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    <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">I truly admire
        Alexander's attempt to extract some minimal protection for city
        names from this round of discussions and I fully support it.
        This suggested wording adjustment is a long way from the hope
        that the names of 1M+ cities be set aside and hopefully, that
        discussion is not completely over. But I think it is time for
        all parties to this discussion to find a way to modify their
        positions and support such a proposal.</font></p>
    <p><font face="Times New Roman, Times, serif">Marita</font><br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 10/5/2018 3:00 PM, Alexander
      Schubert wrote:<br>
    </div>
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      <div class="WordSection1">
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Dear
            Jorge,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I
            am very much in agreement with your notion! However: the way
            the discussion turns out right now it seems there is a fair
            chance that we do not find agreement to ANY changes to the
            2012 AGBs. And in absence of agreement to change something:
            the 2012 AGB specifications will remain in power!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">It’s
            the typical issue of “Realpolitik”:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">I
            am in agreement with you that ALL city names should be
            specially treated. At minimum if they exceed a certain size.
            But it seems that despite of a LOT of efforts to reach
            agreement – nothing happened. If we ask “less” – then
            agreement might be at least established.<br>
            <br>
            I see these typical threat scenarios:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph"
          style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span
              style="mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style="font:7.0pt
                "Times New Roman"">       </span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">An
            applicant targets a (usually HUGE – because only they are
            profitable) city, but wants to circumvent the requirement
            for the letter of support! As per the 2012 AGB this is more
            than easy: just say that you are NOT have the intent to use
            the gTLD primary for purposes associated with the city name;
            and you are done! Nothing ICANN could do about it. A clear
            flaw in the applicant guidebook that luckily wasn’t
            exploited in 2012 (for reasons that I will outline over the
            weekend). My new suggestion would solve this scenario!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph"
          style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span
              style="mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style="font:7.0pt
                "Times New Roman"">       </span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">An
            applicant goes for a real generic term (one that is broadly
            used in the DNS) – but inadvertently (circumstantially,
            accidentally) targets a smallish city. If the city is small
            – it is unlikely that it would ever go for its name as gTLD.
            So no real harm done. And if it is HUGE: the mechanism
            proposed by me would require the applicant to acquire the
            letter of non-objection.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph"
          style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><span
              style="mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style="font:7.0pt
                "Times New Roman"">       </span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The
            only real problem occurs if a BRAND applies for a closed
            gTLD – which allows them to maintain that the use will NOT
            be to a “significant degree for purposes associated with the
            city name”. If the city is smallish: Again, they anyway
            won’t go for a gTLD. So no harm done. If the city is HUGE:
            only in that case we had a real problem! In that case the
            city would have to entertain a formal objection via GAC. It
            is my hope that such case occurs rather seldom.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">So
            in most cases we would have established what we want:
            preventing the circumvention of the support requirement.
            Albeit: if we don’t agree to such measure – the original
            2012 AGB provisions will stay in place – and nobody is
            protected in ANY way. Cities are sitting ducks – and Silcon
            Valley VC money will team up with Shareholder Value and raid
            cities globally. And honestly: who wants their city gTLD
            being guided by “U.S. Shareholder Values” instead of a local
            alliance of city constituents in teamwork with their city
            authority? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">In
            that respect: how do you plan to achieve your goal of
            protecting “all cities”? By eliminating the “non-geo use
            provision” altogether?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Alexander<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                  style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch">Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch</a>
                [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch">mailto:Jorge.Cancio@bakom.admin.ch</a>] <br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 05, 2018 3:30 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin">alexander@schubert.berlin</a>;
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> AW: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT 5
                Suggestion: a) The geo name panel determines that the
                foreseeable use of 2nd level domains by registrants will
                be to a significant degree for purposes associated with
                the city name<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
            lang="DE-CH">Dear Alexander<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"
            lang="DE-CH"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Thanks
            very much for your efforts!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">As
            you will recall, I’m of the view (shared by others) that
            «intended use» should be eliminated altogether from the rule
            applicable to city names – for the reasons that are on
            record.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Essentially,
            whatever the use, the TLD is a unique resource, and its
            delegation, even if the use is determined to be
            non-geographic, means that the city identifier is delegated
            away…  – this is IMO a sufficient reason to have the local
            authorities at the table before the applicant gets too far
            into the application process – so we avoid surprises and we
            also avoid the applicant investing important sums before it
            is clear that all interested parties at least do not object.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Just
            as a reminder: Swiss cities (as cities in other countries
            following the civil code tradition) have rights under the
            law on their names – the intended use is not a key factor in
            that respect. Therefore, they need to be consulted
            beforehand if we want to avoid conflicts in such situations.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Kind
            regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Jorge
            <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                  style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
                  lang="DE">Von:</span></b><span
                style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
                lang="DE"> Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 <<a
                  href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>>
                <b>Im Auftrag von </b>Alexander Schubert<br>
                <b>Gesendet:</b> Freitag, 5. Oktober 2018 14:02<br>
                <b>An:</b> <a
                  href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
                  moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
                <b>Betreff:</b> Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT 5
                Suggestion: a) The geo name panel determines that the
                foreseeable use of 2nd level domains by registrants will
                be to a significant degree for purposes associated with
                the city name<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE-CH"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Dear
            Dessalegn,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thank
            you for the question!<br>
            <br>
            My notion was that we utilize the foreseeable (projectable)
            actual “use” by registrants to determine the association
            with the city name. But maybe it avoids confusion if we
            would shorten it to:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"
          style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b><i><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">An application for a city name
                will be subject to the geographic names requirements
                (i.e., will require documentation of support or
                non-objection from the relevant governments or public
                authorities) if:</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt">2012
          AGB:   <b><i><span style="color:#2E75B6">a) It is clear from
              </span><span style="color:red">applicant statements </span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">within the application that the </span><span
                style="color:red">applicant </span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">will use the TLD </span><span
                style="color:red">primarily </span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">for purposes associated with the
                city name</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"
          style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:36.0pt">Revision:  
          <b><i><span style="color:#2E75B6">a) The </span><span
                style="color:red">geo name panel determines </span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">that it is </span><span
                style="color:red">foreseeable </span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">that </span><span
                style="color:red">registrants </span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6">will use the TLD </span><span
                style="color:red">to a significant degree</span><span
                style="color:#2E75B6"> for purposes associated with the
                city name</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The
            English here is slightly garbled (two time “that” – not very
            eloquent) but now it is as short as the original and 2<sup>nd</sup>
            level domains aren’t mentioned any more. And you are right:
            It’s mainly the gTLD portion of the domains registered by
            registrants that determine the “use”! <br>
            <br>
            Has anybody any suggestion for a better wording? Is there
            some support for the notion that we should NOT rely on
            “statements of the applicant” but rather have a neutral body
            (geo name panel) using “common sense” to determine whether
            or not a letter of support is needed; and at that on the
            basis of foreseeable actual “use” by the registrants? ICANN
            should (as discussed many times before) provide prospective
            applicants with the opportunity to have such test conducted
            many month ahead of the application period. This way in the
            probably extremely rare case that an applicant would feel
            treated unjust they could prepare extra information and get
            extra evidence to bolster their “case”. Or they simply get
            the letter of non-objection. <br>
            <br>
            What this “litmus test” does is essentially compare generic
            use with city use. A good generic term which has at least
            the CHANCE of fetching a high registration volume vs. a
            smallish city: No problem! But if somebody is targeting a
            city name that isn’t even identical to a generic term
            (Shanghai, Chicago): then we can bust those who try to avoid
            the requirement of a letter of support by the city
            government. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph" style="margin-left:0cm"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoListParagraph"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:0cm"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">Alexander<br>
            <br>
            <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
            Dessalegn Yehuala [<a
              href="mailto:mequanint.yehuala@gmail.com"
              moz-do-not-send="true">mailto:mequanint.yehuala@gmail.com</a>]
            <br>
            <b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 05, 2018 11:51 AM<br>
            <b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin"
              moz-do-not-send="true">alexander@schubert.berlin</a><br>
            <b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
              moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
            <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] WT 5 Suggestion:
            a) The geo name panel determines that the foreseeable use of
            2nd level domains by registrants will be to a significant
            degree for purposes associated with the city name<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal">Dear Alexander,<o:p></o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">Just one small comment on the text your
              proposed to be revised from the AGB 2012- "<b><i><span
                    style="color:#2E75B6">a) The </span><span
                    style="color:red">geo name panel </span><span
                    style="color:#2E75B6">determines that the </span><span
                    style="color:red">foreseeable use of 2<sup>nd</sup> level
                    domains by registrants </span><span
                    style="color:#2E75B6">will be to a </span><span
                    style="color:red">significant degree</span><span
                    style="color:#2E75B6"> for purposes associated with
                    the city name"</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">The WT5 is mandated to deal with issues
              that surround the treatment of geographic string
              identifiers at the top level, wouldn't 2nd level be out of
              scope?<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">Kind regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">Dessalegn<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <div>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">On Thu, Oct 4, 2018 at 5:49 PM
              Alexander Schubert <<a
                href="mailto:alexander@schubert.berlin"
                moz-do-not-send="true">alexander@schubert.berlin</a>>
              wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
          <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC
            1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
            <div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Hi
                  WT 5,<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Over
                  the weekend I will submit a longer comment about the
                  issue of the terminology in “recommendation 11” =
                  non-capital cities (pages 4 and 5 of 21 in the word
                  document “<i>DRAFT - WT5 Initial Report - Sections C-E
                    - 27.9.2018 - with comments-1</i>”)<br>
                  <br>
                  The text right now states (unchanged from the 2012
                  AGB) that applicants ONLY require a “letter of
                  non-objection” from the relevant authorities (city
                  government) if:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt"><b><i><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">a) It is clear from </span><span
                        style="color:red">applicant statements </span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">within the application
                        that the </span><span style="color:red">applicant
                        will use </span><span style="color:#2E75B6">the
                        TLD </span><span style="color:red">primarily </span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">for purposes associated
                        with the city name</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I
                  will elaborate on both: “<b><i><span style="color:red">use</span></i></b>”
                  (by the applicant) and “<b><i><span style="color:red">primarily</span></i></b>”.
                  In my mind BOTH will have to be reversed:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msolistparagraph"><span
                    style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol">·</span><span
                    style="font-size:7.0pt">         </span>“foreseeable
                  use” by the “REGISTRANTS” (rather than then “intended
                  or projected use by the applicant entity”)<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msolistparagraph"><span
                    style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol">·</span><span
                    style="font-size:7.0pt">         </span>and not
                  limited to “primary use”– but something like
                  “significant use”. “Primarily” could arguably be
                  considered “90% or more”. “Significant” would probably
                  start at 20% or the like. The geo panel would need a
                  few guidelines here as well!<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I
                  don’t care what or what not an applicant is dreaming
                  of – that needs to be determined by the geo panel! If
                  it is a closed brand application: obviously the case
                  is clear. If it is a generic term like “rock” (music)
                  and there is a small city of a few thousand people
                  named “Rock”: it’s kind of clear that the significant
                  majority of registrants will use the 2<sup>nd</sup>
                  level domains in connotation with “Rock Music” (or
                  other generic meanings of the term “rock” like
                  moon.rock). But if somebody were to apply for an open
                  gTLD .chicago, .shanghai  or .frankfurt and would
                  claim that there is “no primary use associated with
                  the city intended” – sorry: then the applicant is
                  either delusional or tries to circumvent the necessity
                  to acquire a letter of non-objection from the relevant
                  city Government. This litmus test should NOT be
                  outsourced to the APPLICANT – but it should be a task
                  executed by the geo-panel. You can’t make the goat the
                  gardener. At least WE (ICANN) should not do so. A
                  brand or a real generic term based application that is
                  only “circumstantially” targeting a small city – that
                  is one thing. Somebody applying for “.shanghai” trying
                  to play tricks on the geo panel (and in fact on the
                  entire ICANN community, and the city community of
                  Shanghai): not cool. Doesn’t fly.<br>
                  <br>
                  In my email I will also specifically explain why this
                  is deemed a risk in the next round when there weren’t
                  any notable problems in the 2012 round. If anybody is
                  interested in hearing my notion on that problematic:
                  shout out to me – and I will elaborate further.<br>
                  <br>
                  In that light I suggest the following language (this
                  is so to speak the litmus test whether an applicant
                  needs a letter of non-objection).<br>
                  <br>
                  <b><i><span style="color:#2E75B6">An application for a
                        city name will be subject to the geographic
                        names requirements (i.e., will require
                        documentation of support or non-objection from
                        the relevant governments or public authorities)
                        if:</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:36.0pt">2012
                  AGB:   <b><i><span style="color:#2E75B6">a) It is
                        clear from applicant statements within the
                        application that the </span><span
                        style="color:red">applicant will use </span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">the TLD </span><span
                        style="color:red">primarily </span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">for purposes associated
                        with the city name</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:36.0pt">Revision:  
                  <b><i><span style="color:#2E75B6">a) The </span><span
                        style="color:red">geo name panel </span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">determines that the </span><span
                        style="color:red">foreseeable use of 2<sup>nd</sup>
                        level domains by registrants </span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6">will be to a </span><span
                        style="color:red">significant degree</span><span
                        style="color:#2E75B6"> for purposes associated
                        with the city name</span></i></b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">This
                  way a brand applicant should generally have no problem
                  at all (closed gTLD). And an applicant for a generic
                  dictionary term with broad utilization in the DNS
                  should also have no problems. But we would prevent
                  that lazy (or cheating) applicants skip the line – and
                  go for a city name WITHOUT looping in the city. That
                  would be unfair to applicants that get the city’s
                  support, unfair to the city itself and unfair to the
                  city’s constituents.  <br>
                  <br>
                  Comments? It would be nice if members that support
                  this language would make themselves heard. I would
                  wish to see my recommendation prominently positioned
                  in the report – that will only happen if my notion
                  finds support.<br>
                  <br>
                  Alexander.berlin<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <div>
                  <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
                    1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b>From:</b>
                      Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 [mailto:<a
                        href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5-bounces@icann.org</a>]
                      <b>On Behalf Of </b>Julie Hedlund<br>
                      <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 04, 2018 12:43 AM<br>
                      <b>To:</b> <a
                        href="mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
                      <b>Subject:</b> [Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5] Notes and
                      Action Items - New gTLD Subsequent Procedures PDP
                      Work Track 5 - 03 October 2018<o:p></o:p></p>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext">Dear Work
                  Track 5 members,<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext">Please see
                  below the action items and notes from the meeting
                  today (03 October).  <i>These high-level notes are
                    designed to help WG members navigate through the
                    content of the call and are not a substitute for the
                    recording, transcript, or the chat, which will be
                    posted on the wiki.</i> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><span
                    style="color:black">Please also find attached the </span>referenced
                  document in PDF and Word including comments.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext">Kind
                  regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext">Julie<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext">Julie
                  Hedlund, Policy Director<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext">----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext"><b>Notes/Action
                    Items:</b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="m-2100584411624512544msoplaintext"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b>Actions:</b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">ACTION
                  ITEM: Preliminary recommendation #2:  Add a footnote
                  explaining what "character" means<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b>Notes:</b><o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">1.
                  Welcome/Agenda Review/SOI Updates: No updates<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">2.
                  Draft Initial Report Sections: Preliminary
                  Recommendations, Options, and Questions<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Comments about missing points -- the deliberation
                  sections are still to come.  This is just three
                  sections of six.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  These are just arguments/recommendations/options at
                  this point.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  The question is are these the right alternatives to
                  put out for public comment.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Questions for community input -- asking if these make
                  sense and if anything is missing.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Any content is subject to public comment.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #1:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Use of the word "certain" suggests there are other
                  strings we have not addressed.  Suggest deleting the
                  word.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Can we make it clear here that we are talking about
                  the AGB as written rather than as applied?  I don't
                  think we want as applied.  <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #2:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Question: We don't give any explanation for why we are
                  making this recommendation.  Answer: The explanation
                  will be reflected in the deliberations in the Initial
                  Report.  Section C is just the text of the
                  deliberations.  There will be much more text in
                  Section F on the deliberations, including pros and
                  cons.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Looking at the last bullet point re: WT2 considering
                  letter-number combinations -- should this also refer
                  to number-number combinations?  <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">ACTION
                  ITEM:  Add a footnote explaining what "character"
                  means.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #3:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Move this into the category of strings that could be
                  applied for with documentation on support or
                  non-objection.  <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  See also comments from Christopher Wilkinson.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  There were discussions about how many of these are
                  generic words as well as three-letter country codes. 
                  There was a wider debate that was outside of scope
                  since it was ccNSO territory.  With that in mind that
                  is how we got to this recommendation.  There was quite
                  a lot of debate on this.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Do we need to clarify that we are not recommending
                  that any 3-character codes listed in the ISO 3166-1
                  standard be removed from delegation?  Or that .com
                  should be removed from delegation?<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Could have country names that could be delegated -- if
                  Canada wants .canada there should be a pathway for
                  them to getting it.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Not in favor of allowing the delegation of geographic
                  names for non-geographic use.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #4:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  The problem is that we have not gotten agreement on
                  prior authorization and geographical use.  As long as
                  we have no consensus we have to maintain this
                  restriction. <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Recommendation
                  #5:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Question: We say we recommend continuing something in
                  the AGB but then we say it's a revision.  Are we
                  saying the AGB is inconsistent with GNSO policy?
                  Answer: Some members would like to see whether there
                  is a discrepancy between the AGB and the policy -- so
                  saying it is consistent with the AGB, but is not
                  consistent with the policy.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Suggest: "As noted above this recommendation is
                  consistent with the AGB as written [not "as drafted"]
                  and doesn't address the issue of translation of these
                  strings.  However, this is a revision to GNSO
                  policy..."<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Agree with the change above but not the order.  You
                  had the policy first and then the AGB.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Maybe need an explanation somewhere at the beginning
                  of the document.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #6<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  The only thing that is listed are the code --- there
                  are no names associated with a code as "exceptionally
                  reserved".  <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  This is a category that was in the 2012 AGB.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Example is "UK" -- The code is reserved on the ISO
                  site, but not the name.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Append a list for the actual report.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  When there is something reserved it doesn't mean that
                  it is connected the specific area where we talk about
                  it.  As to whether there is a list -- there used to be
                  a list available on request from the ISO secretariat. 
                  <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #7:  No objections<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #8:  Third bullet has same issue as
                  mentioned above -- No "exceptionally reserved" in the
                  ISO 3166.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #9: No objections<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #10: No objections<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #11:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Comments
                  from the list:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Discussion of intended use is included in the
                  deliberation section, including pros and cons.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Comment premature to include this preliminary
                  recommendation as it stands.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Consider the use of the word "primarily" as in "use
                  the TLD primarily for purposes associated with the
                  city name".  Maybe it isn't quite the right word, but
                  we would want to avoid unintended consequences.  Also,
                  not clear what we mean by "use".  This language was in
                  the 2012 AGB -- not saying it was perfect, but don't
                  recall this ever becoming an issue with a city name. 
                  Before we suggest changes let's look at what happened
                  in 2012.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  One could also say if the applicant considers any use
                  for the city he will have to get a letter from the
                  city.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  There has been a lot of back and forth on this issue
                  -- we need to really take a look at whether we want to
                  foreclose a bunch of words.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Ignores free expression rights to use words with
                  geographic meaning in lawful ways.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Could address by putting in a contractual requirement
                  that is more specific continuing to not use a TLD in a
                  geographic sense.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Preliminary
                  recommendation #12:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Need a separate recommendation dealing with the
                  currency codes (ISO 4217).  they are very important in
                  the financial markets.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Don't support adding protection of the currency code.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  The sub-national place names should be open for
                  reservation for non-geographic uses without a letter
                  of support or non-objection.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">2.
                  ICANN63:<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Released 3 subsections of the Initial Report.  Only a
                  few comments so far.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Idea is to give people another week to submit comment,
                  and then we will release the full package of the
                  Initial Report.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Idea is that in addition to doing status updates and
                  outreach at ICANN63 we'll have time to potentially get
                  broader community input on issues, as well as to note
                  what might be missing.<o:p></o:p></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">--
                  Three sessions on Saturday morning with lunch at the
                  last session.<o:p></o:p></p>
              </div>
            </div>
            <p class="MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
              Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 mailing list<br>
              <a href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org"
                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a><br>
              <a
                href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5"
                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5</a><o:p></o:p></p>
          </blockquote>
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      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5 mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org">Gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5@icann.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg-wt5</a></pre>
    </blockquote>
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