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    <p>Even in those cases, the presumption of "innocent until proven
      guilty" would prevail, I assume, and prevent the unregulated,
      free-for all access to what still amounts to private details. I am
      in no way defending the practices you describe, but even criminals
      have basic rights. <br>
    </p>
    <p>To my original argument: If CIA and FBI would have unfettered
      access, why wouldn't their Iranian, Syrian or similar
      counterparts? Had the internet existed a few decades earlier,
      GeStaPo or Stasi would have had a very good time with that data. <br>
    </p>
    <p>We simply have to start with a de minimis approach that we slowly
      and carefully open up the "vault door" as much as necessary, but
      not further.<br>
    </p>
    <p>Best,</p>
    <p>Volker</p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 22.08.2016 um 22:27 schrieb Greg
      Shatan:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CA+aOHUTjoFgHM-80ry08L8b3pKbZBpGW42XROLL+udAmpSOD=w@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
            style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">"We
            therefore need to model our approach on the worst possible
            actors, not the best."</span><br>
        </div>
        <div class="gmail_default"
          style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><span
            style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px"><br>
          </span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font
              face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000">If this is the
              prism through which we view the "actors" involved here,
              that would need to apply to all the actors -- so we need
              to view registrants as a motley crew of phishers, malware
              providers, cybersquatters, counterfeiters, child porn
              purveyors, illegal online pharmacies, and other assorted
              malfeasors.  That would make WHOIS/RDS the rough
              equivalent of a sex offender registry, and our
              requirements regarding availability, contactability,
              accuracy, validation, etc., would need to be ratcheted up
              very significantly.  We may even need a system to track
              registrants, if we follow this thinking to its logical
              conclusion.</font></span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font
              face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000"><br>
            </font></span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font
              face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000">As fascinating
              as this dystopian worldview might be, I reject the idea
              that this is an appropriate approach to our work.</font></span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font
              face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000"><br>
            </font></span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font
              face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000">Greg Shatan</font></span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font
              face="verdana, sans-serif" color="#000000"><br>
            </font></span></div>
        <div class="gmail_default"><br>
        </div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Aug 22, 2016 at 4:05 PM, Ayden
          Férdeline <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com" target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>&gt;</span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div>I share the same view, Carlton. +1 to your comment.<span
                class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
                </font></span></div>
            <span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
                <div><br>
                </div>
                <div>Ayden</div>
                <div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </font></span>
            <blockquote type="cite"><span class="">
                <div>-------- Original Message --------<br>
                </div>
                <div>Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] @EXT: RE: Use cases:
                  Fundamental, Incidental, and Theoretical<br>
                </div>
              </span>
              <div>
                <div class="h5">
                  <div>Local Time: August 22, 2016 5:02 PM<br>
                  </div>
                  <div>UTC Time: August 22, 2016 4:02 PM<br>
                  </div>
                  <div>From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="mailto:carlton.samuels@gmail.com"
                      target="_blank">carlton.samuels@gmail.com</a><br>
                  </div>
                  <div>To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
                      target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a><br>
                  </div>
                  <div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
                      href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
                      target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
                  </div>
                  <div><br>
                  </div>
                  <div dir="ltr">
                    <div class="gmail_extra">
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      <div class="gmail_quote">
                        <div>On Mon, Aug 22, 2016 at 2:19 AM, Volker
                          Greimann <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a
                              moz-do-not-send="true"
                              href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
                              target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>&gt;</span>
                          wrote:<br>
                        </div>
                        <blockquote style="margin:0 0 0
                          .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                          solid;padding-left:1ex" class="gmail_quote">Simply
                          put: Anything that can be abused, will be
                          abuse. We therefore need to model our approach
                          on the worst possible actors, not the best. <br>
                        </blockquote>
                      </div>
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      <div style="font-family:&quot;comic sans
                        ms&quot;,sans-serif;font-size:small"
                        class="gmail_default">+1<br>
                      </div>
                      <div style="font-family:&quot;comic sans
                        ms&quot;,sans-serif;font-size:small"
                        class="gmail_default"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div style="font-family:&quot;comic sans
                        ms&quot;,sans-serif;font-size:small"
                        class="gmail_default">I cannot see how any other
                        model makes sense in this context.<br>
                      </div>
                      <div style="font-family:&quot;comic sans
                        ms&quot;,sans-serif;font-size:small"
                        class="gmail_default"><br>
                      </div>
                      <div style="font-family:&quot;comic sans
                        ms&quot;,sans-serif;font-size:small"
                        class="gmail_default">-Carlton<br>
                      </div>
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      <div><br>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
                          <div dir="ltr">
                            <div>
                              <div><br>
                              </div>
                              <div>==============================<br>
                              </div>
                              <div><i><span style="font-family:comic
                                    sans ms,sans-serif">Carlton A
                                    Samuels</span></i><br>
                              </div>
                              <div><span style="font-family:comic sans
                                  ms,sans-serif"><i>Mobile: <a
                                      moz-do-not-send="true"
                                      href="tel:876-818-1799"
                                      value="+18768181799"
                                      target="_blank">876-818-1799</a><br>
                                    <span style="color:#33cc00">Strategy,
                                      Planning, Governance, Assessment
                                      &amp; Turnaround</span></i></span></div>
                              <div>=============================<br>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                </div>
              </div>
            </blockquote>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <br>
            ______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
            gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list<br>
            <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
            <a moz-do-not-send="true"
              href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg"
              rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg</a><br>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg</a></pre>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen,

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- Rechtsabteilung -

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