we can have a more thorough
              exploration of the issues. Email is a terrible way in
              which to have such a discussion. Threads get lost, broken,
              etc. and everyone is looking at this from a very narrow
              perspective. We owe it to our constituency to take a
              broader view and to spend the time getting it right.</div>
            <div
style="font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;color:rgb(0,0,0)">Jonathan</div>
            <hr style="display:inline-block;width:98%">
            <div id="m_-4951197157332457627divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font
                style="font-size:11pt" face="Calibri, sans-serif"
                color="#000000"><b>From:</b> GTLD-WG <<a
                  href="mailto:gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org"
                  target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a>>
                on behalf of Maureen Hilyard <<a
                  href="mailto:maureen.hilyard@gmail.com"
                  target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">maureen.hilyard@gmail.com</a>><br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 26, 2019 1:27 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> George Kirikos<br>
                <b>Cc:</b> CPWG<br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [GTLD-WG] [CPWG] renewal of .org
                registry</font>
              <div> </div>
            </div>
            <div>
              <div dir="ltr">George
                <div><br>
                </div>
                <div>Are these end-user issues that apply to the comment
                  that the CPWG initially proposed to add to the
                  registry submissions about the pricing of domains? We
                  seem to have gotten a bit off track. </div>
                <div><br>
                </div>
                <div>Maureen<br>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </div>
              <br>
              <div class="m_-4951197157332457627x_gmail_quote">
                <div dir="ltr"
                  class="m_-4951197157332457627x_gmail_attr">On Fri, Apr
                  26, 2019 at 6:35 AM George Kirikos <<a
                    href="mailto:icann@leap.com" target="_blank"
                    rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">icann@leap.com</a>>
                  wrote:<br>
                </div>
                <blockquote class="m_-4951197157332457627x_gmail_quote"
                  style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
                  rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                  Hi folks,<br>
                  <br>
                  On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 11:57 AM Greg Shatan <<a
                    href="mailto:greg@isoc-ny.org" target="_blank"
                    rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">greg@isoc-ny.org</a>>
                  wrote:<br>
                  > Finally, this concern about protecting small
                  non-profits from paying big bucks for domain names
                  would seem a lot more genuine if it included support
                  for price caps in the resale market (i.e., the
                  secondary market or aftermarket).<br>
                  <br>
                  You're conflating 2 different issues, Greg. The
                  registry operators<br>
                  charge *fees* for registry services (i.e. managing a
                  central database,<br>
                  the zone file, the nameservers that spit back the
                  nameservers for the<br>
                  various domain names in that registry). The market
                  value of those<br>
                  services are below $1/yr/domain (e.g. 70 cents per
                  domain per year for<br>
                  the .IN ccTLD, as per their recent tender won by
                  Neustar).<br>
                  <br>
                  <a
                    href="http://domainincite.com/23976-neustar-completes-in-migration"
                    rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">http://domainincite.com/23976-neustar-completes-in-migration</a><br>
                  <br>
                  The secondary market or aftermarket is a marketplace
                  for the asset<br>
                  value of the domain names themselves, which is an
                  entirely different<br>
                  market than that for registry services.<br>
                  <br>
                  To understand this distinction, consider a trademark
                  registry, like<br>
                  the USPTO, which has a fee structure for the services
                  they provide for<br>
                  the registration and maintenance of trademarks. Those
                  fees are<br>
                  entirely unrelated to the value of the trademark
                  itself. A trademark<br>
                  owned by Google for "GOOGLE" or by Nike for "JUST DO
                  IT" has set fees,<br>
                  and Google or Nike are free to sell, assign, license,
                  etc. those<br>
                  trademarks to others at whatever the market will bear.
                  Companies like<br>
                  Hilco Streambank routinely auction off the IP of
                  companies, including<br>
                  their trademarks, see:<br>
                  <br>
                  <a href="https://www.hilcostreambank.com/closed-deals"
                    rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.hilcostreambank.com/closed-deals</a><br>
                  <br>
                  and of course, owners of TMs do these kinds of
                  transactions all the<br>
                  time. For example, Hooters sold their trademark for
                  $60 million.<br>
                  <br>
                  <a
href="https://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/stories/2001/04/09/story1.html"
                    rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/stories/2001/04/09/story1.html</a><br>
                  <br>
                  The same comparison exists for a land registry and
                  houses. Or a<br>
                  copyright registry, and the copyrighted works. The
                  story of the<br>
                  Beatles catalog makes interesting reading:<br>
                  <br>
                  <a
href="https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7662519/beatles-catalog-paul-mccartney-brief-history-ownership"
                    rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7662519/beatles-catalog-paul-mccartney-brief-history-ownership</a><br>
                  <br>
                  and that catalog only has value due to the copyrights
                  (once those<br>
                  copyrights expire, the works fall into the public
                  domain, and the<br>
                  works are free for everyone to use).<br>
                  <br>
                  Sincerely,<br>
                  <br>
                  George Kirikos<br>
                  416-588-0269<br>
                  <a href="http://www.leap.com/" rel="noreferrer
                    noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.leap.com/</a><br>
                  _______________________________________________<br>
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                  <a href="mailto:CPWG@icann.org" target="_blank"
                    rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">CPWG@icann.org</a><br>
                  <a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg"
                    rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg</a><br>
                </blockquote>
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            rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank"
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            href="mailto:registration-issues-wg@atlarge-lists.icann.org"
            target="_blank" rel="noreferrer" moz-do-not-send="true">registration-issues-wg@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a><br>
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        </blockquote>
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      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
CPWG mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:CPWG@icann.org">CPWG@icann.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/cpwg</a>
</pre>
      <br>
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      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
GTLD-WG mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:GTLD-WG@atlarge-lists.icann.org">GTLD-WG@atlarge-lists.icann.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gtld-wg">https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gtld-wg</a>

Working Group direct URL: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/New+GTLDs">https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/New+GTLDs</a></pre>
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