<html xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta name=Title content=""><meta name=Keywords content=""><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#0563C1;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#954F72;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.MsoListParagraph, li.MsoListParagraph, div.MsoListParagraph
{mso-style-priority:34;
margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.EmailStyle18
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle19
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle21
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle22
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle23
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle24
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle25
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle26
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle27
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle28
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle29
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle30
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle31
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.msoIns
{mso-style-type:export-only;
mso-style-name:"";
text-decoration:underline;
color:teal;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72"><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Dear Sub Team Members,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Please see below the action items and discussion notes captured by staff from the meeting on 13 April. <i>These high-level notes are designed to help Work Track Sub Team members navigate through the content of the call and are not a substitute for the chat room or the recording.</i> See the chat room and recording on the meetings pages at: <a href="https://community.icann.org/display/NGSPP/Work+Track+2+Meetings">https://community.icann.org/display/NGSPP/Work+Track+2+Meetings</a>. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Please also see the attached slides and PDF referenced below. Excerpts from the chat room are included below for ease of reference.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Best regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Julie</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Julie Hedlund, Policy Director</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Action Items/Discussion Notes 13 April</span></b><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Closed Generics<o:p></o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Looked at the pros and cons on our last call based on the public comments. There was an update to the RAA that restricted closed generics.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- On the last call we didn't have a lot of feedback on the cons, more on the pros. Intention today is to take another looking at the cons and see what kind of harms there are.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Asked staff to put together the types of harms that are identified. Found different categories of harm.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Are these harms asserted as potential harms, or identified harms? Rather than identify we will say "mentioned". From what we gathered from the public comments these are how commenters identified potential harms.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Let's call these "alleged harms."<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Majority of the comments talked about a harm to competition. There also mention of harm to the public interest and legal principles referenced, mentions of ICANN Bylaws and GNSO advice. Also the RAA code of conduct. Threat to open internet, cultural harm, trademark-related harm.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Harm to competition (page 1 of the document)<o:p></o:p></span></u></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Comments from last call we noted harm to competition was raised by competitors.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Might want to look at a finding by the International Chamber of Commerce on .mobile. CTIA objected to at least one application on the grounds that it was a closed generic will all traffic going to one CTIA member. Language about harms to business communities: https://iccwbo.org/publication/exp_499_icann_116_expert-determination/.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Think there were several community objections did relate to unfair competition.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Something to bear in mind in relation to competition: there was to some extent some benefit that another brand owner might seek a closed generic might not be a bad thing for us (BBC). Some spaces could be safeguarded from greater abuse.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- When you are faced with a number of TLDs and defensively registering your brand. Say you are in the food industry and .food is a closed generic it saves you the money on registrations.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Kathy's example is not fully helpful. I think that decision came in a pre-determined outcome. There is nothing prohibiting closed generics -- it wasn't until after applications came in. Then the GAC piled on citing competition harms without real hard data. Then the snowball effect. If we going to reopen this issue I do think we owe it to open it from the beginning. I think we have to go back and do a real review, but I'm not sure it's worth it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- There was a request that we look into this. As for going back and doing a review, I am open to suggestions. NGPC resolution (since disbanded). Don't know if it would carry as a Board resolution.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Do want to make sure we are looking at what has been said about alleged harms.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Not in a postion for laying out the case for why this exploded the Internet community in 2012/2013. So the ICANN Board stepped in. Need to hear the arguments.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- The intention in this call is to address the cons on closed generics -- pros were covered on the last call.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- If there were no prospects and an application for a closed generics was on hold an applicant might have decided to withdraw it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Board told everyone that you would have to open up your string or sit in the penalty box until the next round. Don't think we need to stick to the .com model. There are newer models.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>From the chat:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: GNSO Policy on new gTLDs actually didn't prohibit or even mention closed generics.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Kathy Kleiman: Many drafters of the Applicant Guidebook felt very strongly that Closed Generics were barred by the rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: Why were non of the pro-closed generics comments from the last round included in this document? Seems either a big oversight or one-sided designed to lead us all to a particular conclusion.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: But we are only seeing what 1 side has said. Why aren't we looking at what the other side said?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Michael Flemming: We have gone over the Pros in the last call. Could you be clear what the other side would be?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Susan Payne: @Kathy, that might have been the intention of some, but I don't think that was what the wording of the AGB said<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Kathy Kleiman: @Susan, the response in 2012 and 2013 was considerable! <a href="https://iccwbo.org/publication/exp_499_icann_116_expert-determination/">https://iccwbo.org/publication/exp_499_icann_116_expert-determination/</a> I think the determination stands on its own - worth reading! <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Susan Payne: @Kathy, what do you mean the response in 2012/2013?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Kathy Kleiman: The letters and articles written in 2012 and 2013 - some circulated earlier today. Many with group signatures.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Susan Payne: yes but my point is that is not what the AGB says, that is what some people wrote after the event surely<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>avri doria: Even if we don't reopen it, we need to be explicit. One of the deficits in the previous policy is that we were not specific about approving closed generics, we just assumed that of course they would be ok. note: we did not even have a name for them back then.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): indeed Avri <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: +1 Avri<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): not sure we have any consensus on that Kathy... I don't agree they are " by definition " Good<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Steve Chan: @Paul, the NGPC was empowered by the Board to pass resolutions. Therefore, NGPC resolutions are ICANN Board resolutions.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): rather that this needs discussion <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: @Kathy - that was the pre-round 1 model<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>ICANN Bylaws, Affirmations of Commitments, GNSO Advice, and Registry Agreement Code of Conduct (page 3)<o:p></o:p></span></u></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Two things here: Not sure what relevant GNSO Council advice there is on this.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Why don't we read the Code of Conduct and see if there is anything about it? While we are looking for the exact text, that certainly was one of the items that was discussed. One of the comments people were making is it could be open to all registrars, but I don't think we ever dug deeply down that line of argument in terms of to what degree -- when you make a deal with a registrar you have to make the same deal with everyone. Don't think that one was resolved.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>(reading from the Code of Conduct, Specification 9, page 282-283)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Doesn't seem to restrict closed generics.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>-- Not very specific comments relating to Bylaws, etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><u><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Threat to Open Internet (page 4)<o:p></o:p></span></u></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>(Reading from post from Michele Neylon: <a href="https://www.internetnews.me/2013/02/23/5-reasons-why-closed-generic-new-gtlds-should-be-opposed/">https://www.internetnews.me/2013/02/23/5-reasons-why-closed-generic-new-gtlds-should-be-opposed/</a>.) <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>From the chat:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Rubens Kuhl: Although not always mentioned, closed generics can bring inovation as well to the DNS. .frogans is one example of the usage type that can go in that direction. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: @Kathy - I love him, but Michele's business is selling second level domain names, so closed generics are contrary to his business model, but that doesn't make them against the public interest<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Susan Payne 2: the difficulty is that all of these arguments assume that all we want are a whole series of .com alternatives. where is the innovation in that<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Liz Brodzinski: +1 Susan<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Rubens Kuhl: So the question is how to close the door to misuse without forbidding possible good uses. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Paul McGrady: @Kathy - no competitors were blocked out of closed generics - all were welcome to apply for them<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Rubens Kuhl: Also of notice is that most of the anger against closed generics came specifically regarding .book. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Kathy Kleiman: @Paul - of course we are closing off competitors -- to basic generic words that no one would be able to trademark as generic to their goods, services and industries.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri'>Kiran malancharuvil: Agree with Paul and Susan Payne 2 (identity theft??) </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></body></html>