<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>Hi Kiran,</div><div>in Germany (and mostly throughout the EU based on harmonized law), there are information and disclosure requirements for telemedia services. The information duties are different depending on the service or information offered, but they are conclusive, i.e. if you follow what is explicitly requested by law, then you are compliant. There is no such requirement for whois. </div><div><br>I hope this helps.</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Thomas</div><div><div><span style="font-size: 13pt;">---</span></div><div><a href="http://rickert.net">rickert.net</a></div><div><br></div></div><div><br>Am 18.08.2015 um 16:26 schrieb Kiran Malancharuvil <<a href="mailto:Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com">Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com</a>>:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>Thanks Michele,</span><br><span></span><br><span>I did read the entire document as well as the "leaflet" linked. Thanks again for providing. </span><br><span></span><br><span>It hasn't been my experience that the absence of a direct reference to a parallel or complimentary issue in a law means that there is no law or legal standard governing or guiding that parallel or complimentary issue. </span><br><span></span><br><span>Nor would I draw the somewhat surprising conclusion that Volker makes that requiring disclosure on a website makes Whois unnecessary. </span><br><span></span><br><span>Question: who enforces this provision? How do consumers or consumer protection companies submit requests where that information is missing or incorrect? </span><br><span></span><br><span>K</span><br><span></span><br><span>Kiran Malancharuvil </span><br><span>Policy Counselor</span><br><span>MarkMonitor</span><br><span>415-419-9138 (m) </span><br><span></span><br><span>Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos. </span><br><span></span><br><blockquote type="cite"><span>On Aug 18, 2015, at 7:09 AM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight <<a href="mailto:michele@blacknight.com">michele@blacknight.com</a>> wrote:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Kiran</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>If you read the entire document and the “leaflet” linked to they only talk about websites and pages on websites. There’s also an advisory that they put out some time back about email communications.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>There is nothing anywhere that refers to whois in any shape or form. </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>If all the contact details, company number etc., are on the website (and probably in the emails) then I doubt anyone really cares about what may or may not be in the public whois records. </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Bear in mind also that the .ie ccTLD public whois contains less detail than that of a gTLD:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>domain: <a href="http://blacknight.ie">blacknight.ie</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>descr: Blacknight Internet Solutions Limited</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>descr: Body Corporate (Ltd,PLC,Company)</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>descr: Corporate Name</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>admin-c: AAE553-IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>tech-c: AAM456-IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>registration: 21-August-2003</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>renewal: 21-August-2016</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>holder-type: Billable</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>wipo-status: N</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>ren-status: Active</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>in-zone: 1</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>nserver: <a href="http://ns.blacknightsolutions.com">ns.blacknightsolutions.com</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>nserver: <a href="http://ns2.blacknightsolutions.com">ns2.blacknightsolutions.com</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>source: IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>person: <a href="http://Blacknight.com">Blacknight.com</a> Hostmaster</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>nic-hdl: AAE553-IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>source: IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>person: <a href="http://Blacknight.ie">Blacknight.ie</a> Hostmaster</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>nic-hdl: AAM456-IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>source: IEDR</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>If more detail, such as physical address, etc., were required under Irish law I’m pretty sure the .ie ccTLD would include in their whois output.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>It’s also worth noting that the whois for .ie in common with most other ccTLDs rate limits queries.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Regards</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Michele</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>--</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Mr Michele Neylon</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Blacknight Solutions</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Hosting, Colocation & Domains</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://www.blacknight.host/">http://www.blacknight.host/</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://blog.blacknight.com/">http://blog.blacknight.com/</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://www.blacknight.press">http://www.blacknight.press</a> - get our latest news & media coverage</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://www.technology.ie">http://www.technology.ie</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Social: <a href="http://mneylon.social">http://mneylon.social</a></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Random Stuff: <a href="http://michele.irish">http://michele.irish</a> </span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>-------------------------------</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span>Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>On 18/08/2015 14:55, "Kiran Malancharuvil" <<a href="mailto:Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com">Kiran.Malancharuvil@markmonitor.com</a>> wrote:</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Hi Michele,</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>I'm missing the part of the law that expressly states that this doesn't apply to Whois? (implicit exclusions of the laws applicability would work too) Could you send that? Or maybe it's a case? </span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Kiran Malancharuvil </span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Policy Counselor</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>MarkMonitor</span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>415-419-9138 (m) </span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Sent from my mobile, please excuse any typos. </span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>On Aug 18, 2015, at 5:25 AM, Michele Neylon - Blacknight <<a href="mailto:michele@blacknight.com">michele@blacknight.com</a>> wrote:</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>One of the arguments some people put forward against privacy / proxy is one of “transparency”</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Under Irish law limited companies (not businesses / sole traders) have disclosure obligations on their website(s)</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>These do NOT apply to whois</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>“Every limited liability company which has a website is also required to display either on its homepage or to be identified on its homepage, a readily accessible webpage on which the following appear:</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>the name and legal form of the company</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>the place of registration of the company and the number with which it is registered</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>the address of the registered office of the company</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>in the case of a company exempt from the obligation to use the company type (Companies Limited by Guarantee/Designated Activity Companies) as part of its name, the fact that it is such a company.</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>in the case of a company which is being wound up, the fact that it is being wound up</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>if the share capital of a company is mentioned on the website, the reference must be to the paid-up share capital"</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>And <a href="https://www.cro.ie/Registration/Company/Incidental-Obligations/Letterheads">https://www.cro.ie/Registration/Company/Incidental-Obligations/Letterheads</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>So you will find Irish companies that are using proxy / privacy on the whois but who publish all their contact details on their website(s)</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>You’ll also notice that many of the European registrars (myself included) have our company details in our email signatures - whereas most Non-EU based companies don’t ….</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Regards</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Michele</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>--</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Mr Michele Neylon</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Blacknight Solutions</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Hosting, Colocation & Domains</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://www.blacknight.host/">http://www.blacknight.host/</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://blog.blacknight.com/">http://blog.blacknight.com/</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://www.blacknight.press">http://www.blacknight.press</a> - get our latest news & media coverage</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="http://www.technology.ie">http://www.technology.ie</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Intl. +353 (0) 59 9183072</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Direct Dial: +353 (0)59 9183090</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Social: <a href="http://mneylon.social">http://mneylon.social</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Random Stuff: <a href="http://michele.irish">http://michele.irish</a> </span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>-------------------------------</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Blacknight Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit 12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,Ireland Company No.: 370845</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>_______________________________________________</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span>Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list</span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="mailto:Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org">Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><span><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg</a></span><br></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org">Gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg@icann.org</a></span><br><span><a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-ppsai-pdp-wg</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>