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<div style="font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">Dear All,</span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Please find the attendance of the call attached to this email and the MP3 recording below for the Next-Gen RDS PDP Working group call held on Wednesday, 21 December 2016 at 06:00 UTC.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style="margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; line-height: 15.6pt;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><b>MP3:</b> </span><a href="http://mailer.samanage.com/wf/click?upn=NrFWbrBstcrPWP369qgbqlXiSKeL20xnUXzI03ZqpsvgRhF8anYZT-2Fu85DJG3jGxHYOrnyFbboPTVR2-2FUe-2FlZrBDAHYvHfo83vM5J6KcMpY-3D_QuA5zZR9ZZ7J1F2FeF-2FOsgm1hgIDcBrAX2P7Ezxmql7ckJc4ios1-2BxObAoz2rzLSI3c4QB1NGo7bw7XrBjpRCbz74w4vzk48UxZMFoBBQBQaQ0ePdiOjdJ30sQNHkokOf-2F2p-2FBvMgKvMhzp-2B4u8fP-2BRrSytHe2KCf2HpQmtSbpezMgNTUG57PiORAPesOotpHA-2BC4pSmXJRsVmpbNaLqzhFSwGPnv2v-2FgoCMIrC8INcSY5ut4-2FG2Sv-2Fw2UdSyBhjgxuuDC0IqItmMVkZ-2F-2Fqkap8JkCN7pJEVVBiAkquSucggbJ2uIUqiVvguBhkWxRkzX-2F0VA9LKRNbr4LR41Por7wp-2BEbzUb3A9oMSSnOo92YKVfjuev2uUiflTwtbZu61uxZRMUkDX4u8FtK-2FzY56x9XhO4jPiQzDFZQfXCgJpjj-2F9oNXNP8MZm9Nh1z3vlXho-2FiqkwDURpcpo6-2FSBgaXOLW7f4-2FQuJFJQNiYh9UvsyA1AO8bsNF3YfjT8yzDnjk3-2F" style="text-decoration: none; color: rgb(0, 102, 178);"><font face="Calibri"></a><a href="http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-nextgen-rds-pdp-21dec16-en.mp3">http://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-nextgen-rds-pdp-21dec16-en.mp3</a></font></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__gnso.icann.org_en_group-2Dactivities_calendar-23nov&d=DgMF-g&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=PDd_FX3f4MVgkEIi9GHvVoUhbecsvLhgsyXrxgtbL10DTBs0i1jYiBM_uTSDzgqG&m=MdoIWWmVe8Ie3cR5SwSjiRm4E8EdnUr-CxOvAN1NKTw&s=0ZIjzpmsq1BYAQV6x2b0WZ-cPm1B_4GAUL75kvjK4Fg&e=" style="color: purple;">http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Mailing list archives:<a href="http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rds-pdp-wg/" style="color: purple;">http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rds-pdp-wg/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Wiki page: </span><a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_45vDAw&d=DgMF-g&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=PDd_FX3f4MVgkEIi9GHvVoUhbecsvLhgsyXrxgtbL10DTBs0i1jYiBM_uTSDzgqG&m=MdoIWWmVe8Ie3cR5SwSjiRm4E8EdnUr-CxOvAN1NKTw&s=P9hxSXa7YMqtlJfXLA47-Ms5DOgomHvcDbiEQDdq07g&e=" style="font-family: -webkit-standard; font-size: 14px;">https://community.icann.org/x/45vDAw[community.icann.org]</a></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Thank you.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Kind regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNoSpacing" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt;"><font face="Calibri">Nathalie</font></p>
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<p class="MsoNoSpacing" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;"><b><u><font face="Calibri,sans-serif" size="3">AC Chat Next-Gen RDS PDP WG </font><font face="Calibri,sans-serif"><span style="font-size: 15px;">Wednesday</span></font><font face="Calibri,sans-serif" size="3">,
21 December 2016</font></u></b></p>
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<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Nathalie Peregrine:Dear All, Welcome to the Next-Gen RDS PDP WG call on Wednesday 21 December 2016 at 06:00 UTC.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Nathalie Peregrine:Meeting page: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_i6TDAw&d=DgIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=PDd_FX3f4MVgkEIi9GHvVoUhbecsvLhgsyXrxgtbL10DTBs0i1jYiBM_uTSDzgqG&m=N3bnRtN9WnHh0itusNQju0YLysaYdVOEVJxEpgYnaeo&s=nZ62H1uiSMyRgeIgK05vI3trDIqh3vqsOK9XcgK44Jw&e=">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_i6TDAw&d=DgIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=PDd_FX3f4MVgkEIi9GHvVoUhbecsvLhgsyXrxgtbL10DTBs0i1jYiBM_uTSDzgqG&m=N3bnRtN9WnHh0itusNQju0YLysaYdVOEVJxEpgYnaeo&s=nZ62H1uiSMyRgeIgK05vI3trDIqh3vqsOK9XcgK44Jw&e=</a></div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:Good morning... Or something :-)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:Hello to all</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Nathalie Peregrine:Welcome all!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Fabricio Vayra:Hello</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Hello All</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Hi, Chuck. "e" was suggested by Greg Aaron, not Greg Shatan</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Yes, I wrote that.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:For those of us who did not fill out the poll, can you make the questions accessible so we can input our responses? I tried but once the poll closed I could not find the questions</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:A PDF version of the poll is posted at the last meeting page - but as Chuck notes, the question and options for response are shown on the screen now</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:thanks Lisa</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:PDF link <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_download_attachments_63151075_Poll-2Don-2DPurpose-2Dfrom-2D13DecCall.pdf&d=DgIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=PDd_FX3f4MVgkEIi9GHvVoUhbecsvLhgsyXrxgtbL10DTBs0i1jYiBM_uTSDzgqG&m=N3bnRtN9WnHh0itusNQju0YLysaYdVOEVJxEpgYnaeo&s=yIm8SdJ1IDCSPah_6kcvXeNF8kZZRX-0OAdyEb0I56g&e=">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_download_attachments_63151075_Poll-2Don-2DPurpose-2Dfrom-2D13DecCall.pdf&d=DgIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=PDd_FX3f4MVgkEIi9GHvVoUhbecsvLhgsyXrxgtbL10DTBs0i1jYiBM_uTSDzgqG&m=N3bnRtN9WnHh0itusNQju0YLysaYdVOEVJxEpgYnaeo&s=yIm8SdJ1IDCSPah_6kcvXeNF8kZZRX-0OAdyEb0I56g&e=</a></div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):as I understand 9% is 2 persons</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:Maxim yes, just 2</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):one of the issues - the data is protected only until the first person with "bad ideas" accesses it and shares between such persons ...</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):tracking would require adding random seeds and it is not possible - info should be the same for the particular domain</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:Can someone please remind me of precisely which data elements we are speaking here?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I am not sure we can prevent sharing data after it was taken from the system</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:are we requiring the user/collector of the data to identify/authenticate themselves</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:I think we are only talking about the thin WHOIS output </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:@Stephanie: See the top of the document displayed in the window - definition of thin data given by the Thick WHOIS Report</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:so just enough data to identify the registrar, the status of the registration, and the creation and expiration dates of each registration. (I think?)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:"A thin registry only stores and manages the information associated with the domain name. This set includes data sufficient to identify the sponsoring registrar, status of the registration, creation
and expiration dates for each registration, name server data, the last time the record was updated in its Whois data store, and the URL for the registrar’s Whois service."</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:I'll have to dial in sepeately</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Nathalie Peregrine:@ Greg, we can dial out to you if you prefer.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:Ayden - it's useful data for technical stuff at one level</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:but that's about it</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:thanks Michele</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Working Adobe! A Christmas miracle! ;-)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Let me try now.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:well it's logged anyway </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:I think some thin data elements (i.e. nameservers) should be available anonymously, but not all.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:Ayden - like?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:sound gone</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):do we lost adobe audio?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:CHuck are you on mute?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:not hearing </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Sam Lanfranco npoc/csih:No sound here</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Sam Lanfranco npoc/csih:okay now!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:I imagine that the nameservers need to be accessible in order for the DNS to function unimpeded, but I fail to see why, say, the registry name or the expiration data of a domain name should be available
to anyone for any reason.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:still not working...trying another route...</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:Ayden - oh come on - the registry for .com is always going to be Verisign :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:You have to do that anyway.....create privacy policies</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:expiry date why should that be hidden?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:Sorry, I didn’t catch the name of who was just speaking before Lisa, but the sentiments they shared were mine… I would not want there to be records of every website I visit... so I would not support
some kind of authentication model which recorded, say, every time someone went to a website, which name servers were retrieved, etc… the ability to use the Internet anonymously or pseudonymously is important. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:@Benny - I really hate to flip the question, but why should it be available to anyone for any reason? Isn't it registrar-registrant contract information?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:@Ayden - that was me. ;-)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:Thanks Shane :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:I'm dialed in</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:@Ayden there are several reasons but for one it is a secure way for the registrant to controll that the registry has renewed the domain, without to have to go to the reseller ogf the
reseller of the reseller of the registrar</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:secondly those we fear to misuse it for snapping a domain have access on another level </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:if they used whois they would be blocked </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:well you can't spam based on thin data :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:unless you use the force</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):identification of legal status of a particular act of access to the system - is a legal question and can not be resolved by technical means (until we allow computers to make legal decisions
)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:@Greg - (a) seems closer to (e) than (c)?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:+1 Chuck - the audio went a bit odd towards the end</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Hi, Lisa. A, C, and E share some similarities. But A uses "accessible" in a way that requires a gating and determination of hte users intent, and therefore access control. IN contrast, C and E do not.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:@Greg (a) and (c) both refer to "names should be accessible for any purpose(s)" so it would seem that if you assumed that meant access control/gating, it would apply to both options. (That wasn't our
intent, but trying to sort out what people assumed when choosing those options)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):sometimes Registries even do not know that the data was misused </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Lisa: "A contains an "except>"</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Lisa, no that is not what I assumed.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:@greg, what phrasing made you think access control was implied - just "except" or also "expressly permitted" in (b)?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):+1 </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:The "silent majority". :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:Thanks Shane, great explanation. And let me be clear, I am not looking for an authenticated-only Internet.....I am just wondering where the line needs to be drawn and the relative costs.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:@Stephanie - sure, understood.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Although I forgot to mention that we could outsource the problem to Facebook and require a Facebook login. (I joke!)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:"A" says the data should be "accessible for any purposes EXCEPT for illegitimate purposes". Anotehr way of saying that is that it should NOT be accessible for illegitimate puposes. So that means you
must prohibit illegitimatu purposes. And that means you are keeping people out, and are ensuring that only legit users with good intetnt are getting the data. Thus, you are gating the data, and allowing only certain usres to see it.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:I also don't want to demand something further along on this journey, that will be instantly expanded and misused....and I can provide tons of examples where this is happening already</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):do we trust bad persons to provide us true info? I am not sure it worth trying</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:@Lisa - spoken like a product owner! ;)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:(I don't disagree, BTW)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:I actually disagree with the first</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Regarding purposes of any field: see the EWG report, pages 129 ff.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:Correct, Michele, but there's als oa contractual line through the reseller to the registrar.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:ask noted the RAA.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:we have an optioanl Reseller field for those registrar swho wish to avail themselves of it. Many choose not to. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:Greg - who is "we"? :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:we being the registration community, to be more precise. </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):I wonder how the persons (who forgot to whom they paid few years ago for a domain) will use those numbers for paying again?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:Maxim - ROFL :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:so true</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:I am confident whoever wants the money will find them</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Michele Neylon:we get CC chargebacks because of confusion</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):do we suggest paying all registrars just to be sure that they do not miss it :) ?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:I will galdly collect for all domains I don't manage</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:Collection here refers to being required by policy to populate an RDS/WHOIS record with values for that element</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Purposes "all"? :-P</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Fabricio Vayra:+1 Greg</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):example of a good purpose : word good in the purpose form ...</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:@Shane, the domain name identifies the record, regardless of purpose, thus "all"</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Sure, I get it.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:what is displayed is a highly trucated verrsion of the original table, and is missing many lines</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rod Rasmussen:The list is NOT comprehensive. :-)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Ah, okay.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:the data element purposes came from use cases - but the use cases were not comprehensive so there are probably additional purposes not listed</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Ah, I see the chart in the report. It's more comprehensive. :)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Greg Aaron:the lsited are not just any old purposes. They are legitimate purposes.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Fabricio Vayra:+1 Greg</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Certainly a registrar has more information than a registry, even in the "thick registry" case? </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Knowing the registrar is always (potentially) useful....</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:nothing from me at this time</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Rod Rasmussen:@Greg Aaron - look at the private chat question I sent you (non ICANN related!)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:I think we could poll on points of agreement to confirm them (and allow for those not on call to weigh in)</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:Staff will launch poll within 24 hours but we should leave poll open for responses through the holidays</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Benny Samuelsen / Nordreg AB:Happy holidays everyone</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Fabricio Vayra:happy holidazzzzzzz</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Susan Kawaguchi:Thanks all! </div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Sam Lanfranco npoc/csih:thanks to all...</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):could we extend poll till JAN?</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Happy Holidays!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Ayden Férdeline:thanks to all, and wishing you all a wonderful new year.</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Shane Kerr:Bye!</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Vlad Dinculescu:Thanks all</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Lisa Phifer:Happy holidays all</div>
<div style="font-family: -webkit-standard;"> Stephanie Perrin:Thanks and Happy New year</div>
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