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Folks,</div>
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Let's table this discussion until we can have a more thorough exploration of the issues. Email is a terrible way in which to have such a discussion. Threads get lost, broken, etc. and everyone is looking at this from a very narrow perspective. We owe it to
our constituency to take a broader view and to spend the time getting it right.</div>
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Jonathan</div>
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<div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font face="Calibri, sans-serif" style="font-size:11pt" color="#000000"><b>From:</b> GTLD-WG <gtld-wg-bounces@atlarge-lists.icann.org> on behalf of Maureen Hilyard <maureen.hilyard@gmail.com><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 26, 2019 1:27 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> George Kirikos<br>
<b>Cc:</b> CPWG<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [GTLD-WG] [CPWG] renewal of .org registry</font>
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<div dir="ltr">George
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<div>Are these end-user issues that apply to the comment that the CPWG initially proposed to add to the registry submissions about the pricing of domains? We seem to have gotten a bit off track. </div>
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<div>Maureen<br>
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<div dir="ltr" class="x_gmail_attr">On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 6:35 AM George Kirikos <<a href="mailto:icann@leap.com" target="_blank">icann@leap.com</a>> wrote:<br>
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Hi folks,<br>
<br>
On Fri, Apr 26, 2019 at 11:57 AM Greg Shatan <<a href="mailto:greg@isoc-ny.org" target="_blank">greg@isoc-ny.org</a>> wrote:<br>
> Finally, this concern about protecting small non-profits from paying big bucks for domain names would seem a lot more genuine if it included support for price caps in the resale market (i.e., the secondary market or aftermarket).<br>
<br>
You're conflating 2 different issues, Greg. The registry operators<br>
charge *fees* for registry services (i.e. managing a central database,<br>
the zone file, the nameservers that spit back the nameservers for the<br>
various domain names in that registry). The market value of those<br>
services are below $1/yr/domain (e.g. 70 cents per domain per year for<br>
the .IN ccTLD, as per their recent tender won by Neustar).<br>
<br>
<a href="http://domainincite.com/23976-neustar-completes-in-migration" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://domainincite.com/23976-neustar-completes-in-migration</a><br>
<br>
The secondary market or aftermarket is a marketplace for the asset<br>
value of the domain names themselves, which is an entirely different<br>
market than that for registry services.<br>
<br>
To understand this distinction, consider a trademark registry, like<br>
the USPTO, which has a fee structure for the services they provide for<br>
the registration and maintenance of trademarks. Those fees are<br>
entirely unrelated to the value of the trademark itself. A trademark<br>
owned by Google for "GOOGLE" or by Nike for "JUST DO IT" has set fees,<br>
and Google or Nike are free to sell, assign, license, etc. those<br>
trademarks to others at whatever the market will bear. Companies like<br>
Hilco Streambank routinely auction off the IP of companies, including<br>
their trademarks, see:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://www.hilcostreambank.com/closed-deals" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.hilcostreambank.com/closed-deals</a><br>
<br>
and of course, owners of TMs do these kinds of transactions all the<br>
time. For example, Hooters sold their trademark for $60 million.<br>
<br>
<a href="https://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/stories/2001/04/09/story1.html" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/stories/2001/04/09/story1.html</a><br>
<br>
The same comparison exists for a land registry and houses. Or a<br>
copyright registry, and the copyrighted works. The story of the<br>
Beatles catalog makes interesting reading:<br>
<br>
<a href="https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7662519/beatles-catalog-paul-mccartney-brief-history-ownership" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7662519/beatles-catalog-paul-mccartney-brief-history-ownership</a><br>
<br>
and that catalog only has value due to the copyrights (once those<br>
copyrights expire, the works fall into the public domain, and the<br>
works are free for everyone to use).<br>
<br>
Sincerely,<br>
<br>
George Kirikos<br>
416-588-0269<br>
<a href="http://www.leap.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.leap.com/</a><br>
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