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<p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"> I have heard that in
Italy a city is any grouping of people that has a cathedral and
a bishop. (Maybe someone on the list can confirm this.) I just
visited one (Pienza) that has only 2000 people and does have a
mayor, so some form of government. So, if it is a city and does
have a government but is well below the population cut off, how
would the provisions below protect Pienza (or not)?<br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Marita</font><br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 5/17/2018 1:14 AM, Alexander
Schubert wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Susan,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Either
I have not expressed myself precise enough – or I am
misunderstood:<br>
<br>
In the 2012 AGB it clearly states “city name”. I think the
requirement to produce a letter of non-objection from the
city’s government implies that only city’s that HAVE any
form of Government are targeted by this rule. Rock doesn’t
have any “Government” – it is such a small village (1,200
people) that it is governed by others. There is a reference
to “city government” in Module 2, page 18 of 42, 2.2.1.4.2
in 2b – there in the reference 7
(<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://newgtlds.icann.org/en/applicants/agb/evaluation-procedures-04jun12-en.pdf">https://newgtlds.icann.org/en/applicants/agb/evaluation-procedures-04jun12-en.pdf</a>):<br>
<b><i><span
style="color:#2E75B6;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#2E75B6;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">“City
governments with concerns about strings that are
duplicates, nicknames or close renderings of a city
name should not rely<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#2E75B6;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#2E75B6;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">on
the evaluation process as the primary means of
protecting their interests in a string. Rather, a
government may elect to file a<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#2E75B6;mso-style-textfill-fill-color:#2E75B6;mso-style-textfill-fill-alpha:100.0%">formal
objection to an application that is opposed by the
relevant community, or may submit its own application
for the string.”</span></i></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
<br>
This language clearly implies that “city” in respect to the
support requirement is defined as a place that has its own
“Government”. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
I am very much in agreement with you that the 2012 AGB
specification “city name” is a disaster. It’s not really
defined and way too broad. By introducing a population-size
cutoff we eliminate all the smallish places that nobody
really would ever create a geo gTLD for anyways – so brands
and generic term applications have free reign! These smaller
places can still OBJECT to an application – example would be
“Aspen”.<br>
<br>
And this is precisely one of our tasks here: to unearth
language and provisions of the 2012 AGB that maybe “worked”
in 2012 – but likely create confusion in future rounds. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><br>
Thanks,<br>
<br>
Alexander<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
Susan Payne [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:susan.payne@valideus.com">mailto:susan.payne@valideus.com</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, May 17, 2018 12:41 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin">alexander@schubert.berlin</a>;
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] Qualifying the
threshold for requirement of letters of non-objection!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a name="_MailEndCompose"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">Well Alexander, this is a perfect example of
why if you are going to agree with the wide-ranging and
imprecise assertions of others then it would be well to be
clear exactly what you are agreeing with. You actually do
not agree with Christopher at all –or at least in large
part.</span></a><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">What’s called a city seems to vary greatly from
country to country. I’ve been to UK fishing villages that
are bigger than “cities” in some other countries. The AGB
just refers to a “city” but without defining what that is.
Not that there’s any basis at law of course for the AGB city
consent requirements, just for the avoidance of doubt.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#76923C"
lang="EN-GB">Susan Payne<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#76923C"
lang="EN-GB">Head of Legal Policy</span></b><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"> </span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">| </span><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#C39209"
lang="EN-GB">Valideus Ltd</span></b><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">28-30 Little Russell StreetWell <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">London, WC1A 2HN, United Kingdom<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">E: </span><span lang="EN-GB"><a
href="mailto:susan.payne@valideus.com"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#76923C">susan.payne@valideus.com</span></a></span><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">D: +44 20 7421 8255<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">T: +44 20 7421 8299<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">M: +44 7971 661175<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:red"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [<a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Alexander Schubert<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 16 May 2018 22:33<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] Qualifying the
threshold for requirement of letters of non-objection!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Susan,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Your
comment is very valuable:<br>
<br>
We HAVE to prevent that places like “rock” have veto rights
over brand or generic term based gTLDs! The “Rock” (in
Cornwall) you mentioned is a “fishing village” – and as such
DOESN’T require any letter of non-objection per the 2012 AGB
at all! But the point itself is well taken:<br>
<br>
We need to qualify a threshold for protection – most likely
by quantifying the population! If we have a 10,000 (or
50,000) inhabitant cut-off: the overlay between those
sizeable cities and brands and or generic terms is MINIMAL!
<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
<br>
Alexander<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [<a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Susan Payne<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, May 17, 2018 12:23 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Shatan <<a
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>>;
<a href="mailto:lists@christopherwilkinson.eu"
moz-do-not-send="true">lists@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>
Wilkinson <<a
href="mailto:lists@christopherwilkinson.eu"
moz-do-not-send="true">lists@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">Agreed Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">Christopher, you appear to be suggesting that
the term “rock” since it happens to be the name of at least
one small town in Cornwall, England, and possibly elsewhere,
could not be used as a TLD by geologists, landscapers,
musicians, etc etc. On what possible legal, or indeed
policy, basis? So no, you may not take that as agreed.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#76923C"
lang="EN-GB">Susan Payne<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#76923C"
lang="EN-GB">Head of Legal Policy</span></b><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"> </span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">| </span><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#C39209"
lang="EN-GB">Valideus Ltd</span></b><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">28-30 Little Russell Street<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">London, WC1A 2HN, United Kingdom<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">E: </span><span lang="EN-GB"><a
href="mailto:susan.payne@valideus.com"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#76923C">susan.payne@valideus.com</span></a></span><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">D: +44 20 7421 8255<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">T: +44 20 7421 8299<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB">M: +44 7971 661175<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:red"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [<a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Greg Shatan<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 16 May 2018 21:46<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:lists@christopherwilkinson.eu"
moz-do-not-send="true">lists@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>
Wilkinson <<a href="mailto:lists@christopherwilkinson.eu"
moz-do-not-send="true">lists@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Christopher wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p style="font-size:1rem;word-spacing:1px"><span
style="color:#313131" lang="EN-GB">3. The 2012 option
of non-geo use of a geo-name should be abandoned. (Since
there has been no objection on the List to that -
repeated - proposition, may I take it that is agreed in
WT5?)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">There has been
significant— repeated — objection to that proposition,
so no, you may not take it that it is agreed in WT5.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Thanks for the
opportunity to clarify that.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">On Wed, May 16,
2018 at 1:39 PM <a
href="mailto:lists@christopherwilkinson.eu"
moz-do-not-send="true">lists@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>
Wilkinson <<a
href="mailto:lists@christopherwilkinson.eu"
moz-do-not-send="true">lists@christopherwilkinson.eu</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p><span lang="EN-GB">Good afternoon:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">With respect, this is the first
time that I have perceived that in 2012, Geo-Names
Review was different from the Geo-Names Panel. I
shall try and get my head around that! <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">Meanwhile, it would clearly be an
advantage to have a review function available for
ALL Geo-related applications, up front, BEFORE
applicants and the mechanisms spend time and money
on the approval procedures.<br>
<br>
I have already posted several comments that would
significantly reduce the risks and uncertainties for
Geo-Names applications. <em>Pour Memoire:</em><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">1. The application should be from
an entity within the jurisdiction of the geo-name in
question, and the proposed TLD Registry should be
incorporated in that jurisdiction. There should not
be any incorporations in third country tax havens.<br>
<br>
2. There should be strict limits on the number of
TLDs that may be applied for by any one entity. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">3. The 2012 option of non-geo use
of a geo-name should be abandoned. (Since there has
been no objection on the List to that - repeated
- proposition, may I take it that is agreed in WT5?)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">Thus, these few, realistic,
boundary conditions would considerably reduce the
scope and frequency of disputes during applications
and during implementation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">CW<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB">PS: Since all applications for
Geo-Names should have received non-objection letters
from the appropriate authorities, I might imagine
that the scope for String Contention would be
considerably reduced if not eliminated.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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