[Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] MP3 PPSAI WG - Tuesday 23 September 2014 at 1400 UTC

Terri Agnew terri.agnew at icann.org
Tue Sep 23 18:56:40 UTC 2014

Dear All,


Please find the MP3 recording for the Privacy and Proxy Services Accreditation Issues PDP Working group call held on Tuesday 23 September 2014 at 14:00 UTC at:


 <http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-20140923-en.mp3> http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-ppsa-20140923-en.mp3


On page: 

 <http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#sep> http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar#sep


The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:

 <http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/> http://gnso.icann.org/calendar/



Steve Metalitz - IPC

Graeme Bunton – RrSG

Griffin Barnett – IPC

Frank Michlick – Individual

Don Blumenthal – RySG

David Heasley-IPC

Jim Bikoff-IPC

Chris Pelling – RrSG

Kathy Kleiman – NCSG

Darcy Southwell – RrSG

Phil Marano – IPC

Sarah Wyld – RrSG

Victoria Scheckler - IPC

Lindsay Hamilton-Reid – RrSG

James Bladel – RrSG

Val Sherman – IPC

Luc Seufer – RrSG

Alex Deacon – IPC

Carlton Samuels – At-Large

Todd Williams – IPC

Michael Palage - RySG

Christian Dawson – ISPCP

Keith Kupferschmid-IPC

Libby Baney-BC

Amr Elsadr-NCUC

David Cake-NCSG

Kiran Malancharuvil-IPC

Osvaldo Novoa-ISPCP

Tatiana Khramtsova - RrSG

Sean McInerney – no SOI


Apologies :

Kristina Rosette – IPC

Susan Prosser – RrSG

Michele Neylon – RrSG

Phil Corwin-BC


ICANN staff:

Mary Wong

Marika Konings

Amy Bivins

Danielle Andela

Nathalie Peregrine

Terri Agnew


** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **


Mailing list archives:

 <http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg/> http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg/


Wiki page:

 <https://community.icann.org/x/9iCfAg> https://community.icann.org/x/9iCfAg


Thank you.

Kind regards,

Terri Agnew




 Adobe Connect chat transcript for Tuesday 23 September 2014:

  Mary Wong:Welcome to the PPSAI WG meeting of 23 September 2014!

  Chris Pelling:good afternoon all

  Carlton Samuels:Morning all

  Libby Baney:Happy fall all

  Graeme Bunton:Morning everyone.

  Bladel:GM everyone.

Graeme Bunton:http://la51.icann.org/en/schedule-full

  Frank Michlick:Good * everyone - whatever is appropiate in your timezone

  Graeme Bunton:Yep

  Val Sherman:Morning all

  Vicky Sheckler:hi

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Marika Konings, Danielle Andela and Vicky Schlecker also noted for attendance

  Bladel:Having trouble hearing Don.?

  Terri Agnew:David Cake has joined

  Danielle Andela:Thanks Nathalie

  Bladel:Is it just me?

  Griffin Barnett:i could hear don alright

  Amr Elsadr:I can hear him fine too.

  Bladel:ok. just me, apparently. :)

  Luc Seufer:Hearing him fine, but I am young :-p

  Terri Agnew:Christain Dawson has joined

  Christian Dawson:Hi all

  Chris Pelling:I can hear him fine too

  Terri Agnew:Kiran Malancharuvil has joined

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Apologies for being late. 

  Terri Agnew:Osvaldo Novoa and Todd Williams has joined

  Don Blumenthal:Welcome back, Kiran

  Don Blumenthal:hoping I haven't you before.

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Thanks Don.

  Keith Kupferschmid:I can no longer hear Don.  the connection got very bad.

  Griffin Barnett:same

  Darcy Southwell:I'm having a great deal of trouble hearing Don

  steve metalitz:Don there is a lot of static on your line

  Graeme Bunton:(ok, now you are a bit quiet again Don)

  Amr Elsadr:Don, now it's really hard to hear what you're saying.

  Sarah Wyld - Aplus.net:Don, did you move away from your mic?

  Chris Pelling:issues with Don's voice here in the uk

  Chris Pelling:aha 


  Chris Pelling:don no

  Chris Pelling:perfect

  Nathalie  Peregrine:Don, would you like us to dial out to you?

  Chris Pelling:are you holding the mic ?

  Graeme Bunton:Thanks Steve, no issues here

  Chris Pelling:LEA is the police

  Darcy Southwell:Agree with the 3 definitions, including James' suggestion about an add to the definition of disclosure.

  Vicky Sheckler:steve - havent had a chance to read them yet - will do so and provide comments as appropriate

  Mary Wong:Document is unsync'ed so you should be able to scroll thru.

  Terri Agnew:Don has joined audio

  Don Blumenthal:I'm baaack

  Kathy:Welcome back!

  Kathy:When and how the customer will be contacted will also be included in the TOS


  Chris Pelling:Kathy generally by email, if the email bounces and you are on the 2013 RAA that would constitute a suspension (if the bounce is a hard bounce)

  Chris Pelling:ah Sorry Kathy, thought that was a quiestion, ill go back under my stone

  Kathy:@Chris: all data helpful, tx you!

  Terri Agnew:Phil Marano has joined

  Kiran Malancharuvil:apologies if this was discussed while i was out, but what is a "hard bounce"?

  Chris Pelling:Permanent failure where it will not retry 

  Kiran Malancharuvil:thanks

  Kathy:@Don, Steve, Mary: I don't think this is a question we can answer right now. 

  Kathy:I think most people will have to go back and review the RAA... I do!

  David Cake:Contrast with a soft bounce, where the email server says that it hasn't delivered, but will keep trying for a while. 

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Thanks David.  Assumed that was correct, but I have learned to always ask.  :) 

  Chris Pelling:Thank you Don

  Chris Pelling:its really not a simple cut and dry count I am sorry to say

  Chris Pelling:ok, from what we have seen, the PP service provider has been removed

  Terri Agnew:Sean McInerney has joined audio

  Bladel:Publication, not reveal.

  Amr Elsadr:Does reveal = publication or disclosure?

  Marika Konings:in the UDRP context, it is publication

  Amr Elsadr:Thanks.

  Marika Konings:(sorry, may have mixed up some of the definitions we agreed to)

  Amr Elsadr:We're all doing that. :)

  Graeme Bunton:Sorry,yes, publish

  Darcy Southwell:We also Publish in the event of a UDRP.

  Chris Pelling:ah - ok, I answered  Kathy wrong in the emails, the PP service is disabled after UDRP service provider has been informed 

  Griffin Barnett:+1 Todd

  Mary Wong:Marka is referring the the GNSO Council resolution to have an Issue Report prepared on reviewing the UDRP and all other Rights Protection Mechanisms 18 months after the delegation of the first new gTLD.

  Kathy:From a liability view, I can see why there is Publication, but from a fairness point of view, it seems unfair

  Graeme Bunton:no disagreement Kathy

  Kathy:Mere filing of a UDRP should lead to a  reveal,  perhaps, but  I worry about  global publication withiout even a finding of  bad faith

  Bladel:I agree.  Especially considering that this could be abused.

  Graeme Bunton:For the low cost of filing a UDRP, you can use it to reveal


  Bladel:And then cancel the UDRP

  Kathy:So what is within our scope to work on here.

  Chris Pelling:Kathy, it all depends if the PP provider or registrar is listed

  Bladel:Maybe a special "Reveal" to only the panelist, until the window to cancel the UDRP is closed?

  Marika Konings:If I recall well, UDRP Providers do carry out an admin check at the start of the process to make sure they are not dealing with a bogus complaint.

  Libby Baney:+1 Steve re interim standards

  Kathy:It seems the P/P should disclose the customer to the UDRP filer and the UDRP Forum and leave it at that

  Luc Seufer:Depending on the implementation of the Lock UDRP WG report, registrants won't even be notified of the proceedings let alone of the suspension of the P/P service.

  Marika Konings:If I recall well, the problem is that the UDRP Provider currently does not have the possibility to verify that someone is who they say they are, apart from taking that information from the publicly available Whois.

  Mary Wong:Scopewise, this WG could note potential impact b/c of UDRP actions but can't rec changes to UDRP Rules or practice - it could rec that these be looked at in the proper forum/process, of course.

  Chris Pelling:Marika, we answer the udrp provider

  Chris Pelling:and once the new updated complaint is received we then pass that onto the registrant

  Luc Seufer:I am not very knowlmedgeable in the UDRP providers supplemental rules but I think they all include an anti-abuse provision.

  Marika Konings:right, but what if I go back and say, I'm listed as the registrant, but it should really be Mary. How can the UDRP Provider verify that is indeed the case (although I guess this could  possibly be addressed in the context of accredited P/P providers)

  steve metalitz:Can staff put the questions up on screen?

  Amr Elsadr:Is there an anti-abuse provision in the UDRP? I wasn't aware of one.

  steve metalitz:I mean the questions posed to providers after our last call

  Mary Wong:Oh sorry Steve

  Mary Wong:@Steve, they're on the pod on the right

  steve metalitz:Thanks Mary.

  steve metalitz:We are also lacking responses to queston 3. 

  Mary Wong:Staff will compile the various email responses received and send those out (and update as necessary)

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Agree with Steve that we lack answers to questions 3, 4 and 5

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Which would be very helpful, thanks!

  Griffin Barnett:+1

  Mary Wong:You're very welcome, Steve and all :)


  steve metalitz:We all have challenges to face.....

  Griffin Barnett:thanks all

  Kiran Malancharuvil:Thanks


  Luc Seufer:Merci

  Lindsay Hamilton-Reid:Thanks

  Amr Elsadr:Thanks. Bye.

  Chris Pelling:thanks all



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