[Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] MP3 PPSAI WG - Tuesday 12 August 2014 at 1400 UTC

Terri Agnew terri.agnew at icann.org
Tue Aug 12 19:11:13 UTC 2014

Dear All,


Please find the MP3 recording for the Privacy and Proxy Services Accreditation Issues PDP Working group call held on Tuesday 12 August 2014 at 14:00 UTC at:


 <http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-20140812-en.mp3> http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-20140812-en.mp3


On page: 

 <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#aug> http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#aug


The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:

 <http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/> http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/



Steve Metalitz - IPC

Sarah Wyld - RrSG

Chris Pelling – RrSG

Darcy Southwell - RrSG

Graeme Bunton – RrSG

Val Sherman – IPC

Griffin Barnett – IPC

Susan Kawaguchi – BC

Tatiana Khramtsova – RrSG

Frank Michlick – Individual

Luc Seufer- RrSG

Volker Greimann-RrSG

Don Blumenthal – RySG

Libby Baney-BC

Holly Raiche – ALAC

David Heasley-IPC

Jim Bikoff-IPC

Stephanie Perrin – NCSG

Paul McGrady – IPC

Carlton Samuels – ALAC

Osvaldo Novoa – ISPCP

Keith Kupferschmid- IPC

Phil Marano - IPC

James Bladel - RrSG

Amr Elsadr - NCUC

Susan Prosser - RrSG

Christian Dawson-ISPCP



Alex Deacon – IPC

Kristina Rosette – IPC

Lindsay Hamilton-Reid – RrSG

Michele Neylon – RrSG


ICANN staff:

Mary Wong

Marika Konings

Amy Bivins

Danielle Andela

Terri Agnew


** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **


Mailing list archives:

 <http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg/> http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg/


Wiki page:

 <https://community.icann.org/x/9iCfAg> https://community.icann.org/x/9iCfAg


Thank you.

Kind regards,

Terri Agnew




 Adobe Connect chat transcript for Tuesday 12 August 2014:


  Terri Agnew:Welcome to the PPSAI WG Meeting of 12 August 2014

  Val Sherman:Good morning all

  Chris Pelling:Afternoon all :)

  Don Blumenthal:First mute reminder of the morning.

  Carlton Samuels:Morning all

  Carlton Samuels:Hi DOn

  Holly Raiche:Evening all

  Carlton Samuels:Hi Holly

  Holly Raiche:@ Carlton - Hi There

  Danielle Andela:Good morning from LA!

  Bladel:James also here. :)

  Carlton Samuels:We have an echo

  Luc Seufer:Afternoon

  Carlton Samuels:No Don.

  Graeme Bunton:Yep

  Carlton Samuels:Still echo

  Chris Pelling:nope

  Val Sherman:nope

  Keith Kupferschmid:no echo here

  Terri Agnew:Jim Bikoff and Luc Seufer has joined

  O. Novoa:the sound is OK for me

  Carlton Samuels:Good now; no echo

  Mary Wong:Please use either the AC audio or the phone bridge, and mute your mic when not speaking in any case.

  Terri Agnew:Stephanie Perrin has joined

  Mary Wong:Yes, 6 hotl nights per SG

  Terri Agnew:Stephanie Perrin has joined

  Mary Wong:hotel

  Terri Agnew:Susan Kawaguchi has joined

  stephanie perrin:Can't hear Steve...

  stephanie perrin:sorry ignore that...

  Terri Agnew:Frank Michlick has joined

  Terri Agnew:Amr Elsadr has joined

  Graeme Bunton:Chilling effect

  Bladel:An equivalent example would be TMCH claims on generic terms, intimidating registratns to abandon legitimate registrations.

  Terri Agnew:Susan Prosser has joined

  Bladel:But at a minimum, there should be an escalation path.

  Carlton Samuels:How do you validate that standard except to check against a set of attributes?

  Carlton Samuels:..and what would 'checking' entail? Who would have the duty of care? The sender or the P/P provider?

  Terri Agnew:Lindsay Hamilton-Reid has sent apologies

  Holly Raiche:Arguably, the duty of care is on the middle person - the P/P provider?

  Graeme Bunton:That's useful insight James

  Carlton Samuels:end user as in the P/P customer?

  steve metalitz:+1 Paul:  the p/p customer may be more harmed by provider's failure to relay than by the relay 

  Luc Seufer:For once, I will differ from my registrar colleagues. I am fine relaying (as in putting in place an fully automated email forwarding system). I don't want to be put in a position where I am to judge the merit of a complaint that isn't addressed to us

  Bladel:Not concerned about that, to be honeset.

  Bladel:The Registration Agreement requires the registrant to abide by ICANN policies, and the PP service agreement would probably do the same.

  Luc Seufer:In any case we'll happily provide them with an email service with a strong anti-spam filter to block those unsolicited emails

  Graeme Bunton:And that discretion is used every day...

  Chris Pelling:for example to Volker point, the email from one registrar to another registrar for the right of transfer, this email being excluded if requested by the customer to protect their domain

  Chris Pelling:from hijacking

  Bladel:I agree with Steve.

  Bladel:The status quo is "no standard."  So we are definitely changing that.

  stephanie perrin:I think Volker is correct, and this calls for a very serious risk assessment. 

  Carlton Samuels:I would have thought the reason for the specs is that the 'status quo' is all over the place.  So, is there a practice we could look to as 'best practice'?

  Holly Raiche:Refer back to the Whois FinalReport - and its recommendation for a P/P accreditation process - which is where we are now

  Chris Pelling:Michele has wanted to voice his support and position the same as Luc

  Carlton Samuels:And if it can be identified, can we bring it gorward here for  advice and consent?

  Terri Agnew:Christian Dawson has joined

  Volker Greimann:wow

  Chris Pelling:are they ok ?

  Carlton Samuels:Damn!

  Amr Elsadr:!!

  stephanie perrin:We need to identify the problem before we identify best practice, it seems to me. 

  Luc Seufer:I told them house 145! Darn it they hit the wrong one again

  Carlton Samuels:Hope your neighbour is physically not damaged

  Carlton Samuels:@Luc: LOLOLOL

  O. Novoa:sorry but I have to leave, my flight is boarding. bye

  Holly Raiche:Agree with Stephanie's question

  Carlton Samuels:Need to have better oversight of your taliban my friend

  Terri Agnew:Bye Osvaldo

  Carlton Samuels:@Stephanie: +1. Which is why I asked for establishing the problem by its attributes THEN  from that would flow the best practice  for treating it

  Chris Pelling:Volker does that not come down to having to read the comm then

  Don Blumenthal:One reason for a privacy registration. Folks don't know what address to aim for..

  Terri Agnew:Michele Neylon sends his apologies

  Luc Seufer:@DOn good one!

  Chris Pelling:@Don - USP

  Volker Greimann:someone is talking in the back

  Volker Greimann:can hardly hear James

  Don Blumenthal:James, a paper version of a DDoS?

  Amr Elsadr:I'm not hearing anything in the background Volker. Is it your line?

  Chris Pelling:@Don lol

  Volker Greimann:it seems to be the operators

  Chris Pelling:@James totally correct

  Carlton Samuels:@physical communication. You  get a chance to eyeball it. So I quite agree at minimum there must be leeway for the P/P provider to use best judgment for forwarding.  

  Amr Elsadr:Maybe an email notification to the customer asking if they would like the physical mail sent + covering the cost??

  Graeme Bunton:We recently got a an elaborate and large piece of burned wood art sent to our service

  Carlton Samuels:Respect to costs, that should be between the P/P provider and  its customer.

  Chris Pelling:sorry the cost should not be born by the customer

  Chris Pelling:its the sender that wants to send something

  Holly Raiche:I I thought where we got up to last week was to confine reqirements to email and then P/P providerscan offer services above hat (unless there is no email relay?

  Paul McGrady:Thanks everyone.  I need to drop off for my next call.

  Bladel:I agree there are interdependencies

  Chris Pelling:agree with holly in that I thought this was sorted last week

  Bladel:I am sorry, I need to drop the call.

  Volker Greimann:oh bugger, yes, it was my issue

  Chris Pelling:Don again that takes the rights of the individual away

  Luc Seufer:limit forwarding to reasonable limits. e.g. 2 meg. email will be forwarded / 2 pages document sent by registred mail will be scanned and emailed. 

  Carlton Samuels:@Susan: I would not go there. The P/P provider would ahve established a contact modality with the customer  as a base requirement for accredtation.  

  Chris Pelling:ie the rights of the domain owner

  Amr Elsadr:Thanks.

  Carlton Samuels:I would sanction relay by whatever means they establish

  Amr Elsadr:Bye.

  Susan Kawaguchi:Thanks all

  Danielle Andela:thanks

  Luc Seufer:thanks

  Carlton Samuels:Thanks all



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