<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Milton,</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">My responses are below.</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Aug 13, 2015 at 7:00 PM, Mueller, Milton L <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:milton.mueller@pubpolicy.gatech.edu" target="_blank">milton.mueller@pubpolicy.gatech.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal">An entity external to ICANN, taking over the IANA brand and identity, leaving ICANN as a mere licensee, entering into a contract with ICANN where that external entity exercises
oversight and control over IANA services (including the ability to find ICANN in default of that contract and ultimately the ability to enter into a contract with someone other than ICANN for those services).<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f4e79">What a desperate rhetorical
ploy.</span></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">GS: Milton, you let your cynicism get the better of you. This is a legitimate analysis and characterization of the situation. I'm still working out the nuances, but the similarities far outweigh the differences. I thought you would be happy that I'm coming to terms with the potential viability of the CRISP/ICG proposal to sgtrip ICANN of the IANA brand identity and allow a third party to assume that identity.</div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f4e79"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f4e79">IETF Trust does not select
the IFO for names. </span></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">GS: I did not say they did. However, the IETF Trust controls the ability of any IFO to operate under the IANA and INTERNET ASSIGNED NUMBERS AUTHORITY names and marks.</div></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f4e79">Only the IFR process has the ability to change the operator, which by default is PTI. IETF Trust has no control over the names community-based IFR. </span></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">GS: Milton, you are partially right here. IETF Trust cannot force the names community to use a different IFO. However, IETF Trust does not need to control the IFR to control ICANN's ability to hold itself out as the IANA or as the Internet Assigned Numbers Authority. The IETF Trust controls that ability as an essential aspect of its role as the owner of these brands. As Alan Greenberg just pointed out, the new IFO chosen by the names community could not call itself IANA or claim to be providing IANA brand services unless the IETF Trust granted the new operator a trademark license. Conversely, IETF Trust could terminate its license to ICANN, at which point ICANN would have to cease use of these brands and would presumably be cut off from using the <a href="http://iana.org">iana.org</a> domain name as well (which at that time would be owned by IETF Trust. </div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><br></div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f4e79">IETF Trust does not “exercise oversight and control over IANA services” it merely allows
PTI to use the TM and domain as long as it is the IFO.</span></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">GS: Here is where you are dead wrong. A trademark owner has an absolute legal obligation to exercise oversight and control over the quality of goods and services offered by licensees under the owner's trademark. This obligation is not waivable and must</div> <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">be actively exercised. Typically, such exercise includes the creation of quality control standards, approvals of new services or changes to the method of creation or delivery of services, periodic inspections, etc. The performance of these obligations may be delegated but the ultimate responsibility remains with the brand owner (and, if delegated, the delegee must be appropriately supervised so that the quality control ultimately tracks back to the brandowner.</div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><br></div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">There is no such thing in trademark law as "merely allowing" a third party to hold themselves out as providing services under and/or bearing the owner's trademark. (A non-trademark use (such as a "nominative" use to refer to the brandowner itself by using the trademark) is beyond the reach of the trademark owner to allow or disallow.) If PTI breaches its license agreement from the IETF Trust and fails to cure, then IETF Trust can (and must, if it is tied to the exercise of its quality control obligations) terminate that license, which ends the right of PTI to use IANA or Internet Assigned Numbers Authority as a trademark or trade name. This can be mitigated somewhat in the specific license, but a brandowner must ultimately retain discretion to terminate licensees that fail to meet satisfy the brandowner's quality controls. If this right is completely removed, the brandowner no longer has the ability to take all measures necessary to control quality, which then leads to a potential finding of abandonment and loss of trademark rights.</div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><br></div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><br></div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1f4e79"> I</span><span style="color:rgb(31,78,121);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">f you think we need to build on the proposal to ensure that limited role for IETF Trust then try to be constructive and make modifications or additions to what CRISP team proposed to ensure that outcome.
Don’t invent scare stories. What is there to back up your assertion that IETF Trust would have the “ability to enter into a contract with someone other than ICANN for [names-related IANA] services.” Nothing.</span></p></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline">GS: I have already provided a detailed email suggesting some of the modifications to the IETF Trust that would make it an appropriate owner of the IANA and INTERNET ASSIGNED NUMBERS AUTHORITY. I've also pointed out, as have others, that the IETF Trust must be accountable to the names community (and the numbers community) if it takes on this role. Accountability is not just for dysfunctional entities. The IETF Trust may function superbly and without fear or favor, but it still needs a framework of accountability, given the importance of its role if it were to assume control of the IANA identity and all the obligations that come with being a brandowner. I'm not trying to engage in "scare stories." I"m trying to spot issues. I'm not saying these issues are insurmountable, but they need to be acknowledged and not ignored. Only by acknowledging issues can we resolve them. Under the ICG plan, the IETF Trust's innate obligation as the brandowner to control the quality of IANA's services, and its innate right to terminate PTI's grant of rights to use the IANA brand as its name and mark, and its innate right to grant third parties the right to use the mark and to withhold such grants of rights are all issues we need to confront and control, as best one can within the bounds of the law, in order to make the ICG's proposal viable. I'm happy to delve further into what those solutions might be. But not tonight.</div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"><br></div></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif;display:inline"> </div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div>
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