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--></style></head><body lang=EN-US link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72"><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Dear All,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Please find the notes from today’s EPDP Team call below.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Best regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Marika, Berry, and Caitlin<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>--<o:p></o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>EPDP Team Call #34<br></span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>Thursday, 13 December 2018 14:00 UTC</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>High-level Notes/Actions</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><ol style='margin-top:0in' start=1 type=1><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Kurt to work with Support Staff to capture the geographic differentiation discussion and draft a policy recommendation for the EPDP Team to review.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The draft recommendation will provide that research should be explored on the feasibility of a rules engine and following the delivery and outcome of the research, the EPDP Team may recommend further work (perhaps by another PDP WG).<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>These high-level notes are designed to help the EPDP Team navigate through the content of the call and are not meant as a substitute for the transcript and/or recording. The MP3, transcript, and chat are provided separately and are posted on the wiki at: https://community.icann.org/x/ZwPVBQ</span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>1. Roll Call & SOI Updates</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><ul style='margin-top:0in' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo2;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Attendance will be taken from Adobe Connect<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo2;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Remember to mute your microphones when not speaking and state your name before speaking for transcription purposes.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo2;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Please remember to review your SOIs on a regular basis and update as needed. Updates are required to be shared with the EPDP Team. <o:p></o:p></span></li></ul><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>2. Welcome and Updates from EPDP Team Chair (5 minutes)</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'> a. Review of outstanding action items</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'> b. Other updates, if applicable</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><ul style='margin-top:0in' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Due to the potentially large expense of retaining external legal counsel, the Leadership Team met with the Project Cost Support Team (PCST) to discuss options for legal counsel. <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The proposed approach was used by the CCWG - WS2<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The approach is to establish a sub-team, called the EPDP Legal Committee (LC), that will act as an intermediary b/w the EPDP Team and external/internal legal counsel<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The LC will filter, analyze, refine, and approve requests for legal advice<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Members would be practicing lawyers or individuals with legal training - preferably one member per team<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The rationale for the approach is previous success with CCWG-WS2, stewardship of budget, streamlined process<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Within the SOW, Kurt requested a certain number of business days SLA be included to ensure we get answers as soon as possible<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>EPDP Feedback</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><ul style='margin-top:0in' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Concerns about approach - it is difficult for attorneys to be instructed by groups with divergent interests. This may involve a lot of time and money with little gain.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Response: we plan to use this approach, but if it is not working, we will reassess.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Can we get a degree of assurance that the group will actually take the legal advice received on board?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Are the stakeholder groups willing to follow advice that may be against the stakeholder group's position?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Response: we hope the Team will respect any guidance received and use it constructively<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Rather than asking questions, we could describe detailed scenarios and ask if the scenario is compliant with the GDPR.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Use cases with proposed solutions would be ideal - is this proposed solution GDPR compliant? General questions may not result in helpful answers.<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>3. Continue review of list of topics for further discussion</span><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>Geographic basis</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><ul style='margin-top:0in' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Amr recently forwarded recent EDPB guidance to the list - does this memo provide clarity to our discussion?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>These guidelines were shared by the EDPB a few weeks ago and are available for a public comment process now.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>A small team discussed the geographic differentiation issue, and the divergent viewpoints were captured in the Initial Report.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Targeting criteria - just b/c a data subject is located within the EEA does not mean processing of data falls within GDPR. One criterion is the data subject is targeted by a controller.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Geo localization activities may be relevant - also, online tracking (cookies) or personalized targeting.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Establishment criteria - main establishment is not the only factor that applies<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Reading this document highlights additional questions<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Reading the guidelines shows there are a lot of areas where the GDPR does not apply<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>This guidance is helpful in two ways: (1) putting responsibility on the controller, and the processing activity is not the controlling factor; (2) the guidance also provides some clarity regarding the location of the data subject<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The guidance pivots on the definition of roles. This introduces complexity for contracted parties, and this only applies to GDPR.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>This may be an area where we get very targeted legal advice<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The rules engine approach/chart could be helpful in this context - the guidelines narrow the questions we could ask<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Scenario-based questions are likely to be responded to with pro forma advice such as analysis would need to be done on a case-by-case basis<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>If the guidance helps the team draw a box around data subjects, it will still be difficult to draw up 50+ rule sets. The guidance demonstrates that this is a complicated issue and shows the difficulty of digital vs. political borders.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>This appears to be a policy question, not a legal question - does the team want to create a policy where compliance can be enforced?<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>While this looks like a legal question, it is not. This is really a question of dealing with requirements that transcend jurisdiction and gets into challenges that global technology firms are dealing with now.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The team should get more legal advice and come to consensus on what is the lowest risk and practical application from a policy perspective<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The team is ignoring the cost to third parties that access WHOIS data. The EWG report was commissioned by the ICANN Board - once the Board received the report, it initiated the next generation RDS PDP, which was terminated after GDPR/initiation of EPDP.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The Team does not have time to work through all of this right now, but needs to not just focus on costs to contracted parties <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The Team should also consider potential gaming, i.e. targeting customers in the EEA just to avoid publishing data<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Before the Team agrees to research a rules engine, we should be clear if it would be viable - the team needs to think this through more<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Ultimately, we will need a rules engine to apply multiple laws, but that is outside of our scope and should not be on our critical path. We need something simple that does not require elaborate rules.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Researching does not necessarily mean the team will make this a policy - however analysis would be helpful, and the team could make recommendations to further explore this in a later phase<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Action: Kurt to summarize this discussion as a policy recommendation for the group to review and ultimately be included in the final report<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Why does the EPDP Team need to research this - shouldn't this be conducted by a different PDP? Perhaps this could be worked on in the future.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>This Team is talking about a policy that is not just GDPR compliant - that is why a rules engine is important - we should recommend that the work begin immediately<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The other thing the group has not yet discussed is the ICANN hub and spoke model<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>Policy Change Impact Analysis</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><ul style='margin-top:0in' type=disc><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Per the charter, there is a need to include a policy impact analysis. The analysis is meant to include metrics to be able to measure the effectiveness of the policy. If the team has ideas for what needs to be captured here, or if anyone wants to volunteer, that would be very helpful.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>During the charter drafting phase, Stephanie had a particular interest in this section, so she could be a starting point.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>The bullet points within the Initial Report show what the team is expected to produce <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>It may be premature to determine if the policy achieved its goals given the stage we are in<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>An action item could be to review this after policy recommendations are submitted and submit proposed metrics to the Council. <o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>It's difficult to conduct an analysis before we have specific policy recommendations<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>Kurt may consider collaborating with staff to see if an independent resource could be tapped for this exercise.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=MsoNormal style='color:black;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'>It's hard to dedicate time to this effort if something changes as a result of public comment<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>Our next meeting to be scheduled for <b>Tuesday 18 December 2018 at 14.00 UTC.</b></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></body></html>