<html>
  <head>
    <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
  </head>
  <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Greg -- thank you for
        the response. Of course, I was not trying to discredit you. But
        you realize, of course, that e-mails can be easily
        misinterpreted -- not just by me, but by the couple of hundred
        people signed up for this discussion. So, I am just seeking
        caution in this respect.</font></p>
    <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Marita</font><br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/26/2018 11:54 AM, Greg Shatan
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CA+aOHUR18Uyue57FpbWS4FBUOuztrL5mYsaUrR0=HxfVX1X=WA@mail.gmail.com">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Marita,</div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
        </div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Please don't jump to
          conclusions.  I was responding to Alexander's email, but I
          didn't want to do "inline" responses, since I find those
          tendentious and tiresome unless absolutely necessary.  So I
          needed to say what part of his email I was responding to. 
          This was a way to show what I was responding to, but was not
          in any way an attempt to "discredit" the positions or
          Alexander.  At no point did I say that any of his positions
          were held only by Alexander.  I don't think it's appropriate
          when we are discussing substantive issues to make claims about
          how many or how few people support a given position.  I will
          leave it to our co-chairs to deal with which positions are
          getting "traction" or not or, better yet, where "common
          ground" can be found.</div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
        </div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">I could say that your
          email was an attempt to discredit me and the positions I put
          forward, but that would be silly.  I hope you will understand
          that your perception of my actions and intent was incorrect. 
          Of course, there is no problem with an honest
          misunderstanding, and I will assume that was all it was.</div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
        </div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Best regards,</div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
        </div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg</div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 8:46 AM, Marita
          Moll <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mmoll@ca.inter.net"
              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">mmoll@ca.inter.net</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
              <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Hi Greg. I
                  object to your painting all the positions you disagree
                  with as positions held by Alexander.  That's not just
                  misleading, it's false. The positions you disagree are
                  supported by quite a few people. Throwing them all
                  into one box labeled "Alexander says" (you used the
                  name at least 10 times) is a way of discrediting ideas
                  by pinning them on a single individual. It is a well
                  known technique in political discourse when you are
                  trying to discredit someone.</font></p>
              <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Let's not do
                  that here.</font></p>
              <span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
                  <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Marita<br>
                    </font></p>
                </font></span>
              <div>
                <div class="h5"> <br>
                  <div class="m_7933093344519172564moz-cite-prefix">On
                    6/25/2018 7:30 PM, Greg Shatan wrote:<br>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote type="cite">
                    <div dir="ltr">
                      <div class="gmail_default"><font face="verdana,
                          sans-serif">Joe,</font></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><font face="verdana,
                          sans-serif"><br>
                        </font></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><font face="verdana,
                          sans-serif">I want to clarify some areas where
                          Alexander's characterizations of the group's
                          work to date don't appear correct.  In
                          particular:</font></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default"><span
                          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
                        </span></div>
                      <div class="gmail_default">
                        <ul>
                          <li><font face="verdana, sans-serif">We have <b>not</b>
                              spent our time discussing practically
                              nothing else than trademark-related issues
                              specifically.  We <b>have</b> spent a
                              great deal of time discussing a more
                              general topic -- are place-name meanings
                              somehow superior to ALL other meanings? 
                              This includes trademark meanings,
                              surnames, nouns that are not proper nouns
                              (BAR, SPA, ROCK), communities (aside from
                              the community of the place(s) with that
                              name.  Casting this as a trademark
                              discussion misses the point entirely.</font></li>
                        </ul>
                        <ul>
                          <li><font face="verdana, sans-serif">It is not
                              an accepted concept that the 2012 AGB is
                              the starting point of our work (vs. the
                              policy recommendations that preceded it;
                              after all, this is a "policy development
                              process."  It is <b>certainly </b>not a
                              base in the sense of a "floor" changes to
                              the 2012 AGB could go in any direction –
                              and in many cases, there's no agreement on
                              whether any particular change would be an
                              "improvement."</font><br>
                          </li>
                        </ul>
                      </div>
                      <div class="gmail_default">
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif"><span>·<span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal">        <span> </span></span></span>Alexander
                            says the 2012 AGB protected "very few geo
                            names."  ISO 3166-2 protected nearly 6,000
                            names.  Capital cities protected roughly 250
                            names.  The UNESCO regions and subregions
                            (ignored by Alexander) add another 35
                            names (only 2 of which are registered TLDs,
                            contrary to Alexander's email).  That's a
                            "protect list" of roughly<b> 6,285</b>
                            names.  I would not call that "very few."  </font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">Each of these was
                            blocked unless the relevant governmental
                            authorities granted a letter of
                            consent/non-objection (at their sole
                            discretion).  Alexander claims "And so far
                            nobody has really much challenged these
                            rules." <b><u>Nothing could be further from
                                the truth.</u></b>   There have been
                            repeated challenges to continued blocking
                            based on the ISO-3166-2 list.  To the extent
                            capital cities have not been challenged, I
                            believe that has been based on the hopeful
                            idea of compromise to reach consensus. 
                            Subregion names have not really been
                            discussed one way or the other.</font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">Of course,
                            non-capital cities are also protected --
                            this adds <b>4,400-50,000</b> more places,
                            yielding a total between approximately <b><font
                                color="#ff0000">11,000</font></b> names
                            and more than <b><font color="#ff0000">56,000</font></b>
                            names.  That  certainly cannot be "very
                            few."</font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">All of these
                            issues are still open items.  So, it's
                            incorrect to say that "The ONLY remaining
                            2012 AGB geo-name category was “city
                            names.”" There has been a tendency by some
                            to try and close discussions with premature
                            declarations of victory (somehow it never
                            works the other way...).  This should be
                            seen in that context.</font></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">This really has
                            nothing to do with free speech rights of
                            citizens -- if they want a second level
                            domain, they can get one.  If their city
                            wants a TLD, they can get one.  This is
                            about blocking names from use and giving one
                            or more governments the power to decide what
                            speech will be allowed.  This is the
                            opposite of free speech.</font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">The idea of
                            giving reservation/blocking rights to
                            governments based on "potentially hundreds
                            of thousands qualifying “city names”" seems
                            like a terrible blow to free speech, a form
                            of "prior restraint" on speech, which is
                            particularly disfavored.  Of course, nothing
                            will stop any city from getting a TLD
                            related to their name now, or in the future
                            (even if their first choice is not
                            available).</font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">Since this isn't
                            really about "free speech rights for cities"
                            at all, I'll skip responding to those items,
                            except to note that the so-called "free
                            speech" here is a peculiar invention: the
                            ability of citizens "to express themselves
                            through a domain name based on their city
                            name."  Since the TLD will not exist because
                            of this rule, the ability to use such a
                            domain name doesn't exist. </font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif"><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal">Similarly,
                              hypotheticals that are full of false
                              assumptions and one sided presumptions
                              intended to paint a David vs. Goliath
                              picture don't need further response, since
                              they do not illustrate any general
                              principle.  (As for the good people of Tel
                              Aviv, they would likely prefer "Tel Aviv"
                              in Hebrew.)</span><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal"> 
                            </span><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal">But
                              it is good to know that Alexander thinks
                              the 2012 rules are "horrible."</span></font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal"><font
                              face="verdana, sans-serif">Alexander
                              dismisses the whole complex issue of
                              "intent" based on a false premise -- that
                              because the registrars will sell the
                              domain names, that the registry's intent
                              regarding the domain name doesn't matter. 
                              First, this obviously ignores .brands, who
                              will not be selling domain names at all.
                              Second, there are many cases where TLDs
                              are restricted as to the type and scope of
                              use by registrants -- not least, many
                              .cityname TLDs!</font></span></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif"><span><span
style="font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal"><span>W</span></span></span></font><span
                            style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">hether
                            brands have rights (which of course they do)
                            is really not an issue here.  Brands are not
                            looking to exercise any rights here to stop
                            other applications, nor have brands asserted
                            superior privileges over other legitimate
                            applicants.  Again, I won't pick through all
                            of the baseless assumptions and pejorative
                            terms used to cobble together an
                            argument....   But I will say the idea that
                            this is a </span><span
                            style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">"</span><span
                            style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">culture
                            war" doesn't hold water (and certainly is
                            not how this has been framed generally, if
                            you are looking to catch up on the work of
                            the group.</span></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">As for the
                            proposed "compromise" -- it's no compromise
                            at all, since it starts with a false premise
                            -- that this is a "free speech" question for
                            "citizens."  The idea that the has been
                            "broad support" for the "solution" proposed
                            is similarly incorrect.  This is certainly
                            the solution Alexander has repeatedly
                            brought up, but there is no basis to say
                            there is broad support for it (though there
                            is some support).  Getting rid of intent
                            limitations without getting rid of blocking
                            privileges is no compromise at all.</font></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal"><font
                              face="verdana, sans-serif">Once again,
                              this proposal is supported by inaccurate
                              and unsupported statements.  </font></span></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal"><font
                              face="verdana, sans-serif">Close to zero
                              burden? Applicants would have a higher
                              burden than before -- the requirement to
                              bargain for the blessing of a government
                              even where their intended use is not
                              associated with that place.</font></span></p>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif"><span
style="font-variant-numeric:normal;font-variant-east-asian:normal;font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal">The
                              assumption that a brand that shares a name
                              with a big city "deliberately chose it" to
                              "profit from the image" of the city and
                              that it's living off of it or
                              "piggybacking' on it is phrased
                              pejoratively, but not in any way proven. 
                              Building on this concept, we get into
                              invented concepts without any basis in law
                              or facts: that there are "</span>certain
                            obligations" a brand has to a city it shares
                            a name with; that the brand is some sort of
                            “co-brand"; that the “real brand” is the
                            city brand.  These are incredibly fact
                            specific assumptions, and even if the facts
                            are as stated, that creates no obligations
                            or privileges.  Furthermore this ignores the
                            issue of generics and other applicants with
                            other issues.  I guess there's no pejorative
                            fable to tell about these applicants...</font></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">The so-called
                             "current WT5 suggestion" is being "floated"
                            largely by Alexander.  In reality, it's a
                            lead balloon and NOT workable.  I would
                            "float" a different "WT5 suggestion" as a
                            compromise:<br>
                          </font></p>
                        <ul>
                          <li><font face="verdana, sans-serif">The
                              status quo did not work and it is not
                              fine.  (Perhaps it worked well for the
                              public authorities; there are numerous
                              applicants that had nightmare scenarios
                              (e.g., TATA)</font></li>
                          <li><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Continue
                              the "intent" limitation in the category
                              “city” and apply the same limitation to
                              subnational regions. (This is a big
                              compromise, since it would really be much
                              more appropriate to deal with these issues
                              on an objection or "after-the-fact" basis)<br>
                            </font></li>
                        </ul>
                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
style="text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">That is my "reach
                            across the aisle" on this point. I am also
                            passionate about the rights of people and
                            public benefit  -- but "geo-uses" does not
                            have a monopoly on either point.<br>
                          </font></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><font
                            face="verdana, sans-serif">As for looking at
                            "geo-names not previously protected" -- I
                            think it would be far more fruitful to start
                            looking at "after-the-fact" solutions for
                            public authorities that feel they actually
                            have been harmed rather than continuing to
                            try to use blocking privileges as a
                            solution.</font><br>
                        </p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;margin:0px;font-size:small;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><br>
                          </span></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;margin:0px;font-size:small;background-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Greg</span></p>
                        <br>
                      </div>
                      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                        <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at
                          4:05 AM, Alexander Schubert <span dir="ltr"><<a
                              href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">alexander@schubert.berlin</a>></span>
                          wrote:<br>
                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                            style="margin:0px 0px 0px
                            0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
                            rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                            <div lang="EN-US">
                              <div
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423WordSection1">
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Dear
                                    Joe,<br>
                                    <br>
                                    thanks for your contribution! You
                                    are stating that you haven’t been
                                    actively involved in the past but
                                    observed. Have you read all emails
                                    and been in all calls? I am asking
                                    because you also state:</span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"
                                  style="margin-left:36pt"><b><i><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,78,121)">
                                        “……the discussions seem to have
                                        only mildly addressed the
                                        thousands of business names
                                        around</span></i></b></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"
                                  style="margin-left:36pt"><b><i><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,78,121)"> 
                                         the world that are trademarked,
                                        that already contain geographic
                                        names, cities and territories….”</span></i></b><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><br>
                                    <br>
                                  </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Well:
                                    For MONTH on end we did practically
                                    nothing else than discussing
                                    precisely that topic. In endless
                                    email exchanges (probably a
                                    thousand) and phone conferences.
                                    This topic has been THE priority so
                                    far. Let me summarize from my view:</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">We
                                    work off the 2012 AGB as a base –
                                    and try to identify areas of
                                    improvement</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">In
                                    the 2012 AGB very few geo names have
                                    been protected, namely:</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Unesco regions
                                    (irrelevant as all are assigned as
                                    gTLD but “.europe”)</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">ISO 3166 Alpha-2
                                    national sub regions (which is why
                                    .tata wasn’t granted to the Indian
                                    TATA and why .bar needed an OK from
                                    the region BAR in ME - <a
                                      href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_3166-2:ME"
                                      target="_blank"
                                      moz-do-not-send="true">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/<wbr>ISO_3166-2:ME</a>)</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Capital cities</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">All
                                    of the above require a letter if
                                    non-objection by the responsible
                                    Government authority – independent
                                    whether or not the applicant claims
                                    geo-use intent or not! And so far
                                    nobody has really much challenged
                                    these rules.</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
                                    ONLY remaining 2012 AGB geo-name
                                    category was “city names” – with
                                    “city” not really very precisely
                                    defined. In the 2012 AGB applicants
                                    for strings identical to a city name
                                    needed Government approval (letter
                                    if non-objection). The only
                                    exception was a declaration of
                                    “non-geo name use”. That could be a
                                    brand, a generic term, or some
                                    “.xyz”-like fun theme: “.heyyou” -
                                    which might be an industrial center
                                    in China (I made that up).</span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">There
                                    are now two main concerns (those of
                                    brands vs.  those who want to
                                    protect the free expression rights
                                    of city populations):</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">There
                                    are potentially hundreds of
                                    thousands qualifying “city names” –
                                    and there is (as you mentioned) a
                                    sizeable overlap with so called
                                    “brands and generic terms! </span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">In
                                    the same time the citizens of
                                    sizeable and or important cities
                                    should have their free speech rights
                                    preserved: that is being able to
                                    express themselves through a domain
                                    name based on their city name – just
                                    like in the future most if not all
                                    big metropolises will offer that
                                    possibility! </span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">So
                                    if somebody would apply for
                                    “.telaviv” (officially Jerusalem is
                                    the capital of Israel) – but claim
                                    “non-geo use” (which might be a
                                    ruse) – then according to the 2012
                                    AGB they would be assigned the TLD
                                    if there was no competition – OR
                                    they could drive up the public
                                    auction price in a bidding war
                                    against a potential city based
                                    non-profit that represents the
                                    city’s constituents but has no VC
                                    cash! Or worse: a financially strong
                                    BRAND could simply outbid the city
                                    based application and hijack the
                                    TLD! I am quite sure that the good
                                    people of Tel Aviv would be very
                                    unhappy – and I wonder how you would
                                    defend the horrible 2012 AGB rules
                                    to them? </span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Plus:
                                    It doesn’t really matters what the
                                    registry “intents” – the registry is
                                    not offering domain names to the
                                    public, nor is it the registrant. It
                                    is the registrars who will offer it
                                    is a city gTLD – and it is
                                    registrants who will use it for that
                                    purpose – and there won’t be any
                                    obligation by ICANN to prevent such
                                    use!</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Some
                                    here claim that “brands” have
                                    “rights” – while citizens of cities
                                    have none. Others claim that this
                                    constitutes a travesty – as most
                                    city name based brands are BASED on
                                    the connotation with the city – and
                                    ICANN’s mission is to foster PUBLIC
                                    BENEFIT (as in helping citizens
                                    executing their right of free
                                    expression) and NOT helping “brands”
                                    to squat on city resources! What is
                                    more important: the “right” of a
                                    small brand – or the rights of
                                    hundreds of thousands of citizens in
                                    a city?</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
                                    entire thing is a question of
                                    “culture” – and like in any OTHER
                                    culture war both sides are very
                                    divided and each is steadfast
                                    convinced to have possession of
                                    endless wisdom (me included).</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">As
                                    this is not an “election” where a
                                    “majority” decides what the future
                                    culture shall be (essentially
                                    picking a “winner” – and creating a
                                    big pool of “losers”)  – we will
                                    need to find an agreeable
                                    compromise!</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
                                    compromise needs to:</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Protect as many
                                    citizens in as many cities as
                                    possible from losing their right of
                                    free expression by using city name
                                    based domains!</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">But to not
                                    overprotect that category – because
                                    it would put too many burdens on
                                    brands and generic term based
                                    applicants!</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">I
                                    am lobbying for a certain workable
                                    solution – and it seems there has
                                    been broad support for it:</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">In order to
                                    prevent citizens from losing their
                                    free speech and free expression
                                    rights permanently we do strike the
                                    “non-geo use” clause without
                                    replacement! (Don’t get a cardiac
                                    arrest – read on).</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">So if somebody
                                    applies for “.telaviv” and claims it
                                    would be a new social network like
                                    TWITTER or a “.xyz” clone – they
                                    would need to get the city’s
                                    approval first – to PROTECT the
                                    citizens free speech and free
                                    expression rights which are very
                                    important!</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">To reduce this new
                                    burden there should be a “cutoff”
                                    implemented: only if the city meets
                                    a certain requirement (e.g. in
                                    population size) the “non-geo use”
                                    would be replaced. In other words:
                                    if a tiny city of no special
                                    relevance has a name identical to a
                                    generic term – applicants for such
                                    generic term do NOT have to approach
                                    the city government IF there is no
                                    intent for geo use! (The Government
                                    of such smaller city will STILL have
                                    to be approached if the gTLD is
                                    intended to serve the city).</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"
                                  style="margin-left:72pt"><span><span>o<span
                                        style="font:7pt "Times New
                                        Roman"">   </span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Such cutoff could
                                    be a population size – the exact
                                    measures would have to be
                                    determined! Numbers between 100,000
                                    and 500,000 have been floated,
                                    and/or percentages of country size!
                                    Once we agree on the cutoff rule;
                                    the exact measures could be defined
                                    later! First qualifying, then
                                    quantifying!</span></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
                                    outcome would be that brands and
                                    generic term based applications have
                                    close to zero extra burden to carry;
                                    while in the same time the free
                                    speech rights and rights of
                                    expression for hundreds of Millions
                                    of people would be preserved in
                                    accordance with ICANN’s mission! In
                                    the very rare cases of a brand
                                    having deliberately chosen a “big
                                    city” name (because they want to
                                    profit from the image the citizens
                                    of that city have worked hard to
                                    create over time) – then sorry: but
                                    nobody forced you to piggyback on
                                    the city’s fame: your own decision;
                                    all legal; but you will still need
                                    to meet certain obligations. You are
                                    just a “co-brand”; the “real brand”
                                    is the city brand; and you are
                                    living “off” it. Then go and get
                                    their permission! But honestly: if
                                    we require only cities with more
                                    than e.g. 500k people to be
                                    specially extra protected (no
                                    “non-geo use clause”) – what is the
                                    number of brands impacted? Could
                                    somebody run a brand name database
                                    against a big city database? And not
                                    every single US $200 TM
                                     registration is a “brand”! </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                                      style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">So
                                      if the 2012 AGB is the base; the
                                      current WT5 suggestion is being
                                      floated:</span></b></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><b><span
                                      style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">Keep
                                      everything like it is! It worked
                                      and it is fine!</span></b></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><b><span
                                      style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">In
                                      the category “city”: elevate
                                      cities that meet a certain
                                      requirement into the same status
                                      as subnational regions or capital
                                      cities! (Meaning: no non-geo-use
                                      clause)</span></b></p>
                                <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423MsoListParagraph"><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7pt
                                        "Times New Roman"">        
                                      </span></span></span><b><span
                                      style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">And
                                      indeed: a city with 500,000 people
                                      should be AS MINIUM as important
                                      as the average capital or a
                                      subnational region! Why should it
                                      be LESS protected, makes no sense!</span></b></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">The
                                    disciples of both faiths are
                                    requested to reach over the isle and
                                    compromise. It doesn’t work in
                                    politics in many countries (I am not
                                    singling any particular country out)
                                    – it doesn’t work in Religions most
                                    of the times.  We at ICANN could
                                    proof that WE can do it. So let’s
                                    simply do it. Both sides have
                                    ENDLESSLY often explained their
                                    views (and I am guilty of having
                                    done so one too often: apologies! I
                                    am passionate when it comes to
                                    rights of people and public
                                    benefit!). <br>
                                    Now it is time to form the
                                    compromise.</span></p>
                                <span
                                  style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><br
                                    clear="all">
                                </span>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
                                  <span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">A
                                    simple to implement suggestion has
                                    been made. Is it workable?<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Anyone in?<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Btw: we are talking CITY names. Once
                                    we have a solution for that specific
                                    category we can look at geo name
                                    categories previously not protected.
                                    But that will be a SEPARATE category
                                    – and should not be conflated with
                                    the city name category!<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Thanks,<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Alexander</span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"><br>
                                    <br>
                                  </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> </span></p>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                                      style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">
                                    Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [mailto:<a
                                      href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
                                      target="_blank"
                                      moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bo<wbr>unces@icann.org</a>]
                                    <b>On Behalf Of </b>Joe Alagna<br>
                                    <b>Sent:</b> Friday, June 22, 2018
                                    9:12 PM<br>
                                    <b>To:</b> <a
                                      href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
                                      target="_blank"
                                      moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a>
                                    Work Track 5 <<a
                                      href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
                                      target="_blank"
                                      moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><wbr>><br>
                                    <b>Subject:</b> Re:
                                    [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] New gTLD
                                    Subsequent Procedures PDP: Work
                                    Track 5 Comments</span></p>
                                <div>
                                  <div
                                    class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-h5">
                                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                                    <div>
                                      <div>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Hi
                                            All,</span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)"> </span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Although,
                                            because of time obligations,
                                            I have not commented, I have
                                            been an observer of this
                                            track since the beginning
                                            and recently converted to
                                            member so I could make a
                                            comment.  </span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)"> </span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">I
                                            would like to pose several
                                            questions and
                                            considerations.  Please
                                            accept my apologies if some
                                            of my comments have already
                                            been discussed since I have
                                            been unable to join the
                                            telephonic discussions.  I
                                            have perused the ongoing
                                            document you are developing
                                            within the limits of my
                                            time. </span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)"> </span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">These
                                            questions and considerations
                                            are meant in the spirit of
                                            contributing and stimulating
                                            discussion, not necessarily
                                            advocating a position.  The
                                            work you are doing is
                                            important.  Please note that
                                            these are my own
                                            observations and comments,
                                            not necessarily reflective
                                            of the company I work for:</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">1.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Some
                                            members are advocating to
                                            reserve city and territory
                                            names as rights or even as
                                            owned by the cities or
                                            territories.  I’ve always
                                            understood city and
                                            territory names as tools to
                                            be used by the public for
                                            geographic purposes. In
                                            fact, unless I missed it (I
                                            may have), the discussions
                                            seem to have only mildly
                                            addressed the thousands of
                                            business names around the
                                            world that are trademarked,
                                            that already contain
                                            geographic names, cities and
                                            territories.  You can look
                                            at any database of
                                            trademarks from any
                                            jurisdiction around the
                                            world and likely find
                                            hundreds of existing
                                            trademarks that contain
                                            geographic strings.  Strings
                                            like this are highly
                                            important as parts of
                                            business names, identifying
                                            the locations of service
                                            areas for example.  These
                                            include names like Swiss Air
                                            and American Telephone and
                                            Telegraph.  I use that
                                            second example to show how
                                            long-standing this tradition
                                            is.  This fact seems
                                            unacknowledged so far in our
                                            discussions.  I fear that we
                                            are ignoring a hundred years
                                            + of tradition and
                                            precedence. It may be an
                                            important exercise to see
                                            how many trademarks already
                                            exist in various places that
                                            contain geo-type strings.<br>
                                            <br>
                                            The history of registries
                                            suggests that they may
                                            either be public or private,
                                            so it seems that the
                                            principal of neutrality is
                                            important when considering
                                            the type of entity applying
                                            for a string.</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="margin-bottom:12pt;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">2.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">There
                                            is a theme of debate about
                                            who gets preference
                                            regarding geographic
                                            indicators in new strings,
                                            government entities or
                                            private entities.  My
                                            experience, at least in the
                                            United States is that many
                                            government entities do not
                                            care about their geographic
                                            names (and for that matter,
                                            their email addresses). They
                                            seem to be perfectly happy
                                            using what I would consider
                                            seriously outdated URLs and
                                            email addresses.  <br>
                                            <br>
                                            These government entities
                                            already have the right to
                                            use a .gov (or a .edu)
                                            domain name and email
                                            address, a right that any
                                            private citizen or public
                                            company does not have.  Yet
                                            they prefer not to use
                                            them.  <br>
                                            <br>
                                            The example I have in mind
                                            is the several thousand
                                            public schools across the
                                            United States who prefer to
                                            continue using long URLS and
                                            email addresses in the .edu
                                            or .us space.  A very
                                            typical teacher or
                                            administrative email address
                                            looks like this:<br>
                                            <br>
                                          </span><span
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msohyperlink"><b><u><span
style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(5,99,193)"><a
href="mailto:MyKidTeachersFirstName.LastName@LaUnifiedSchoolDistrict.k12.ca.us"
                                                    target="_blank"
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">MyKidTeachersFirstName.LastNam<wbr>e@LaUnifiedSchoolDistrict.k12.<wbr>ca.us</span></a></span></u></b></span><b><span
style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)"><br>
                                            </span></b><span
                                            style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)"><br>
                                          </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">They
                                            don’t seem to want to change
                                            this.  Wouldn’t it be better
                                            and more convenient for them
                                            to use something like:<br>
                                            <br>
                                          </span><span
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msohyperlink"><b><u><span
style="font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(5,99,193)"><a
                                                    href="mailto:MyKidsTeachersName@LAUnified.gov"
                                                    target="_blank"
                                                    moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">MyKidsTeachersName@LAUnified.g<wbr>ov</span></a></span></u></b></span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">
                                            (or .edu) anything less than
                                            a fourth level domain name? 
                                            So…</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">3.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Should
                                            not ICANN remain completely
                                            unbiased as to who gets the
                                            ability to apply for
                                            specific strings related to
                                            names in the DNS?          
                                          </span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">a.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Since
                                            many government, city, and
                                            territorial entities are not
                                            engaged nor involved in this
                                            process, </span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">b.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Since
                                            both private and public
                                            entities can be good or
                                            evil, and </span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">c.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Since
                                            ICANN has a charter of a
                                            bottom up, community driven,
                                            process, not the creation of
                                            laws or rights    <br>
                                            <br>
                                            Why should ICANN, in any way
                                            confer a preference to
                                            either type of entity?  In
                                            fact, some in this
                                            discussion seem to be
                                            suggesting an assumed
                                            “ownership” of TLD strings,
                                            a right that I think can
                                            only be conferred on a hyper
                                            local level by the proper
                                            legal entities, certainly
                                            not ICANN, therefore, </span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">4.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Shouldn’t
                                            we be careful not to try to
                                            confer preferences or
                                            “rights” at all?  In fact,
                                            shouldn’t we not even try
                                            that?  It seems that we do
                                            not, and probably should not
                                            have that power.</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">5.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">There
                                            has been discussion that any
                                            applicant should comply with
                                            local laws in areas, cities,
                                            or territories where a
                                            string name where they would
                                            like to do work is
                                            relevant.  <i>I would agree
                                              with that general
                                              principal</i> since it
                                            respects local laws, makes
                                            sense, and doesn’t try to
                                            rule the world.</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">6.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Shouldn’t
                                            we <u>not</u> assume that
                                            every government entity
                                            around the world cares about
                                            what we are doing here.  In
                                            fact, I am sure that most
                                            don’t care – at least as
                                            much as we do.  If they did
                                            care, they would be
                                            involved.  <br>
                                            <br>
                                            We know that TLDs are
                                            important and we should care
                                            about and anticipate how
                                            geographic names affect
                                            cities and territories
                                            around the world. We should
                                            also care about how a
                                            country, city, or
                                            territory’s rights will
                                            affect any applicant in the
                                            future. But we should not
                                            show a preference in our
                                            policy, therefore, four
                                            suggestions:</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">a.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">A
                                            general preference for
                                            non-objection from
                                            geo-entities and curative
                                            solutions in policy over
                                            preventive solutions for
                                            potential geographic
                                            strings; not assuming
                                            preferences that more often
                                            than not, don't exist </span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">b.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">A
                                            more conservative approach
                                            to our scope in terms of the
                                            places we define</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">c.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Recognizing
                                            that our contracts are time
                                            limited – We should
                                            recognize that our contracts
                                            are for a specified period,
                                            at the end of which, a
                                            government entity may have
                                            the option of becoming
                                            engaged and maybe add
                                            something to the contract
                                            that specifies this rather
                                            than an assumption of
                                            renewal for applicants. 
                                            This would allow for
                                            worthwhile private
                                            investment (maybe a five or
                                            ten-year period) and allow
                                            review by any public entity
                                            after a period of time, to
                                            become involved if they then
                                            care to.</span></p>
                                        <p
class="m_7933093344519172564m_3178918718589078034gmail-m_9197942923286125423gmail-msolistparagraph"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">d.</span><span
style="font-size:7pt;line-height:115%;color:rgb(11,83,148)">      </span><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">There
                                            should be no limits on how
                                            many applications may be
                                            filed on behalf of a single
                                            entity (private, corporate,
                                            or government).  If we do
                                            this, here also, we limit
                                            the capital involved in the
                                            process and we limit the
                                            chances for success of
                                            applicants and of this
                                            program in general.</span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                                          style="line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11pt;line-height:115%;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">Finally,
                                            thank you to all of you, on
                                            all sides, for your
                                            discussion and
                                            participation.  I believe
                                            this discussion is an
                                            important one and I know the
                                            sacrifice you are making in
                                            terms of your time.  I only
                                            wish I was able to
                                            contribute near as much time
                                            as all of you have.  Thank
                                            you!</span></p>
                                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                            style="color:rgb(11,83,148)"><br
                                              clear="all">
                                          </span></p>
                                      </div>
                                      <div>
                                        <div>
                                          <div>
                                            <div>
                                              <div>
                                                <div>
                                                  <div>
                                                    <div>
                                                      <div>
                                                        <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <p><span
                                                          style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Joe
                                                          Alagna   </span></p>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                        </div>
                                                      </div>
                                                    </div>
                                                  </div>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </div>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <br>
                            ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
                            Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 mailing list<br>
                            <a
                              href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
                            <a
                              href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5"
                              rel="noreferrer" target="_blank"
                              moz-do-not-send="true">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/l<wbr>istinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5</a><br>
                          </blockquote>
                        </div>
                        <br>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                    <br>
                    <fieldset
                      class="m_7933093344519172564mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
                    <br>
                    <pre>______________________________<wbr>_________________
Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 mailing list
<a class="m_7933093344519172564moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a>
<a class="m_7933093344519172564moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5</a></pre>
                  </blockquote>
                  <br>
                </div>
              </div>
            </div>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>