<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=utf-8"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><!--[if !mso]><style>v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style><![endif]--><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Consolas;
panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;
margin-right:0cm;
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;
margin-left:0cm;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;}
pre
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"HTML Preformatted Char";
margin:0cm;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";}
span.HTMLPreformattedChar
{mso-style-name:"HTML Preformatted Char";
mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"HTML Preformatted";
font-family:"Consolas",serif;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
span.EmailStyle21
{mso-style-type:personal-compose;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
@page WordSection1
{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
margin:72.0pt 90.0pt 72.0pt 90.0pt;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>One definition of “public interest”: "The well-being of the general public and society.”<br><br>And ALL ICANN constituencies should be engaged in it.<br><br><br>Thanks,<br><br>Alexander<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> Gnso-newgtld-wg [mailto:gnso-newgtld-wg-bounces@icann.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Greg Shatan<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 01, 2019 6:12 AM<br><b>To:</b> Kathy Kleiman <kathy@kathykleiman.com><br><b>Cc:</b> gnso-newgtld-wg@icann.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Gnso-newgtld-wg] Resolving Objection Proceedings with Mandatory PICs<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I’m familiar with the entities known as the Noncommercial Stakeholder Group and the Electronic Frontier Foundation, and I’m reasonably confident Kathy can speak to their views, particularly since EFF is a member of the NCSG (but perhaps not of this WG, or if so, not particularly active).<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I’m not familiar with any entity known as the Public Interest Community. Indeed I’m pretty sure there is no such monolithic entity. I’m not even quite sure what the phrase refers, but to the extent I understand it, it is a diverse group of entities that does not speak with one voice or a single perspective.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I doubt we can ascribe a single position to the “public interest community.” To the extent we try, it makes no sense to lump it in with NCSG and EFF (and I look skeptically on any attempt to do so). Indeed, I would expect At Large to have a firmer grasp on this group of entities than NCSG — particularly since I believe the public interest community (as I try to understand it) looks primarily to the interests of individual internet users, as does At Large.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Greg<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Thu, Sep 26, 2019 at 6:41 PM Kathy Kleiman <<a href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><p>All,<o:p></o:p></p><p>Mandatory PICS are unchanging. You can't resolve an Objection with a Mandatory PIC. It would require a Voluntary PIC -- which has become a misnomer, and a complete garbage can of everything applicants wanted to throw into the kitchen sink. There are longstanding objections to "voluntary PICs" from the Noncommercial Stakeholder Group, Electronic Frontier Foundation and the Public Interest Community (as we discussed many times). There is no high-level agreement on including them -- and they were not part of the Round 1 rules. <o:p></o:p></p><p>We agreed in last week's call that you could *amend the application* to settle an Objection. That puts the private Objection settlement out for fuller and fairer review -- which is fair. Changes to public portion of applications would be subject to public comment -- and hopefully notification to all who have filed comments and therefore are likely interested in following changes to that application. Publication and public notice on significant changes to applications (with public comment) to settle an Objection <b>was </b>done in Round 1. <o:p></o:p></p><p>But there was no question that there is a <u>high level Disagreement to settling disputes with changes to PICs -- because mandatory PICs are fixed and unchanging. </u>This high level Disagreement was raised in every Objections call until last night. <i>Surely we are not saying that if you miss one discussion in the dead of night, you have waived all previous objections? </i><o:p></o:p></p><p>I'm assuming GAC objections were the topic at issue here -- and can settled with changes to the application itself. <b> </b>Many, many changes to public portions of applications were made in response to the GAC in Round 1. <o:p></o:p></p><p>Best, Kathy<o:p></o:p></p><p>Kathryn Kleiman, American University Washington College of Law<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 9/26/2019 6:13 PM, Aikman-Scalese, Anne wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><img border=0 width=31 height=31 id="_x0000_i1025" src="cid:image001.gif@01D5792A.378EF240"><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><a name="m_-312248627501402405__GoBack"></a>Regarding the last call and the possible high level agreement on resolving Objection proceedings with mandatory PICs, it’s important to note that there is no private right of action to enforce a PIC. The current PIC Dispute Resolution procedure – PICDRP (see attached) provides for various steps to be taken in resolving the PIC complaint and if unresolved, ICANN at its SOLE discrestion, can invoke a a Staning Panel or undertake a compliance investigation.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>So the points I am raising here are:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>(1) Proceeding on the report of a PIC violation rests in the sole discretion of ICANN<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>(2) The expense of the Compliance investigation and/or Standing Panel is an expense of ICANN.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Accordingly, it may be appropriate to consider adopting a private right of action (rather than forcing the expense on ICANN) in connection with the enforcement of mandatory PICs adopted for purposes of resolving an Objection proceeding.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>In fact, the PICDRP originally contained a provision allowing the enforcement issue to be taken to a third party provider. However, that draft did not survive.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Anne<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0 style='border-collapse:collapse'><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><b><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#AF272F'>Anne E. Aikman-Scalese</span></b><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>Of Counsel</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>520.629.4428 office</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>520.879.4725 fax</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><a href="mailto:AAikman@lrrc.com" target="_blank" title="Email User"><span style='color:#AF272F'>AAikman@lrrc.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>_____________________________</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><img border=0 width=115 height=46 id="_x0000_i1026" src="cid:image002.png@01D5792A.378EF240"></span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>Lewis Roca Rothgerber Christie LLP</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>One South Church Avenue, Suite 2000</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>Tucson, Arizona 85701-1611</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><a href="http://lrrc.com/" target="_blank" title="Lewis
Roca Rothgerber Christie Webpage"><span style='color:#AF272F'>lrrc.com</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:2.0pt;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:9.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'><img border=0 width=120 height=39 id="_x0000_i1027" src="cid:image003.jpg@01D5792A.378EF240"></span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-top:2.0pt;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>Because what matters</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;line-height:105%'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;line-height:105%;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#323232'>to you, matters to us.™</span><o:p></o:p></p></td></tr><tr><td width=336 valign=top style='width:252.0pt;padding:0cm 5.4pt 0cm 5.4pt'></td></tr></table><p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><hr size=2 width="100%" align=center></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:gray'><br>This message and any attachments are intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed. If the reader of this message or an attachment is not the intended recipient or the employee or agent responsible for delivering the message or attachment to the intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this message or any attachment is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by replying to the sender. The information transmitted in this message and any attachments may be privileged, is intended only for the personal and confidential use of the intended recipients, and is covered by the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 U.S.C. §2510-2521. </span><o:p></o:p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>Gnso-newgtld-wg mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">Gnso-newgtld-wg@icann.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy</a>) and the website Terms of Service (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos</a>). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.<o:p></o:p></pre></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal>_______________________________________________<br>Gnso-newgtld-wg mailing list<br><a href="mailto:Gnso-newgtld-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">Gnso-newgtld-wg@icann.org</a><br><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-newgtld-wg</a><br>_______________________________________________<br>By submitting your personal data, you consent to the processing of your personal data for purposes of subscribing to this mailing list accordance with the ICANN Privacy Policy (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/policy</a>) and the website Terms of Service (<a href="https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos" target="_blank">https://www.icann.org/privacy/tos</a>). You can visit the Mailman link above to change your membership status or configuration, including unsubscribing, setting digest-style delivery or disabling delivery altogether (e.g., for a vacation), and so on.<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div></div></div></body></html>