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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Dear All,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Please find the attendance of the call attached to this email and the MP3 recording below for the New gTLD Subsequent Procedures Working Group call held on Monday, 19</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> December
2016 at 20:00 UTC.<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span>Attendance of the calls is also posted on the agenda wiki page: <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">MP3: </span></b><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> </span><a href="http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-new-gtld-subsequent-19dec16-en.mp3" style="font-family: -webkit-standard; font-size: 14px;">http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-new-gtld-subsequent-19dec16-en.mp3<br>
</a><a href="http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-new-gtld-subsequent-08sep16-en.mp3" style="font-family: -webkit-standard; font-size: 14px;"> </a></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:<span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><a href="http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#nov" target="_blank" style="color: purple;">http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Mailing list archives: </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><a href="http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-newgtld-wg/" target="_blank" style="color: purple;"><span style="background-color: white;">http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-newgtld-wg/</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Wiki page: </span><a href="https://community.icann.org/x/a5-DAw" style="font-family: -webkit-standard; font-size: 14px;">https://community.icann.org/x/a5-DAw</a></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Thank you.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Kind regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Michelle <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">-------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;"><b style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: 12pt;"><u><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Adobe Connect chat transcript for Monday</span></u></b><b><u><font face="Calibri,sans-serif" size="3">,
19 </font><font face="Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size: 15px;">December</span></font><font face="Calibri,sans-serif" size="3"> 2016</font></u></b></p>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;">Michelle DeSmyter:Dear All, Welcome to the New gTLD Subsequent Procedures Working Group on Monday, 19 December 2016 at 20:00 UTC. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michelle DeSmyter:Agenda page: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_a5-2DDAw&d=DgICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=C0tJZ_1MIhaUgCwjJTqC73vN5QXA0MydzW8DiN__Bic&s=obxzQOTnu1luQogDUHvwZXLc3o3C2M3msTSwPm24dKQ&e=">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_a5-2DDAw&d=DgICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=C0tJZ_1MIhaUgCwjJTqC73vN5QXA0MydzW8DiN__Bic&s=obxzQOTnu1luQogDUHvwZXLc3o3C2M3msTSwPm24dKQ&e=</a></div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Katrin Ohlmer:@avri: all fine!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:hy everyone!!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Shatan:Hello, all.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):hi all!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kavouss Arasteh:HI EVERY BODY</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:hi kavouss</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:Hi all</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:hi Annebeth!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:thnaks Christa!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Karen Day:WT3 at 20:00 12/20</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Steve Coates:Apologies for being late.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Alan Greenberg:Meeting tomorrow is not entire PDP group but WT3 - correct??</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Emily Barabas:Correct, Alan</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Robin Gross:The WT3 materials to read for tomorrow's discussion on Legal Rights Objections is on the wiki <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_display_NGSPP_4.4.3-2BObjections&d=DgICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=C0tJZ_1MIhaUgCwjJTqC73vN5QXA0MydzW8DiN__Bic&s=tK9j3x8QIX5yKb5vVSyapm83K5Co3PUuzIg9eDZYOFY&e=">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_display_NGSPP_4.4.3-2BObjections&d=DgICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=8_WhWIPqsLT6TmF1Zmyci866vcPSFO4VShFqESGe_5iHWGlBLwwwehFBfjrsjWv9&m=C0tJZ_1MIhaUgCwjJTqC73vN5QXA0MydzW8DiN__Bic&s=tK9j3x8QIX5yKb5vVSyapm83K5Co3PUuzIg9eDZYOFY&e=</a></div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jeff Neuman:Some discussion started on the list, but we need to keep it coming</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Steve Coates:No grinches in this group.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:Exactly Avri. The mailing list message described more of such details, but that went only to WT4 members. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Phil Buckingham:Re WT2 . Sorry Michael is not on the call yet, but 1 we are considering changing the time of the call in the New Year - still every other Thursday . 2 Our first call in the new year willl be on
the COI / LOC issues . Any applicant with prior experiences/ problems re Round 1 on this Q50 - feedback would be much appreciated - 3 WT2 received a really excellent email from Kurt Pritz re categories / registry agreement . Your feedback / responses
on this would be much appreciated </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:A truism: a longer process will be less predictable than a shorter process. So if we make it shorter, it gets more predictable. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Klaus Stoll:We did learning by doing the first time round and should learn valuable lessons and implement them. Maybe we should create a list of lessons learned.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):yes we should have less radical changes to make after process starts this time </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kavouss Arasteh 2:WHICH PARAGRAPH IS NOW DISCUSSED?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:@ cheryl - hope so.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):indeed Donna </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Julie Hedlund:@Kavouss: We are discussion the responses to Subject 4 Predictability -- 4aR1, R2, and R3.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Klaus Stoll:We need a document with three columns: 1) changes made, 2. Reason why?, 3) lesson learned</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:I think the question for this group might be, "Is there consensus that the application / evaluation / delegation procedure should be more predictable than the last round and aspire to be predictable
and consistent with the Guidebook?"</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:That would be a policy statement for us to make. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:@Kurt, answer shall be yes.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):agree Alan</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:Kurt, the policy statement could also include whether predictability is or is not to be achieved at the expense of speed or cost efficiency. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Klaus Stoll:My audio does not connect</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):GAC Advice was (from our point of viwe, of course) something that was also due to the fact that we were engaging in the very first exercise of this kind. And some of the issues raised
by the GAC after the start of the round had already been reaised before, but perhaps there had been not a full agreement on how to factor it in</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:@ Rubens: The policy could say that there is a pretty high bar for amending the process after launch, i.e., a risk to DNS stability or clear violation of some public interest</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Klaus Stoll:Sorry my audio does not connect.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Robin Gross:What is ICANN required to do with the GAC advice, especially if it comes late?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:Kurt, I would like to see the same thresholds existing today in the RA... like the board can issue emergency security policies, so they could intervene in the application process in case of risk to DNS
stability. But for public interest issues, there would be either (a) something community-wide as a consensus policy or (b) full voted agreement between applicants and ICANN consenst. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:(consent)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:@Robin - i think that's an important question - what does late mean and what's the consequence.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Robin Gross:Especially when GAC was involved in the working groups that created the GNSO policy, and subsequently wants to provide possibly different advice?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:@Kavouss - i was using it as an example and providing views of an SG other than the GAC.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Christa Taylor:Depends on the substance of the change..</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:Two thoughts that are not thought through: (1) If the GAC provides advice, the Board should be required to deal with it on a timely basis, with the timing to be spelt out in the procedure. (2) Maybe post-launch
comments can only be based on new information that was not available before the launch </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Klaus Stoll:We should not loose the lessons learned and make a list of Changes and issues,and lessons learned.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):the merit is probably The question and the Test </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Robin Gross:We should look at what ICANN's bylaws require for GNSO policy development.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Robin Gross:And specifically the process by which the board is to resolve differences between GNSO developed policy and GAC advice.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:I think it is in place to remind of the GAC Principles on new gTLDs: ICANN should avoid country, territory or place names, and country, territory or regional language or people descriptions, unless in agreement with the relevant governments
or public authorities. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Mathieu Weill:No, Accountability WS2 is not addressing this</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:@Annebeth, those principles existed prior to the 2012 round and were taken into account at that time. On what basis do you propose that agreements made for the 2012 round be re-opened?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Tom Dale (ACIG GAC Secretariat):WS2 sub-group on transparency is looking at ICANN-government relations, but not the role of the GAC.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:What I mean, Donna, is that in 2012 round country & territory names based on ISO 3166 were taken out - for this round. If they are taken in again in the next round, these principles should
be taken into account, so that a support/non-objection should be necessary to make it a gTLD</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:I think the question is whether advice that amounts to the deferrence required to deal with GAC Consensus Advice can occur after date X. GAC can always issue advice, governments can issue them, I can
issue advice by writing a letter to the board... </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:In my view it does not make sense that a capitol needs support/non-objection, but a country/territory should not need it. This includes 3-letter codes on the ISO-3166 list representing countries. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):we should also recognise that the GAC now is, more proactivly engaged now </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:thanks Annebeth</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Martin Sutton:It appears all are in agreement that there was lack of predictability in the last round. Based on this, should we simply list the specific issues that have been raised, check where there has been
a change since, and whether the changes have improved predictability? Where no change has occurred against a specific issue, review and consider if a change is needed. As we channel specifics through the WTs, we should also use this as a checkpoint to see
if we have sufficiently improved predictability.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):the merits are again the issue yes as</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):Alan said </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Mathieu Weill:Agree with Alan, ICANN Bylaws are clear on the importance of security, stability and public interest, predictability will never prevail over these factors</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:And public interest also includes politics</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:On the other hand, the more uncertainties we can get rid of before launching, the better. That will, in my view, give us a faster next round than last time.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Steve Coates:Mute your phones, please!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:Could the cougher please mute? </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Steve Coates:To Jeff's point, this is why launch times need to be more predictable. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Christa Taylor:perhaps categories </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:Combining two of my earlier comments: (1) a risk to DNS stability or clear violation of some public interest; (2) a change based on information that was unknowable when the process was developed</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:Agree with Kurt, particularly on 2). </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):,</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):yup</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Martin Sutton:@Kurt - we could test your formula on the changes that were made during the last application phase.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:all of the contentful comments seem to end up in the notes.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kavouss Arasteh 2:Cheryl, what is the meaning of yup in standard communication standar</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:Agree with Kurt too</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Christa Taylor:+1</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):We have to be aware that the role of GAC early warning and GAC consensus advice was part of the AGB of 2012 and therefore part of the rules of the game</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:we can put our green to give you a better view</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):I agree with KuRT</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Phil Buckingham:+1 to Kurt 's comment </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kristina Rosette (Amazon Registry):@Kurt: Is there a reason you didn't include security in #1 or was it presumed?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kristina Rosette (Amazon Registry):@Kurt: To be clear, the "security" in "security and stability"?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):what is being asked?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:@ Kristine: DNS security, stability, resiliency</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):I assumed presumed</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):Politics, and policy are difficult to be reduced to a formula</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Phil Buckingham:+ 1 CLO presumed and overriding </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Mathieu Weill:Would this test apply to changes introduced by staff into the process ? It is my impression that there is an area for larger improvements in predictability</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:what question are we on</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Steve Chan:4.b</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jeff Neuman:I went back to 4b.....sorry</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Philip Corwin:Regrets must I must leave now for a client call. Ciao</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kristina Rosette (Amazon Registry):I know I was late (because of another cal), but now have to jump (for another call). Happy holidays everyone!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):+ 1 Mathieu on staff/Board changes</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:+1</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):I feel the GAC answer on 4 b) also answers some points made before on the GAC role</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:Who would make the deterimination on what is 'severe'</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:chair hat off: every running around yelling the sky is falling!! hat back on.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:and the Board deciding it was so?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:without the EC objecting.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:Some could say we experienced that in 2012 with Names Collision.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:True, Donna.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> avri doria:exccept no EC and no coming back to the community.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:i beleive limit is not realistic at all. I am for free competition and oepen opportunity to all who wants to apply</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:But is it fair, Vanda, that those companies with a lot of money can affort to apply for many, but "newcomers" have problems doing that? Wasn't one of the reasons behind opening up that there
should be fair competition?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:this time, less money had a problem to apply more for lack of timely information than really lack of money</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:at least in our region</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Kurt Pritz:@ Annebeth: I think interfering with markets in a way to abet less financial applicants is not workable; I think your concern is best address by the Applicant Support question</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:I think the competitive angle is per-string, so those who apply for many are diluting their strength (low or high) among many strings and making it actually easier for the focused applicants. .club and
.cloud registries are examples of that from the 2012-round. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Jorge Cancio (GAC Switzerland):The key is again to have an effective outreach, that interested stakeholders have a fair say v-a-v strings that may interest them, that community based applications work, and that
the applicant support program really works</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:I think this is especially important for new markets, like Africe</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):agree Jorge </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:Agree, Jorge</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):yes Annebeth </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:agree with Rubens. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:Good point, Kurt</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:Outreach and awareness raising are important principles, and in order to be timely, it's important to be working towards a date. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:Happy Holidays to you all and whole families !</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Steve Coates:I always prefer a Monday night to a Sunday night. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:avri- better - good idea Sunday night normally difficult during summer time here</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO):thanks everyone... bye for now and Seasons Greetings to all...</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Annebeth Lange, ccNSO:Happy holidays to all. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Christa Taylor:Happy Holidays!!!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Karen Day:Hope to see LOTS of you at WT3 tomorrow :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rubens Kuhl:Happy Holidays!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Donna Austin, Neustar:thanks Avri and Jeff</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:happy holidays again!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Katrin Ohlmer:happy holidays, all! cu you next year!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vanda Scartezini:see you in 2017!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Phil Buckingham:thanks</div>
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