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+1 Marita and +1 Nick
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<div class="">Let’s try to improve but we do not need to go overboard. </div>
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<div class="">Best,</div>
<div class="">Rosalía<br class="">
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<div class="">On Aug 9, 2018, at 9:58 PM, Nick Wenban-Smith <<a href="mailto:Nick.Wenban-Smith@nominet.uk" class="">Nick.Wenban-Smith@nominet.uk</a>> wrote:</div>
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<span style="color: windowtext;" class="">I agree with Marita here.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="color: windowtext;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
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<span style="color: windowtext;" class="">Obviously I think that country and territory names fall outside the GNSO policy framework. But to include all translations into every language worldwide seems excessive. Apart from anything else how could that even
be checked?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="color: windowtext;" class="">Official and relevant languages or similar to keep it on point seems an improvement over the 2012 round.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="color: windowtext;" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
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<b class=""><span lang="EN-US" style="color: windowtext;" class="">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="color: windowtext;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 <<a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org" class="">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On
Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Marita Moll<br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>09 August 2018 15:50<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org" class="">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] [Ext] AW: Additional Input Requested - "in any language"<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
<p class=""><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__unstats.un.org_unsd_geoinfo_UNGEGN_docs_26th-2Dgegn-2Ddocs_WP_WP54-5FUNGEGN-2520WG-2520Country-2520Names-2520Document-25202011.pdf&d=DwMGaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mBQzlSaM6eYCHFBU-v48zs-QSrjHB0aWmHuE4X4drzI&m=3RBrAW4mWZcTPVfCD2YJOz3VODn7HkbFx9d59ip1OQ8&s=TLfnTlAegQWCm3YnzQVenw5bkmrnQzGkY0wNxKVA34Y&e=" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><i class=""><span style="color: rgb(17, 85, 204); background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Working
Paper 54</span></i><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[unstats.un.org]</a><i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>is
a fascinating resource. It does not appear difficult to identify the national official languages of countries.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></p>
<p class="">But it has problems. I looked at India which lists English and Hindi as official languages. But they don't list the 12 official regional languages like Urdu, Bengali, Punjabi -- many thousands of people speak these languages and I don't see how
we could disenfranchise them. So I am going to go for "official and commonly spoken languages" or "official and relevant languages." I could also go for "any language" but that's a big door to open.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
<p class="">Marita<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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On 8/9/2018 4:35 PM, Emily Barabas wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Hi Jorge,<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Thanks for laying out these options in a clear format. Perhaps it indeed does make sense to take a step back and focus not on the text suggested earlier in the week, but on the alternatives raised:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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(1) maintain “all languages”<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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(2) official languages and official UN languages<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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(3) some intermediate solution covering all languages commonly used in a given country to identify its name… (there could be several options: “common languages”; “commonly used languages”; “relevant national, regional and community languages”, etc.)<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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All are encouraged to provide feedback.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Kind regards,<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Emily<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<b class=""><span style="font-size: 12pt;" class="">From:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span style="font-size: 12pt;" class=""><a href="mailto:Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">"Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch"</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch></a><br class="">
<b class="">Date:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Thursday, 9 August 2018 at 16:30<br class="">
<b class="">To:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Emily Barabas<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:emily.barabas@icann.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><emily.barabas@icann.org></a>,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">"gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org></a><br class="">
<b class="">Subject:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>[Ext] AW: Additional Input Requested - "in any language"</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Dear Emily</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">As a threshold consideration: as there is no clear “room consensus” on this question I feel that there should be no preference given to any of the, as I see, three main options at hand: (1) maintain “all languages”;
(2) official languages and official UN languages; (3) some intermediate solution covering all languages commonly used in a given country to identify its name… (there could be several options: “common languages”; “commonly used languages”; “relevant national,
regional and community languages”, etc.)</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Therefore either we have the AGB (amended) language for the three main options or we have it for none. We cannot just have the amended language as “suggested recommendation” reflecting only option (2) above.</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Thanks for considering and best regards</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Jorge<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<b class=""><span lang="DE" class="">Von:</span></b><span lang="DE" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org></a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">Im
Auftrag von<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Emily Barabas<br class="">
<b class="">Gesendet:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Donnerstag, 9. August 2018 15:44<br class="">
<b class="">An:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br class="">
<b class="">Betreff:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] Additional Input Requested - "in any language"</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Dear all,<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On our call yesterday there was some robust discussion about draft recommendations 3, 4, and 6, which suggest changing “in any language” to “official languages of the country and the official UN languages” for several AGB categories. Please reply to this thread
to provide additional input on the suggested edits or alternate options listed at the bottom of this message. For reference, here is an excerpt of AGB text with redline reflecting suggested recommendations:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<b class=""><i class=""><span style="color: rgb(127, 127, 127);" class="">2.2.1.4.1 Treatment of Country or Territory Names</span></i></b><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<i class="">Applications for strings that are country or territory names will not be approved, as they are not available under the New gTLD Program in this application round. A string shall be considered to be a country or territory name if: </i><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<i class="">it is a long-form name listed in the ISO 3166-1 standard, or a translation of the long-form name in <s class="">any language</s> </i><i class=""><span style="color: red;" class="">official languages of the country and the official UN languages</span></i><i class="">.</i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 3.25pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<i class="">it is a short-form name listed in the ISO 3166-1 standard, or a translation of the short-form name in <s class="">any language</s> </i><i class=""><span style="color: red;" class="">official languages of the country and the official UN languages</span></i><i class="">.</i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 3.25pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<i class="">it is a separable component of a country name designated on the “Separable Country Names List,” or is a translation of a name appearing on the list, in <s class="">any language</s> </i><i class=""><span style="color: red;" class="">official languages
of the country and the official UN languages</span></i><i class="">. See the Annex at the end of this module.</i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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Below you will find an excerpt from the Working Document (<a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__docs.google.com_document_d_1BRzHr2FxSTYHX1I8F3FHSt6Bo1cvJsKyWX8WZXRUXAo_edit&d=DwMGaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mBQzlSaM6eYCHFBU-v48zs-QSrjHB0aWmHuE4X4drzI&m=3RBrAW4mWZcTPVfCD2YJOz3VODn7HkbFx9d59ip1OQ8&s=tgdbEifJR44Y-36ksHnuVZJ06y9V_-KbnoOXh1NYOsU&e=" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BRzHr2FxSTYHX1I8F3FHSt6Bo1cvJsKyWX8WZXRUXAo/edit
[docs.google.com]</a>) highlighting some of the ideas and arguments shared on the mailing list and on calls:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<p style="margin-right: 0cm; margin-bottom: 12pt; margin-left: 0cm;" class=""><i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Some Work Track members stated that the text
“in any language” results in a very large number of reserved strings and does not provide a clear and objective list that can be used as reference. From this perspective, the provision is not predictable or transparent. One Work Track member also noted that
some languages are spoken by very few people, therefore reserving representations in all languages may not be appropriate. From another perspective, “in any language” should remain in place unless there is a factual basis for limiting the languages covered
in this provision. Many languages may be spoken by and relevant to communities within a given country, and the list should therefore not be limited. Work Track members suggested the following possible options as alternatives to “in any language”:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Limit the list to the official UN languages.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">One Work Track member stated that if the UN languages are included, the text should state “including but not limited to official
UN languages.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Another WT member stated that there are no “official UN languages.” There are “UN working languages.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">One Work Track member suggested that Portuguese should be added to this list as it is an ICANN language.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Limit the list to Create a list of languages using the official languages of each country and official UN languages.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Some Work Track members stated that it might be difficult to identify the official languages of each country. One WT member
asked in the WT would take on the task of creating such a list.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">One Work Track member suggested using as a starting point<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></i><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__unstats.un.org_unsd_geoinfo_UNGEGN_docs_26th-2Dgegn-2Ddocs_WP_WP54-5FUNGEGN-2520WG-2520Country-2520Names-2520Document-25202011.pdf&d=DwMGaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mBQzlSaM6eYCHFBU-v48zs-QSrjHB0aWmHuE4X4drzI&m=3RBrAW4mWZcTPVfCD2YJOz3VODn7HkbFx9d59ip1OQ8&s=TLfnTlAegQWCm3YnzQVenw5bkmrnQzGkY0wNxKVA34Y&e=" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><i class=""><span style="color: rgb(17, 85, 204); background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Working
Paper 54</span></i><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[unstats.un.org]</a><i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>of
the UN Group of Experts on Geographical Names (UNGEGN).</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Another WT member stated that there are no “official UN languages.” There are “UN working languages.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">From one perspective, the list should not be limited in this way. Official UN languages are largely irrelevant in many countries.
Also from this perspective, the concept of official languages only appears in certain countries. In this view, the administrations in many countries use languages that are not official. People of the country also use languages that may not be official, and
these languages are important to specific communities.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Alternate to “official languages” suggested: “official and relevant languages.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Example used in relation to “relevant languages”: “We have more than 25% of foreign-born people living in Switzerland. They
refer to Switzerland in their languages and scripts. These are relevant languages/scripts that should be covered.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Alternate to “official languages” suggested: “official and commonly spoken languages.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">One Work Track member suggested that Portuguese should be added to this list as it is an ICANN language.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Develop a list using the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></i><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.ethnologue.com_about_language-2Dstatus&d=DwMGaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=mBQzlSaM6eYCHFBU-v48zs-QSrjHB0aWmHuE4X4drzI&m=3RBrAW4mWZcTPVfCD2YJOz3VODn7HkbFx9d59ip1OQ8&s=b8MTrxrLtgXCvwAkW1Hc6hr0mNf_SYEyuINez9Kgfng&e=" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=""><i class=""><span style="color: rgb(17, 85, 204); background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Expanded
Graded Intergenerational Disruption Scale and categorization based on Official Recognition</span></i><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[ethnologue.com]</a><i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Create an exhaustive repository of all country names in all languages.</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li><li class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: white; vertical-align: baseline;">
<i class=""><span style="background-color: white; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial initial;" class="">Change “in any language” to “in any script.”</span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></li></ul>
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Kind regards,<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Emily<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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<pre style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Courier New";" class="">_______________________________________________<o:p class=""></o:p></pre>
<pre style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Courier New";" class="">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 mailing list<o:p class=""></o:p></pre>
<pre style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Courier New";" class=""><a href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><o:p class=""></o:p></pre>
<pre style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 10pt; font-family: "Courier New";" class=""><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5</a><o:p class=""></o:p></pre>
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<o:p class=""> </o:p></div>
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<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">_______________________________________________</span><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration: none;" class="">
<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5
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