[Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed approach for reviewing public comments
Volker Greimann
vgreimann at key-systems.net
Tue Jul 21 08:48:02 UTC 2015
Hi Paul,
I am sure these are process questions of inter-jurisdictional nature. I
would presume these are best left to the governments of the world to
decide upon. The current processes for cross-border law enforcement
assistance are based on international agreements beteen countries and if
the governments of these countries saw a need to strengthen or speed up
the reach of their law enforcement agencies they would be implementing
faster processes.
In the meantime, the victim could also complaint ot law enforcement at
the location of the service, instead of his own LEA if he is worried
about a delay caused by jurisdictional questions.
I agree that as the internet is international, some tools of the past do
not work as well as they did in years past, but it is up to the
governments of the world to solve the jurisdictional and process issues;
it is not up to ICANN.
In any case, you completely ignored my argument (or question) that
regulation of privacy services would in no way help those bullied
teenagers or scammed elderly couples. Protection of such users is a
problem well beyond online privacy services and would exist exactly in
the same manner with or without privacy services. So your argument seems
to me like a red herring.
Best,
Volker
Am 20.07.2015 um 20:13 schrieb McGrady, Paul D.:
>
> Hi Volker,
>
> Your somewhat dismissive suggestion to “file a police report” doesn’t
> reflect:
>
> ·The time and difficulties of getting an indictment so that a court
> order can be issued;
>
> ·Getting that court order enforced in jurisdictions that do not
> cooperate with the particular home jurisdiction of the victim; and
>
> ·The seriousness of the threats which consumers face, especially
> children, when using the Internet for non-commercial purposes.
>
> Unfortunately, the news services share a steady stream of horrifying
> stories of teenagers who harm themselves due to cyberbullying or
> elderly couples who lose entire life savings in online scams. Surely
> we must take their interests seriously, even if no one alerted them to
> file a comment.
>
> As you know from my prior posts, I don’t disagree with the notion that
> “the rights and interests of those that use these services for
> legitimate reasons” are important interests. They just can’t be the
> only interests taken into account, which is exactly what the
> “litigation only” approach does.
>
> Again, if you have any substantive suggestions on how to implement
> “litigation only” in a way that takes into account the need to protect
> non-commercial users of the Internet, even if they aren’t buying
> domain names or paying for privacy services, I would welcome hearing
> them.
>
> Regards,
>
> Paul
>
> *From:*Volker Greimann [mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net]
> *Sent:* Monday, July 20, 2015 12:25 PM
> *To:* McGrady, Paul D.; gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed
> approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> I agree that non-commercial users and consumers may need protection as
> well, but I am just not sure how this relates to privacy services at
> all. How does knowing the underlying data of a privacy service help a
> scam victim? If there is illegal use, odds are the underlying data
> will not be of much value either. Criminals rarely leave their home
> address on file anywhere near their crime scenes.
>
> Surely preferred venue for addressing such abuse by consumers is their
> local police station, who will initiate an investigation and can get a
> court order if the substance of the case bears that out. Across
> borders, legal assistance is available. A British law enforcement
> official has proper venues to request legal assistance from his German
> counterpart, for example.
>
> Which leaves us with the rights and interests of those that use these
> services for legitimate reasons. We need to ensure their interests are
> protected too. For reasons, go look at the hundreds of public comments
> where users detail why they NEED strong protections of their privacy
> that cannot be easily circumvented.
>
> Am 20.07.2015 um 18:53 schrieb McGrady, Paul D.:
>
> Thanks Volker. For the benefit of the others on the list, I am
> pulling up a copy of your original email to me so that I can be
> read along with your additional thoughts below.
>
> imap://vgreimann%40key-systems%2Enet@mail-01.key-systems.net:993/fetch%3EUID%3E/INBOX%3E177920?header=quotebody&part=1.2&filename=image001.jpg
>
> Also, thank you for this statement in your post below:
>
> “I also think that the importance of the debate is of the essence
> here, but that does not only include the interests of IP and
> trademark rights holders but also those of those affected by
> anything we come up with, i.e. civil society, private individuals
> and organizations, and their rights and interests”
>
> which appears to adopt my concern for the protection of
> non-commercial users who are victims of scams, crime, etc. While
> I thought it was interesting that you attempted to bring in IP and
> trademark rights holders into a conversation about non-commercial
> user’s need to get access to information about criminals and
> others abusing them and the DNS, I’m not sure that simply beating
> the IP/Trademark Holder straw man is that same thing as putting
> forward substantive ideas on how to balance in the concerns of
> non-commercial, non-DNS customer consumers with the “mandatory
> litigation” framework you are proposing. I again welcome any
> substantive comments you may have regarding how we protect those
> consumers – even if they do not own a domain name or pay for P/P
> services – within the mandatory litigation paradigm which would
> result in months-long delay to get an order from the victim’s
> court served on a P/P service countries away.
>
> Thanks in advance for your substantive thoughts on how to balance
> these interests.
>
> Best,
>
> Paul
>
> *From:*Volker Greimann [mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net]
> *Sent:* Monday, July 20, 2015 11:16 AM
> *To:* McGrady, Paul D.; gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed
> approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> I intended to post to the list, apologies if I misclicked.
>
> I wanted to say that the truth is probably somewhere in the
> middle. No one is served if the justice system takes months to
> process a simple request, OTOH, this is not a reason for
> circumventing due process. Slow justice is better than no justice
> or vigilantism.
>
> I also think that the importance of the debate is of the essence
> here, but that does not only include the interests of IP and
> trademark rights holders but also those of those affected by
> anything we come up with, i.e. civil society, private individuals
> and organizations, and their rights and interests.
>
> Best,
>
> Volker
>
>
> Am 20.07.2015 um 17:30 schrieb McGrady, Paul D.:
>
> Thanks Volker. I don’t think your comment appreciates the
> importance of the debate. Is there a reason that it was sent
> only to me and not to the list? Any object to me posting it
> on the list? Thanks.
>
> *From:*Volker Greimann [mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net]
> *Sent:* Monday, July 20, 2015 10:26 AM
> *To:* McGrady, Paul D.
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised proposed
> approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Hi Paul,
>
> it seems a good thing not to be in a common law country then,
> as over here usually a different axiom applies: "justice
> hurried along is bad justice". If a case is there, a court
> will be able to see that and issue an order. Getting
> injunctive relief can take as little as half a day.
>
> Best,
>
> Volker
>
>
>
> Am 20.07.2015 um 17:15 schrieb McGrady, Paul D.:
>
> Thanks Volker. I’m pretty sure it won’t do any good to
> get drawn into a conversation about the consequences of
> service providers being and permanently staying the RNH,
> since that is not what is really being discussed. The
> conversation has evolved well past that point and a long,
> long time ago.
>
> I would, however, appreciate your substantive thoughts on
> how we balance the need for consumers who are victims of
> scams and crime (even if those consumers don’t happen to
> be domain name registrants or P/P customers) within the
> “court order only” paradigm which on its face is woefully
> inadequate to bring about a timely remedy. It is now
> axiomatic in common law jurisdictions that “Justice
> delayed is justice denied.”
>
> I’m looking forward to your reply. Thanks for your time.
>
> Best,
>
> Paul
>
> *From:*Volker Greimann [mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net]
> *Sent:* Monday, July 20, 2015 9:03 AM
> *To:* McGrady, Paul D.; James Gannon;
> gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised
> proposed approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Privacy or proxy services do not conflict with section
> 3.3.1.6 of the RAA (nor RA) as formally, the service
> provider is the RNH in a proxy form.
>
>
> Volker
>
> Am 20.07.2015 um 14:25 schrieb McGrady, Paul D.:
>
> Thanks James. The ship has already sailed on option
> a). See 3.3.1.6 of the RA noting the mandatory
> requirement of the disclosure of “The name and postal
> address of the Registered Name Holder.” What this
> team is discussing is how to develop an framework for
> exceptions to 3.3.1.6 that does not create a safe
> haven for human traffickers, cyber-bullies, and other
> nefarious types that would harm non-commercial users
> of the Internet. It is not within our remit to undo
> 3.3.1.6, no matter how many form comments are posted
> asking that we do so. Our remit is finding what
> circumstances warrant the exception through allowing
> WHOIS modification and which do not, the means to
> communicate to someone who is legitimately using such
> WHOIS modification services, and the terms upon which
> such allowable WHOIS modification will be terminated
> if it is being used to abuse others.
>
> Even if abolishing 3.3.1.6 were a possibility and the
> DNS wasn’t built on a series of contracts (which it
> is), I see no particular upside to telling parents of
> children being bullied online, geriatric victims of
> banking scams, and targets of pay-in-advance credit
> offers that they have to wait months while their local
> court order requiring disclosure makes its way through
> the Hague Convention service process in order to be
> effectuated by a far-away privacy service. Although
> we have heard much about protecting the rights of
> non-commercial users of the Internet who happen to be
> domain name registrants as well and who are using P/P
> services (and we should be concerned about them), we
> also need to keep in mind the other non-commercial
> users of the Internet who will also be affected – even
> if they have not contributed financially to the system
> by purchasing a domain name.
>
> I for one hope we can get back on track and discuss
> the substantive, relevant comments and reach final
> consensus on the handful of outstanding issues and get
> a report in to the GNSO that reflects a sensible balance.
>
> Regards,
>
> Paul
>
> *From:*gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>
> [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org] *On
> Behalf Of *James Gannon
> *Sent:* Monday, July 20, 2015 5:51 AM
> *To:* Volker Greimann; gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised
> proposed approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Agreed Volker I would put my analysis in set A aswell.
>
> -James
>
> *From:*gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>
> [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org] *On
> Behalf Of *Volker Greimann
> *Sent:* Monday, July 20, 2015 11:37 AM
> *To:* gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly revised
> proposed approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Hi Steve,
>
> these comments can be read in different ways:
>
> a) ICANN should not implement policy that requires
> disclosure without a court order, or
> b) no disclosure should be allowed without a court order.
>
> I tend to interpret the comments as being in the a)
> column.
>
> Best,
>
> Volker
>
> Am 17.07.2015 um 21:42 schrieb Metalitz, Steven:
>
> No, James, we should certainly consider those
> concerns but not necessarily change the report.
>
> The single concern raised more often than any
> other, I am positive, is that proxy services
> should not be permitted to disclose any
> information on their customer without a court
> order. That is not a standard that your service
> or any other that I know of can meet. We can
> change our report to make that a requirement for
> privacy/proxy service providers. Should we?
>
> Steve
>
> *From:*James M. Bladel [mailto:jbladel at godaddy.com]
> *Sent:* Friday, July 17, 2015 3:35 PM
> *To:* Metalitz, Steven
> *Cc:* Kathy Kleiman; gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly
> revised proposed approach for reviewing public
> comments
>
> Steve:
>
> With respect, if several thousand commenters
> raised issues that concern them, but are not
> addressed by our report, the our focus should be
> on changing the report, not discounting the comments.
>
> Thank you,
>
> J.
>
> ____________
>
> James Bladel
>
> GoDaddy
>
>
> On Jul 17, 2015, at 21:20, Metalitz, Steven
> <met at msk.com <mailto:met at msk.com>> wrote:
>
> I am all in favor of people identifying topics
> they believe need to be addressed by the WG.
> However, Kathy, I have to disagree with your
> premise, which is that the ten thousand plus
> comments reflect responses to our questions or
> even statements of agreement or disagreement
> to our consensus positions or report
> proposals. A much smaller (though still
> significant) number of comments do that, and
> those should be our top priority for review
> and response. But the vast majority of
> comments clearly are not responses to our
> report. These mass comments raise a very
> limited number of issues, which I don’t think
> we will that much difficulty dealing with once
> we have addressed the responses to our
> questions and the reasoned statements of
> agreement or disagreement with specific
> proposals we have made.
>
> Let’s get started on the more substantive
> comments, starting with the questions we did
> pose. We have subteams forming to start to
> tackle that, and the staff (and Graeme!) are
> providing some tools to try to help facilitate
> that. For those who don’t wish to join
> subteams, again, I agree it would be useful to
> identify (as you put it) the “major issues and
> concerns” that you find in the comments, with
> citations to those comments that you believe
> raise those major issues and concerns.
>
> Steve
>
> *From:*gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>
> [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org]
> *On Behalf Of *Kathy Kleiman
> *Sent:* Thursday, July 16, 2015 6:34 PM
> *To:* gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A slightly
> revised proposed approach for reviewing public
> comments
>
> Hi Don, Steve, Graeme, Mary and all WG members,
> I would like recommend that we take a slightly
> different approach. We received over ten
> thousand comments, many coming from those who
> do not ordinarily participate in the ICANN
> process. They wrote to us us not only in
> response to our specific questions, but also
> to share agreement (and disagreement) to our
> consensus positions/report proposals, and to
> explain why proxy/privacy registrations are
> important to them. There has been a huge
> outpouring particularly on the last issue.
>
> While a few topics for cataloging these
> comments were presented on the call, with
> great respect, I do not think we have dealt
> with or cataloged all of the major issues and
> concerns raised by the comments yet. Before we
> leap forward to subteams and analysis,
> shouldn't we ask further, in writing, and with
> the whole of the WG participating -- have we
> gotten the topics right? Have we created
> sufficient topics to allow us to catalog the
> broad range of information, concerns and
> comments shared with us by so many commenters?
>
> I would like to request that we be able to
> take big breath, and a slightly (only
> slightly!) different approach. In preparation
> for Tuesday's call, could we all skim the
> comments -- with our array of expertise,
> insight, knowledge of aspects of our commenter
> base -- to come up with topics that we think
> the WG should evaluate in tour review? Perhaps
> if we can circulate the topics online, and
> then discuss them on Tuesday.
>
> Then we discuss how these topics/this
> substance might be overlaid on the subteam
> process laid out below and shared for the
> first time on last week's call. We will then
> have both substance and process! And we will
> know that we have considered all of the major
> issues arising from these important comments.
>
> If we go forward now without this evaluation,
> I fear we may be missing much of what the
> comments have to offer.
>
> Best and tx,
> Kathy
>
>
> *From:* gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org>
> [mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg-bounces at icann.org]
> *On Behalf Of *Mary Wong
>
>
>
>
> *Sent:*14 July 2015 23:50
> *To:* gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org
> <mailto:gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg at icann.org>
> *Subject:* [Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg] A proposed
> approach for reviewing public comments
>
> Dear WG members,
>
> Following from the WG call earlier today, the
> co-chairs and staff after some consultation
> would like to propose the following approach
> for your consideration:
>
> _1. Use of Sub Teams for Specific Topics_:
>
> * Sub-teams comprising a few WG volunteers
> each can be formed to do the initial
> review of public comments received on the
> three topics suggested by Steve on the
> call, i.e. (1) Section 1.3.2 of the
> Initial Report (on escalation of relay
> requests and the handling of
> disclosure/publication requests from third
> parties other than IP rights holders); (2)
> Section 1.3.3 (on the open question
> regarding online financial transactions);
> and (3) Annex E (the Illustrative
> Disclosure Framework).
> * To assist the WG evaluate the usefulness
> of sub teams, a sub team for Section 1.3.2
> can be formed first and serve as a “test
> case” for the exercise.
> * As outlined on the call, a sub team will
> do a “first pass” through a template,
> based on the Public Comment Review Tool,
> that staff will populate with all the
> input received on that particular issue.
> The sub team will report back to the full
> WG in a timely fashion, including
> suggesting a WG response and/or proposed
> action in relation to the comments received.
> * Sub teams may elect to do their work via
> email and online tools (e.g. Google Docs
> or a wiki page), with or without
> supplemental conference calls. Any calls
> will be recorded and transcribed for
> transparency purposes, and drafts and
> other documents prepared using online
> tools will also be made available to the
> full WG. (Do note, however, that depending
> on call scheduling and timing, staff
> support may not be available for all
> requested calls if several sub teams are
> used concurrently.)
>
> *PLEASE VOLUNTEER FOR SUB TEAM 1.3.2 IF YOU
> ARE INTERESTED IN ASSISTING WITH THIS INITIAL
> REVIEW. *Staff will endeavor to provide the
> template tool for 1.3.2 to the sub team as
> soon as possible, hopefully by Monday.
>
> _2. Full WG Review of Other Comments to
> Continue in Parallel_:
>
> * Staff will “collapse” (per James’
> suggestion on the call) all those template
> responses received that were simply a Yes
> or No answer to a question, without any
> further comment added – these will be
> reflected in the Public Comment Review
> Tool accordingly, as a single collective
> entry. The current Tool (covering
> Preliminary Recommendations 1 through 9)
> will be updated in time for the WG to
> begin this review on the next call.
>
> _3. Collated Information_:
>
> * In addition to the updated spreadsheet
> just circulated by Graeme, we can also
> send you archived mail files of the
> contributions received to the public
> comment forum, should you or your group
> wish to conduct searches through each
> comment yourselves.
>
> We hope the above will be helpful in
> facilitating good progress on the work to be
> done in preparation for the Final Report.
>
> Thanks and cheers
>
> Mary
>
> Mary Wong
>
> Senior Policy Director
>
> Internet Corporation for Assigned Names &
> Numbers (ICANN)
>
> Telephone: +1 603 574 4889
>
> Email: mary.wong at icann.org
> <mailto:mary.wong at icann.org>
>
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> --
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> Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
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>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - Rechtsabteilung -
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>
> The contents of this message may be privileged and
> confidential. Therefore, if this message has been
> received in error, please delete it without reading
> it. Your receipt of this message is not intended to
> waive any applicable privilege. Please do not
> disseminate this message without the permission of the
> author.
>
> --
>
> Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
>
>
>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - Rechtsabteilung -
>
>
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
>
> Im Oberen Werk 1
>
> 66386 St. Ingbert
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
>
>
> Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
>
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
>
>
> Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
>
> Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
>
> Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
>
>
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
>
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
>
>
> Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - legal department -
>
>
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
>
> Im Oberen Werk 1
>
> 66386 St. Ingbert
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
>
>
> Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
>
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
>
>
> CEO: Alexander Siffrin
>
> Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
>
> V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
>
>
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
>
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
>
>
> This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The contents of this message may be privileged and
> confidential. Therefore, if this message has been received
> in error, please delete it without reading it. Your
> receipt of this message is not intended to waive any
> applicable privilege. Please do not disseminate this
> message without the permission of the author.
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
>
>
>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - Rechtsabteilung -
>
>
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
>
> Im Oberen Werk 1
>
> 66386 St. Ingbert
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
>
>
> Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
>
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
>
>
> Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
>
> Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
>
> Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
>
>
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
>
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
>
>
> Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - legal department -
>
>
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
>
> Im Oberen Werk 1
>
> 66386 St. Ingbert
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
>
>
> Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
>
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
>
>
> CEO: Alexander Siffrin
>
> Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
>
> V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
>
>
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
>
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
>
>
> This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The contents of this message may be privileged and
> confidential. Therefore, if this message has been received in
> error, please delete it without reading it. Your receipt of
> this message is not intended to waive any applicable
> privilege. Please do not disseminate this message without the
> permission of the author.
>
>
>
> --
>
> Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
>
>
>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - Rechtsabteilung -
>
>
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
>
> Im Oberen Werk 1
>
> 66386 St. Ingbert
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
>
>
> Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
>
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
>
>
> Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
>
> Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
>
> Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
>
>
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
>
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
>
>
> Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Volker A. Greimann
>
> - legal department -
>
>
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
>
> Im Oberen Werk 1
>
> 66386 St. Ingbert
>
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
>
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
>
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
>
>
> Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
>
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
>
>
> CEO: Alexander Siffrin
>
> Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
>
> V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
>
>
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
>
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
>
>
> This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The contents of this message may be privileged and confidential.
> Therefore, if this message has been received in error, please
> delete it without reading it. Your receipt of this message is not
> intended to waive any applicable privilege. Please do not
> disseminate this message without the permission of the author.
>
> --
> Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
>
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
>
> Volker A. Greimann
> - Rechtsabteilung -
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
> Im Oberen Werk 1
> 66386 St. Ingbert
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
> Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
> Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
> Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
> Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
> Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
>
> --------------------------------------------
>
> Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Volker A. Greimann
> - legal department -
>
> Key-Systems GmbH
> Im Oberen Werk 1
> 66386 St. Ingbert
> Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
> Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
> Email:vgreimann at key-systems.net <mailto:vgreimann at key-systems.net>
>
> Web:www.key-systems.net <http://www.key-systems.net> /www.RRPproxy.net <http://www.RRPproxy.net>
> www.domaindiscount24.com <http://www.domaindiscount24.com> /www.BrandShelter.com <http://www.BrandShelter.com>
>
> Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
> www.facebook.com/KeySystems <http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems>
> www.twitter.com/key_systems <http://www.twitter.com/key_systems>
>
> CEO: Alexander Siffrin
> Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
> V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
>
> Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
> www.keydrive.lu <http://www.keydrive.lu>
>
> This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
>
>
>
>
> The contents of this message may be privileged and confidential.
> Therefore, if this message has been received in error, please delete
> it without reading it. Your receipt of this message is not intended to
> waive any applicable privilege. Please do not disseminate this message
> without the permission of the author.
--
Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann
- Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: vgreimann at key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net
www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
www.facebook.com/KeySystems
www.twitter.com/key_systems
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
www.keydrive.lu
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann
- legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: vgreimann at key-systems.net
Web: www.key-systems.net / www.RRPproxy.net
www.domaindiscount24.com / www.BrandShelter.com
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
www.facebook.com/KeySystems
www.twitter.com/key_systems
CEO: Alexander Siffrin
Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
www.keydrive.lu
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
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