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<p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Hi Jorge. I just have
a thought on #4.</font></p>
<p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"> It would be nice if
deferring to local laws was agreed upon, but would that be
considered "fair" if one locality defined city as something that
could be rather small but with a unique feature and another
locality defined city as something that had to be very large,
i.e. certain number of people or certain area? I tossed some of
the wikipedia site you sent around the other day in Italian re:
definition of cities (my Italian is also non-existant) and here
is part of what it says.<br>
</font></p>
<p><span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;">"Of the title of city, in Italy, you can boast those municipalities that have been awarded with the decree of the King (until 1946) or the provisional head of the state (until 1948) or the president of the Republic, by virtue of their historical importance , artistic, civic or demographic. </span><span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;"><span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;">Many other cities are given the title by virtue of legislative acts of pre-unification states, or they do so for ancient and uninterrupted custom ....</span>." (<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titolo_di_citt%C3%A0_in_Italia">https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titolo_di_citt%C3%A0_in_Italia</a>)</span></p>
<p><span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;"><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">I don't think that sort of think applies anywhere in North America. </font></span><span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;"><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">In Canada, it is the provinces that define cities, not the federal state, and I am sure artistic elements aren't part of it.</font></font></span></p>
<p><span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;"><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif"><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">#4 in the list below, which I am addressing, refers to defining a "city name". Is that considered to be an operation different from defining a "city." Can anyone elaborate?
</font></font></span></p>
<span style="display: inline !important; float: none; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(33, 33, 33); font-family: arial,sans-serif; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: 24px; orphans: 2; text-align: left; text-decoration: none; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; white-space: pre-wrap; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;">Marita
</span><br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/26/2018 12:45 PM,
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch">Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch</a> wrote:<br>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Dear Greg and all<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Maybe we may slowly creating some common
ground…
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Yesterday in the cross-community discussion
there were ideas (some I proposed myself) such as
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">(1) setting a deadline for reacting to a letter
of non-objection request;
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">(2) establishing that application may go
forward if there is no reaction by the relevant pubic
authority within that set deadline; <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">(3) helping the applicant in determining
whether the intended string is a city name or not; this
could be done by an advisory body bound to confidentiality;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">(4) creating greater predictability by
deferring to local laws and policies defining what a “city
name” is in each jurisdiction… something that in the age of
big data should be rather simple… <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">(5) helping the applicant in identifying the
relevant public authorities, and in establishing contact
with them;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">(6) establishing mediation or other
dispute-resolution procedures when the applicant disagrees
with the position taken by the relevant authority…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">These are all means to address some of the
issues alleged on the functioning of the
“non-objection”-letter framework, and to raise
predictability and certainty for all parties, without
breaking this model that in general (with some limited
exceptions) worked well according to the reported data and
facts.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Hope this may be helpful<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Best<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US">Jorge
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="DE">Von:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="DE"> Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org">mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>Im Auftrag von </b>Greg Shatan<br>
<b>Gesendet:</b> Dienstag, 26. Juni 2018 11:32<br>
<b>An:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin">alexander@schubert.berlin</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Icann Gnso Newgtld Wg Wt5
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"><gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org></a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] New gTLD
Subsequent Procedures PDP: Work Track 5 Comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 8:01 AM,
Alexander Schubert <<a
href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">alexander@schubert.berlin</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><br>
<br>
Maybe somebody “neutral” could summarize the
suggested measures for the <b>treatment of
(non-capital) cities</b>? Right now an
applicant (for a non-capital city) requires
Government support only if there is geo-use
intent!
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="m-6527692980300388464msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol"
lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Do we keep it that way,
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="m-6527692980300388464msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol"
lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">do we protect important (e.g.
sizeable) cities a bit more,
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="m-6527692980300388464msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol"
lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">or do we skip the protections
completely?
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Seems these are the 3 choices. In
MY view!</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"></span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"
lang="EN-US">I would say there are more
choices, or at least more variations, based on
the type of mechanism used. There are
mechanisms that come before the application is
filed (e.g., the letter of
consent/non-objection), mechanisms that come
after the application is filed but during the
application process (e.g., objections, and
also letters of c/n-o if it's determined you
must have one), and mechanisms that come after
the TLD is delegated (Compliance issues,
Dispute Resolution Procedures).
</span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"
lang="EN-US">In some of these mechanisms, the
"protectable right" is presumed (letter of
consent/non-objection) and in others the
"protectable right" must be proven (basically,
all of the other mechanisms). How these
variables could apply to protection of a
category of geographic terms is critical.
"Protection" could be acceptable with one set
of variables and unacceptable with another set
of variables. For example, the right to make
an objection may be an acceptable protection
where a letter of c/n-j is not. </span>
<span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"
lang="EN-US">If we frame this only as a choice
between letters of consent/non-objection or no
"protection" at all, the likelihood of
reaching consensus drops drastically. We need
to add methods of protection to the discussion
of whether not protections should be granted
in order to have the best chance of reaching
consensus.</span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"
lang="EN-US">Greg</span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"></span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif;color:blue"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"></span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"></span><span
style="font-family:"Verdana",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [mailto:<a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Heather Forrest<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 26, 2018 12:42 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Marita Moll <<a
href="mailto:mmoll@ca.inter.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">mmoll@ca.inter.net</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a></span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5]
New gTLD Subsequent Procedures PDP: Work
Track 5 Comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">Dear WT5 colleagues,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">Based on the summary of the
Cross Community Topic that is taking
place right now in Panama City ICANN62,
and the discussions in the Working Group
to this point, I do not agree with the
assessment in Alexander's email that the
WT5 current position is: "
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;background:white"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">So if the 2012 AGB is the
base; the current WT5 suggestion is
being floated:</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464gmail-m5457115079430354207msolistparagraph"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:36.0pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol"
lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt" lang="EN-US"> </span><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Keep everything like it
is! It worked and it is fine!</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464gmail-m5457115079430354207msolistparagraph"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:36.0pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol"
lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt" lang="EN-US"> </span><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">In the category “city”:
elevate cities that meet a certain
requirement into the same status as
subnational regions or capital cities!
(Meaning: no non-geo-use clause)</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464gmail-m5457115079430354207msolistparagraph"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:36.0pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;background:white;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol"
lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt" lang="EN-US"> </span><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">And indeed: a city with
500,000 people should be AS MINIUM as
important as the average capital or a
subnational region! Why should it be
LESS protected, makes no sense!"</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">This may be a proposal or
suggestion, but to be very clear, it is
not an agreed position of WT5 members,
nor indeed of the broader community
participating in today's Cross Community
Topic workshop.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">Kind regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">Heather Forrest<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at
8:47 AM, Marita Moll <<a
href="mailto:mmoll@ca.inter.net"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">mmoll@ca.inter.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
#CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span lang="EN-US">Thanks for this
summary Alexander. I agree with most
of this.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US">Not totally happy
with "</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">To reduce this new
burden there should be a “cutoff”
implemented: only if the city meets
a certain requirement (e.g. in
population size) the “non-geo use”
would be replaced. In other words:
if a tiny city of no special
relevance has a name identical to a
generic term – applicants for such
generic term do NOT have to approach
the city government IF there is no
intent for geo use! (The Government
of such smaller city will STILL have
to be approached if the gTLD is
intended to serve the city)." </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US">But, as you say,
there has to be compromise. I wish
there was a way to protect special
places which have had a glorious
past but are now reduced to out of
the way tourist sites (ancient
Etruscan city Volterra) -- but this
may be addressed through UNESCO
regions -- not sure about that.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US">If we can protect
cities of 500,000 and over, that
will be around 1000 strings and a
huge number of people. I am sure
brands can adjust.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style="color:#888888"
lang="EN-US">Marita</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US">On 6/25/2018 5:05
AM, Alexander Schubert wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Dear Joe,<br>
<br>
thanks for your
contribution! You are
stating that you haven’t
been actively involved in
the past but observed. Have
you read all emails and been
in all calls? I am asking
because you also state:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><b><i><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"
lang="EN-US">“……the
discussions seem to have
only mildly addressed
the thousands of
business names around</span></i></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><i><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F4E79"
lang="EN-US"> the
world that are
trademarked, that
already contain
geographic names, cities
and territories….”</span></i></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Well: For MONTH
on end we did practically
nothing else than discussing
precisely that topic. In
endless email exchanges
(probably a thousand) and
phone conferences. This
topic has been THE priority
so far. Let me summarize
from my view:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">We work off the
2012 AGB as a base – and try
to identify areas of
improvement</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">In the 2012 AGB
very few geo names have been
protected, namely:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Unesco regions
(irrelevant as all are
assigned as gTLD but
“.europe”)</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">ISO 3166
Alpha-2 national sub regions
(which is why .tata wasn’t
granted to the Indian TATA
and why .bar needed an OK
from the region BAR in ME -
<a
href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_3166-2:ME"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_3166-2:ME</a>)</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Capital cities</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">All of the
above require a letter if
non-objection by the
responsible Government
authority – independent
whether or not the applicant
claims geo-use intent or
not! And so far nobody has
really much challenged these
rules.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">The ONLY
remaining 2012 AGB geo-name
category was “city names” –
with “city” not really very
precisely defined. In the
2012 AGB applicants for
strings identical to a city
name needed Government
approval (letter if
non-objection). The only
exception was a declaration
of “non-geo name use”. That
could be a brand, a generic
term, or some “.xyz”-like
fun theme: “.heyyou” - which
might be an industrial
center in China (I made that
up).</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">There are now
two main concerns (those of
brands vs. those who want
to protect the free
expression rights of city
populations):</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">There are
potentially hundreds of
thousands qualifying “city
names” – and there is (as
you mentioned) a sizeable
overlap with so called
“brands and generic terms!
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">In the same
time the citizens of
sizeable and or important
cities should have their
free speech rights
preserved: that is being
able to express themselves
through a domain name based
on their city name – just
like in the future most if
not all big metropolises
will offer that possibility!
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">So if somebody
would apply for “.telaviv”
(officially Jerusalem is the
capital of Israel) – but
claim “non-geo use” (which
might be a ruse) – then
according to the 2012 AGB
they would be assigned the
TLD if there was no
competition – OR they could
drive up the public auction
price in a bidding war
against a potential city
based non-profit that
represents the city’s
constituents but has no VC
cash! Or worse: a
financially strong BRAND
could simply outbid the city
based application and hijack
the TLD! I am quite sure
that the good people of Tel
Aviv would be very unhappy –
and I wonder how you would
defend the horrible 2012 AGB
rules to them?
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Plus: It
doesn’t really matters what
the registry “intents” – the
registry is not offering
domain names to the public,
nor is it the registrant. It
is the registrars who will
offer it is a city gTLD –
and it is registrants who
will use it for that purpose
– and there won’t be any
obligation by ICANN to
prevent such use!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Some here claim
that “brands” have “rights”
– while citizens of cities
have none. Others claim that
this constitutes a travesty
– as most city name based
brands are BASED on the
connotation with the city –
and ICANN’s mission is to
foster PUBLIC BENEFIT (as in
helping citizens executing
their right of free
expression) and NOT helping
“brands” to squat on city
resources! What is more
important: the “right” of a
small brand – or the rights
of hundreds of thousands of
citizens in a city?</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">The entire
thing is a question of
“culture” – and like in any
OTHER culture war both sides
are very divided and each is
steadfast convinced to have
possession of endless wisdom
(me included).</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">As this is not
an “election” where a
“majority” decides what the
future culture shall be
(essentially picking a
“winner” – and creating a
big pool of “losers”) – we
will need to find an
agreeable compromise!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">The compromise
needs to:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Protect as many
citizens in as many cities
as possible from losing
their right of free
expression by using city
name based domains!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">But to not
overprotect that category –
because it would put too
many burdens on brands and
generic term based
applicants!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">I am lobbying
for a certain workable
solution – and it seems
there has been broad support
for it:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">In order to
prevent citizens from losing
their free speech and free
expression rights
permanently we do strike the
“non-geo use” clause without
replacement! (Don’t get a
cardiac arrest – read on).</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">So if somebody
applies for “.telaviv” and
claims it would be a new
social network like TWITTER
or a “.xyz” clone – they
would need to get the city’s
approval first – to PROTECT
the citizens free speech and
free expression rights which
are very important!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">To reduce this
new burden there should be a
“cutoff” implemented: only
if the city meets a certain
requirement (e.g. in
population size) the
“non-geo use” would be
replaced. In other words: if
a tiny city of no special
relevance has a name
identical to a generic term
– applicants for such
generic term do NOT have to
approach the city government
IF there is no intent for
geo use! (The Government of
such smaller city will STILL
have to be approached if the
gTLD is intended to serve
the city).</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"
style="margin-left:72.0pt">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier
New",serif"
lang="EN-US">o</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Such cutoff
could be a population size –
the exact measures would
have to be determined!
Numbers between 100,000 and
500,000 have been floated,
and/or percentages of
country size! Once we agree
on the cutoff rule; the
exact measures could be
defined later! First
qualifying, then
quantifying!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">The outcome
would be that brands and
generic term based
applications have close to
zero extra burden to carry;
while in the same time the
free speech rights and
rights of expression for
hundreds of Millions of
people would be preserved in
accordance with ICANN’s
mission! In the very rare
cases of a brand having
deliberately chosen a “big
city” name (because they
want to profit from the
image the citizens of that
city have worked hard to
create over time) – then
sorry: but nobody forced you
to piggyback on the city’s
fame: your own decision; all
legal; but you will still
need to meet certain
obligations. You are just a
“co-brand”; the “real brand”
is the city brand; and you
are living “off” it. Then go
and get their permission!
But honestly: if we require
only cities with more than
e.g. 500k people to be
specially extra protected
(no “non-geo use clause”) –
what is the number of brands
impacted? Could somebody run
a brand name database
against a big city database?
And not every single US $200
TM registration is a
“brand”!
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">So if the
2012 AGB is the base; the
current WT5 suggestion is
being floated:</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">Keep
everything like it is! It
worked and it is fine!</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">In the
category “city”: elevate
cities that meet a certain
requirement into the same
status as subnational
regions or capital cities!
(Meaning: no non-geo-use
clause)</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348msolistparagraph"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol" lang="EN-US">·</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt"
lang="EN-US">
</span><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">And indeed: a
city with 500,000 people
should be AS MINIUM as
important as the average
capital or a subnational
region! Why should it be
LESS protected, makes no
sense!</span></b><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">The disciples
of both faiths are requested
to reach over the isle and
compromise. It doesn’t work
in politics in many
countries (I am not singling
any particular country out)
– it doesn’t work in
Religions most of the
times. We at ICANN could
proof that WE can do it. So
let’s simply do it. Both
sides have ENDLESSLY often
explained their views (and I
am guilty of having done so
one too often: apologies! I
am passionate when it comes
to rights of people and
public benefit!).
<br>
Now it is time to form the
compromise.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"><br clear="all">
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">A simple to
implement suggestion has
been made. Is it workable?<br>
<br>
Anyone in?<br>
<br>
Btw: we are talking CITY
names. Once we have a
solution for that specific
category we can look at geo
name categories previously
not protected. But that will
be a SEPARATE category – and
should not be conflated with
the city name category!<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
<br>
Alexander</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">
Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [<a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Joe
Alagna<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, June
22, 2018 9:12 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a>
Work Track 5
<a
href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re:
[Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] New
gTLD Subsequent Procedures
PDP: Work Track 5 Comments</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Hi All,</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Although,
because of time
obligations, I have not
commented, I have been
an observer of this
track since the
beginning and recently
converted to member so I
could make a comment. </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">I would
like to pose several
questions and
considerations. Please
accept my apologies if
some of my comments have
already been discussed
since I have been unable
to join the telephonic
discussions. I have
perused the ongoing
document you are
developing within the
limits of my time.
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"> </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">These
questions and
considerations are meant
in the spirit of
contributing and
stimulating discussion,
not necessarily
advocating a position.
The work you are doing
is important. Please
note that these are my
own observations and
comments, not
necessarily reflective
of the company I work
for:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">1.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Some
members are advocating
to reserve city and
territory names as
rights or even as owned
by the cities or
territories. I’ve
always understood city
and territory names as
tools to be used by the
public for geographic
purposes. In fact,
unless I missed it (I
may have), the
discussions seem to have
only mildly addressed
the thousands of
business names around
the world that are
trademarked, that
already contain
geographic names, cities
and territories. You
can look at any database
of trademarks from any
jurisdiction around the
world and likely find
hundreds of existing
trademarks that contain
geographic strings.
Strings like this are
highly important as
parts of business names,
identifying the
locations of service
areas for example.
These include names like
Swiss Air and American
Telephone and
Telegraph. I use that
second example to show
how long-standing this
tradition is. This fact
seems unacknowledged so
far in our discussions.
I fear that we are
ignoring a hundred years
+ of tradition and
precedence. It may be an
important exercise to
see how many trademarks
already exist in various
places that contain
geo-type strings.<br>
<br>
The history of
registries suggests that
they may either be
public or private, so it
seems that the principal
of neutrality is
important when
considering the type of
entity applying for a
string.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="margin-bottom:12.0pt;line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">2.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">There is a
theme of debate about
who gets preference
regarding geographic
indicators in new
strings, government
entities or private
entities. My
experience, at least in
the United States is
that many government
entities do not care
about their geographic
names (and for that
matter, their email
addresses). They seem to
be perfectly happy using
what I would consider
seriously outdated URLs
and email addresses. <br>
<br>
These government
entities already have
the right to use a .gov
(or a .edu) domain name
and email address, a
right that any private
citizen or public
company does not have.
Yet they prefer not to
use them.
<br>
<br>
The example I have in
mind is the several
thousand public schools
across the United States
who prefer to continue
using long URLS and
email addresses in the
.edu or .us space. A
very typical teacher or
administrative email
address looks like this:<br>
<br>
</span><span
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msohyperlink"><b><u><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0563C1"
lang="EN-US"><a
href="mailto:MyKidTeachersFirstName.LastName@LaUnifiedSchoolDistrict.k12.ca.us"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:#0563C1">MyKidTeachersFirstName.LastName@LaUnifiedSchoolDistrict.k12.ca.us</span></a></span></u></b></span><b><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"><br>
</span></b><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"><br>
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">They don’t
seem to want to change
this. Wouldn’t it be
better and more
convenient for them to
use something like:<br>
<br>
</span><span
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msohyperlink"><b><u><span
style="font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0563C1"
lang="EN-US"><a
href="mailto:MyKidsTeachersName@LAUnified.gov"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true"><span style="color:#0563C1">MyKidsTeachersName@LAUnified.gov</span></a></span></u></b></span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"> (or .edu)
anything less than a
fourth level domain
name? So…</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">3.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Should not
ICANN remain completely
unbiased as to who gets
the ability to apply for
specific strings related
to names in the
DNS?
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">a.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Since many
government, city, and
territorial entities are
not engaged nor involved
in this process,
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">b.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Since both
private and public
entities can be good or
evil, and
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">c.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Since ICANN
has a charter of a
bottom up, community
driven, process, not the
creation of laws or
rights
<br>
<br>
Why should ICANN, in any
way confer a preference
to either type of
entity? In fact, some
in this discussion seem
to be suggesting an
assumed “ownership” of
TLD strings, a right
that I think can only be
conferred on a hyper
local level by the
proper legal entities,
certainly not ICANN,
therefore, </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">4.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Shouldn’t
we be careful not to try
to confer preferences or
“rights” at all? In
fact, shouldn’t we not
even try that? It seems
that we do not, and
probably should not have
that power.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">5.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">There has
been discussion that any
applicant should comply
with local laws in
areas, cities, or
territories where a
string name where they
would like to do work is
relevant. <i>I would
agree with that
general principal</i>
since it respects local
laws, makes sense, and
doesn’t try to rule the
world.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">6.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Shouldn’t
we
<u>not</u> assume that
every government entity
around the world cares
about what we are doing
here. In fact, I am
sure that most don’t
care – at least as much
as we do. If they did
care, they would be
involved.
<br>
<br>
We know that TLDs are
important and we should
care about and
anticipate how
geographic names affect
cities and territories
around the world. We
should also care about
how a country, city, or
territory’s rights will
affect any applicant in
the future. But we
should not show a
preference in our
policy, therefore, four
suggestions:</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">a.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">A general
preference for
non-objection from
geo-entities and
curative solutions in
policy over preventive
solutions for potential
geographic strings; not
assuming preferences
that more often than
not, don't exist </span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">b.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">A more
conservative approach to
our scope in terms of
the places we define</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">c.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Recognizing
that our contracts are
time limited – We should
recognize that our
contracts are for a
specified period, at the
end of which, a
government entity may
have the option of
becoming engaged and
maybe add something to
the contract that
specifies this rather
than an assumption of
renewal for applicants.
This would allow for
worthwhile private
investment (maybe a five
or ten-year period) and
allow review by any
public entity after a
period of time, to
become involved if they
then care to.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
class="m-6527692980300388464m8814042535565957348gmail-msolistparagraph"
style="line-height:115%">
<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">d.</span><span
style="font-size:7.0pt;line-height:115%;color:#0B5394" lang="EN-US">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">There
should be no limits on
how many applications
may be filed on behalf
of a single entity
(private, corporate, or
government). If we do
this, here also, we
limit the capital
involved in the process
and we limit the chances
for success of
applicants and of this
program in general.</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:115%"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;line-height:115%;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US">Finally,
thank you to all of you,
on all sides, for your
discussion and
participation. I
believe this discussion
is an important one and
I know the sacrifice you
are making in terms of
your time. I only wish
I was able to contribute
near as much time as all
of you have. Thank you!</span><span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
style="color:#0B5394"
lang="EN-US"><br
clear="all">
</span><span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
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<div>
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<div>
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<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D"
lang="EN-US">Joe
Alagna </span>
<span
lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
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</div>
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<pre><span lang="EN-US">_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
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style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
lang="EN-US"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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