<div dir="ltr">In truth I have not had the full opportunity to read the document, but merely reacting to some of the back and forth here. <div><br></div><div>I think Steve, that the simple response regarding businesses competency to publish their key role contacts is simply by acknowledging the fact that in our case, they are not the ones publishing, the registry or registrar is. This remains our risk, and we are trying to control that; we cannot have our fates in the hand of the internal process and legal awareness of one of any of the legal entities who are registrants. Bird & Bird's 2nd Legal memo on consent is pretty helpful in establishing that delineation. (<a href="https://community.icann.org/download/attachments/111388744/ICANN%20memo%2013%20March%202020%20-%20consent.docx?version=1&modificationDate=1584121399000&api=v2">https://community.icann.org/download/attachments/111388744/ICANN%20memo%2013%20March%202020%20-%20consent.docx?version=1&modificationDate=1584121399000&api=v2</a>) </div><div><br></div><div><i>"However, the controller will not be discharged from its obligations under the GDPR and – if the registrant has not met its obligations and/or does not provide a copy of the consent on request – then the controller will not be able to demonstrate that consent requirements are met, so this will impact on controller's compliance with GDPR." </i></div><div><i><br></i></div><div>Warm regards,</div><div><br></div><div>Alan</div><div><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div dir="ltr"><div style="font-family:sans-serif;font-size:13px"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div><table style="padding:0px;margin:10px 0px;border:none"><tbody><tr><td style="vertical-align:middle;padding:0px 7px 0px 0px"><a href="http://donuts.domains/" rel="nofollow" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><img alt="Donuts Inc." height="75" src="https://storage.googleapis.com/signaturesatori/customer-C02zzlf7k/images/-54f9d8ac97e7f575bf497d10ac1f1aafafddf8afceab5f269d49034f01b3217b.png" width="75"></a></td><td style="vertical-align:middle;padding:0px 7px 0px 0px"><div style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:17px;font-weight:bold;color:black"></div><div><table style="font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;padding:0px;margin:10px 0px;border:none"><tbody><tr><td style="vertical-align:middle;padding:0px 7px 0px 0px"><div style="font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:17px;font-weight:bold;color:black"><span style="font-size:12px"><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)"><br>Alan Woods</span></span></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12px"><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">Senior Compliance & Policy Manager, Donuts Inc.</span></span></span> <hr><div></div></div></td></tr></tbody></table><div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:11px"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">Donuts</span></span></div><div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:11px"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">Ground Floor</span></span></div><div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:11px"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">Le Pole House</span></span></div><div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:11px"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">Ship Street Great</span></span></div><div style="color:rgb(136,136,136)"><span style="font-size:11px"><span style="color:rgb(51,51,51)">Dublin 8</span></span></div></div><div><br><span style="font-size:11px"><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></span></span><br><span style="line-height:36px"><a href="https://www.facebook.com/donutstlds" rel="nofollow" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><img src="http://storage.googleapis.com/signaturesatori/icons/facebook.png"></a> <a href="https://twitter.com/DonutsInc" rel="nofollow" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><img src="http://storage.googleapis.com/signaturesatori/icons/twitter.png"></a> </span><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/donuts-inc" rel="nofollow" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:14px"><img src="http://storage.googleapis.com/signaturesatori/icons/linkedin.png"></span></a></div></td></tr></tbody></table><br></div><div><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif">Please NOTE: This electronic message, including any attachments, may include privileged, confidential and/or inside information owned by Donuts Inc. . </span><span style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Cambria,serif">Any distribution or use of this communication by anyone other than the intended recipient(s) is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender by replying to this message and then delete it from your system. Thank you.</span><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div dir="ltr"><br><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 4:06 PM STROUNGI Melina via Gnso-epdp-team <<a href="mailto:gnso-epdp-team@icann.org">gnso-epdp-team@icann.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="gmail-m_1880042077169039935MsoListParagraph"><u></u><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span>-<span style="font:7pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Re-sending as I see that not everyone had been in cc -
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Thanks Volker and Steve.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Just a small remark from my side on the first essential point raised by Volker:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">This is precisely the concern of contracted parties that we aimed at addressing at our revised GAC proposal.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">If you see our proposal, at first level we have the distinction between natural and legal entities (which of course cannot be skipped) and at second level the
further distinction between:<br>
a) data of legal entities containing personal information and <br>
b) data of legal entities which do not contain personal information.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Data related to entities that are designated as natural entities under step 1 would not be published, so a further distinction wouldn’t be necessary for those.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">We trust that the above addresses your concern Volker. And of course we can find ways together on how to make this work.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Talk soon!<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Best,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Melina
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> Gnso-epdp-team <<a href="mailto:gnso-epdp-team-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-epdp-team-bounces@icann.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Volker Greimann via Gnso-epdp-team<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 24, 2021 3:41 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Steve Crocker <<a href="mailto:steve@shinkuro.com" target="_blank">steve@shinkuro.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> SSAC-EPDP-WP <<a href="mailto:ssac-epdp-wp@icann.org" target="_blank">ssac-epdp-wp@icann.org</a>>;
<a href="mailto:gnso-epdp-team@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-epdp-team@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gnso-epdp-team] SSAC response re EPDP homework - due Wed 24 February<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Steve, <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">thank you for your helpful proposal. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I think it misses the mark on two essential points however:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">1) Legal vs natural is the wrong differentiation. I believe we already moved past this on the legal team, and are close to agreeing the correct differentiation would be the following:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">a) contains personal information<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">b) does not contain personal information<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">This, we believe is the correct differentiation as even the data provided by a legal entity can contain or consist of personal information of a natural person.
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">2) Our role at this stage is not to make or propose binding rules but to provide guidance for those parties that chose to differentiate between data sets containing and not containing personal information.
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Regarding your point of inferred status, I feel this goes too far as well as we do not currently believe that the quality of the data field is sufficient for any automated inferral of status. Cases where the status is inferred by the contents
of this field do exist, but are usually limited to manual review in case of ownership disputes, where the contents of the field may prove the deciding factor in determining the right of ownership or control over a domain name in cases of dispute.
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">One further suggestion is not to front-load the determination in the registration or initial data-gathering process, but allow for a larger degree of flexibility by also including post-registration determination of status.
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <br>
Volker A. Greimann<br>
General Counsel and Policy Manager<br>
<b>KEY-SYSTEMS GMBH</b><br>
<br>
T: +49 6894 9396901<br>
M: +49 6894 9396851<br>
F: +49 6894 9396851<br>
W: <a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.key-systems.net/__;!!DOxrgLBm!QLaJJAgxLCncaOTRibshBFoWs4A7m2R5CAe4PqZIyk3cldtLhiVkYpuKMVICbdA5hNCXDYkk$" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(17,85,204)">www.key-systems.net</span></a><br>
<br>
Key-Systems GmbH is a company registered at the local court of Saarbruecken, Germany with the registration no. HR B 18835<br>
CEO: Oliver Fries and Robert Birkner<br>
<br>
Part of the CentralNic Group PLC (LON: CNIC) a company registered in England and Wales with company number 8576358.<br>
<br>
<span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;background:rgb(248,249,250)">This email and any files transmitted are confidential and intended only for the person(s) directly addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, any use, copying, transmission,
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, Feb 24, 2021 at 11:39 AM Steve Crocker via Gnso-epdp-team <<a href="mailto:gnso-epdp-team@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-epdp-team@icann.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif">Folks,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmail-m_1880042077169039935gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif">In our view, the proposal has two substantial flaws. First, it is overly specific as to the process *all* contracted registrars must use to determine
whether the registrant is a legal vs a natural person. Second, it includes procedures for verifying the accuracy of the data for legal persons. The procedure is unnecessary for determining whether the registrant is a legal person. If the eventual policy
requires a high degree of accuracy of a legal person's name and address, that's a separate matter and should be dealt with in that part of the policy.</span></span><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmail-m_1880042077169039935gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif">The attached memo suggests a simpler and more comprehensive approach.</span></span><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmail-m_1880042077169039935gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif">Thanks,</span></span><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span class="gmail-m_1880042077169039935gmaildefault"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif">Steve</span></span><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:18pt;font-family:Garamond,serif"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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