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<p>I do not think anyone suggested any organization would not be
legitimate enough to participate. Anyone with an opinion on the
matter can (and should) participate. I merely suggested that I see
it as obvious that the source of an argument has an impact on the
interpretation of the argument and should not be disregarded. Or
would anyone in his right mind consider a Breitbart news article
or a Trump tweet as similarly trustworthy, significant and helpful
as they would a researched and vetted WSJ article? Anyone with
something to say can and should contribute, but we should be free
to look at where this argument is coming from as well. Sometimes
what is not being said is as informative as what is being said,
after all.<br>
</p>
<p>I also have not seen much issue with legitimate investigative use
cases. If law enforcement in the pursuit of their duty has a legal
right to access the data, they will in all likelyhood still be
able to get at that data, and I support that in general.
Admittedly, under such a regime, private organizations with no
formal law enforcement powers would have a harder time, and that
is something we should look at once we reach that part of the
deliberation. I personally think that finding the exact "line in
the sand" of who gets what how will be a daunting task, but
worthwhile.<br>
</p>
<p>It is a known fact that the right to privacy of individuals makes
the job of law enforcement harder. That is why each jurisdiction
has tried to define the acceptable borders and intrusions into the
individual privacy necessary to fight specific crime. Law
enforcement has specific rights that may ever vary with the crime
that is being investigated. For example, law enforcement looking
at terror suspects may have significantly more rights to intrude
on the privacy of the suspects than law enforcement fighting
traffic violations. Police may wire-tap a suspect but only after
going through the appropriate process (which will usually require
the approval of a judge).<br>
</p>
<p>And obviously, as an example, private organizations fighting
traffic violations (for example private parking companies trying
to find and fine those illegally using their parking spaces) have
even less rights than state organizations doing the same for
public parking spaces. <br>
</p>
<p>With regard to your comment on accuracy and privacy, I think this
is misplaced here. I think it is faily clear to anyone in this
group that whois data that is accurate constitutes PII whereas
trash data probably does not (it might be PII for someone else if
the data was stolen). In many cases I have seen over the years,
legitimate users of domain names have used trash data in what they
saw as self defense as they did not wish their private details to
be published in the whois. While they technically violated their
registration agreements, nearly all felt this was justified and a
"victimless crime" as they could not see and harm in doing that.
And guess what: No one was actually harmed (except the registrar
saddled with the man-hour cost trying to convince them to update
the data "or else").<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 07.03.2017 um 02:35 schrieb allison
nixon:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CACLR7w+xUDSvNS7W31uZi2+W8c1z52nmQH=0yQAc0NL5f1tDmg@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">The level of resistance here against investigative
use cases is very interesting.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>People claim to care about privacy and then attempt to shut
down a major aspect of combating cybercrime, which is a bigger
violator of privacy than all the whois spam put together and
multiplied by a million.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>To see an individual person denouncing an organization of
many people as somehow not legitimate enough to participate,
while oneself participates- that's also interesting. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Claims that WHOIS data is sensitive and accurate PII
despite common use of trash data and WHOIS privacy, also
interesting.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Something does not add up.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Mar 6, 2017 at 7:40 PM, Patrick
Lenihan via gnso-rds-pdp-wg <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><font
face="arial" color="black" size="2">+1 Stephanie; as a
former USA law enforcement officer.
<div>
<div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
<div
style="font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">----
Original Message ----<br>
From: Stephanie Perrin <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca</a>><br>
To: gnso-rds-pdp-wg <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>><br>
Sent: Mon, Mar 6, 2017 11:36 am<br>
Subject: Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] international law
enforcement association resolution regarding domain
registration data<br>
<br>
<div
id="m_4596522363738953646AOLMsgPart_1.2_338c5306-0470-4406-9031-bbbada6823c7">
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<div><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">I
hesitate to even venture a comment on this
topic, lest it generate another 20
comments, but I am very puzzled about this
whole discussion. I am admittedly much
more familiar with the Canadian
Association of Chiefs of Police, a lobby
group/professional association which is
remarkably similar to this organization,
only on a national level. OF course any
of the police lobby associations are free
to join us, but is anyone suggesting that
we do not have adequate representation of
law enforcement interests at ICANN? Do we
not have several representatives of police
agencies on this working group? Law
enforcement organizations regularly form
part of GAC delegations, certainly our
RCMP are often part of the Canadian
delegation to the GAC. Law enforcement
officials have formed a public safety
working group.....any of these
representatives are presumably capable of
drafting papers for their national
organizations and indeed I suspect someone
has drafted this document for the
International Association, given the
specificity of the resolutions. I am sure
many national associations will endorse it
and bring it to their own national
governments, who in turn will forward it
to their GAC delegations. <br>
</font></font></div>
<div><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Police
organizations regularly lobby for
legislative change to facilitate their
work. (it is nevertheless interesting that
this international organization has a link
for contacting your congressman, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-freetext"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="http://capwiz.com/theiacp/issues/"
target="_blank">http://capwiz.com/theiacp/<wbr>issues/</a>
right under the drop down menu for what we
do). It is not surprising that they have
prepared a resolution on WHOIS, those of
us who have followed the impact of
technology on police work have seen many
similar resolutions on different issues.
Police face problems of time and expense,
not to mention constitutional protection.
However, It is not like law enforcement
has not had its views very well
represented at ICANN over many years.
Given, as Michele has pointed out, that
the bar for membership on this working
group is exceedingly low (show up) it
seems to me the issue we need to worry
about is, who does not have the time and
money to show up.<br>
</font></font></div>
<div>Stephanie Perrin<br>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-cite-prefix">On
2017-03-05 10:57, Michele Neylon - Blacknight
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_WordSection1">
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Chuck</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">That seems a lot saner and
more scalable.</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Regards</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
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Company No.: 370845</span><span
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<div
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#b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:Calibri;color:black">From: </span> </b><span
style="font-family:Calibri;color:black">Chuck
Gomes <a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:cgomes@verisign.com"
target="_blank"><cgomes@verisign.com></a><br>
<b>Date: </b>Sunday 5 March 2017 at
15:56<br>
<b>To: </b>Michele Neylon <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:michele@blacknight.com"
target="_blank"><michele@blacknight.com></a>,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">"icann@ferdeline.com"</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank"><icann@ferdeline.com></a><br>
<b>Cc: </b><a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">"gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"</a>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank"><gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org></a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>RE: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg]
international law enforcement
association resolution regarding
domain registration data</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">I’m concerned that this
could turn into an unending
administrative workload for staff and
would like them to focus their time in
helping us do our deliberations. I am
now sorry I made the suggestion.</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Marika has made a good
suggestion on the leadership list that
we encourage all members to send our
latest WG update to any organizations
that may have a stake in what we are
doing and invite them to join as members
or observers.</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Chuck</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
name="m_4596522363738953646_aolmail__MailEndCompose"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></a></div>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">
Michele Neylon - Blacknight [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-freetext"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:michele@blacknight.com"
target="_blank">mailto:michele@blacknight.com</a><wbr>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, March 05, 2017
8:12 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Ayden Férdeline <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank"><icann@ferdeline.com></a>;
Gomes, Chuck <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:cgomes@verisign.com"
target="_blank"><cgomes@verisign.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] Re:
[gnso-rds-pdp-wg] international law
enforcement association resolution
regarding domain registration data</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Ayden</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">If you supply the names and
contact details for organisations who
you think should be invited to
contribute in some form then I’m sure
that we can deal with it. <br>
However so far you haven’t.</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">As others have pointed out,
the ICANN processes are open to
everyone. The barrier to entry is
incredibly low. All you need to do is
turn up.</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Input is always welcome and
encouraged.</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Regards</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Michele</span></div>
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style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div>
<div
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style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black">--</span></div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black">Mr Michele
Neylon</span></div>
</div>
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<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black">Blacknight
Internet Solutions Ltd, Unit
12A,Barrowside Business Park,Sleaty</span></div>
</div>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Calibri;color:black">Road,Graiguecullen,Carlow,<wbr>Ireland
Company No.: 370845</span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-family:Calibri;color:black">From: </span> </b><span
style="font-family:Calibri;color:black"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@<wbr>icann.org</a>>
on behalf of Ayden Férdeline <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>><br>
<b>Reply-To: </b>Ayden Férdeline <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Saturday 4 March 2017 at
19:44<br>
<b>To: </b>Chuck Gomes <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:cgomes@verisign.com"
target="_blank">cgomes@verisign.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc: </b>"<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>"
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg]
international law enforcement
association resolution regarding
domain registration data</span></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">If
the invitation to this association will
be going out on ICANN letterhead and
facilitated by ICANN staff, I consider
it only fair that other invitations be
sent out in the same manner.<br>
<br>
Thank you,<br>
<br>
Ayden </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">--------
Original Message --------</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Subject:
RE: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] international
law enforcement association resolution
regarding domain registration data</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Local
Time: 4 March 2017 7:40 PM</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">UTC
Time: 4 March 2017 19:40</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">From:
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:cgomes@verisign.com"
target="_blank">cgomes@verisign.com</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">To:
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com"
target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com"
target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>>,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>>,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">I
suggest you invite them Ayden. If
you are bothered by the fact that
I asked staff to contact the
association I will cancel my
request of staff and encourage
others to do that.</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Chuck</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></span></div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">From:</span></b></span><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">
Ayden Férdeline [<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">mailto:icann@ferdeline.com</a>]
</span></span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>Sent:</b>
Saturday, March 04, 2017 2:15 PM</span><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>To:</b>
Gomes, Chuck <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:cgomes@verisign.com"
target="_blank">cgomes@verisign.com</a>></span><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>Cc:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com"
target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>;
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>;
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">
gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a></span><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>Subject:</b>
[EXTERNAL] RE: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg]
international law enforcement
association resolution regarding
domain registration data</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">If
we are going to send an invite
letter to this organisation
requesting their participation, I am
happy to provide a list of other
organisations whose voices are
missing from this WG so that ICANN
staff can invite them to participate
as well. Thanks.</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">-
Ayden </div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">--------
Original Message --------</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Subject:
RE: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg]
international law enforcement
association resolution regarding
domain registration data</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Local
Time: 4 March 2017 7:10 PM</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">UTC
Time: 4 March 2017 19:10</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">From:
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:cgomes@verisign.com"
target="_blank">cgomes@verisign.com</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">To:
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com"
target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com"
target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a>>,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>>,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Very
well said Greg.</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">It
seems to me that we should
reach out to them and invite
them to have a representative
or representatives join our
WG.</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Marika/Lisa
– Would one of you please
prepare an invitation letter
and identify who and where we
should send it.</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Chuck</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"> </span></span></div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">From:</span></b></span><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.<wbr>org</a>
[<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org"
target="_blank">mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-<wbr>bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Greg
Shatan</span></span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>Sent:</b>
Saturday, March 04, 2017 11:13
AM</span><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>To:</b>
Ayden Férdeline <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com"
target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>>;
Volker Greimann <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>></span><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>Cc:</b>
RDS PDP WG <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>></span><br>
<span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b>Subject:</b>
[EXTERNAL] Re:
[gnso-rds-pdp-wg]
international law enforcement
association resolution
regarding domain registration
data</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_gmailmsg">"They
can ask for anything they
like, it is not like it has
legal binding status. It is a
wish list, nothing more..."</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">This
is no different than any other
stakeholder (or group of
stakeholders). Even GAC members.
So their input should be
accepted on an equal footing
with any other input. There
seems to be a curious amount of
effort devoted to discounting
this input, much of it based on
identity (or opinions about that
identity) rather than substance.</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">On
top of giving due consideration
to their input, it may also be
appropriate to engage in
outreach and engagement with
this organization.
Participation in the
multistakeholder process would
be more useful in the long run
vs. issuing resolutions. Useful
for them, useful for all of us,
and useful for the process.</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">As
an INGO of LE professionals,
there may be no existing SO/AC
that would be an appropriate
"home" for the IOCP, which makes
it all the more important that
they understand they are welcome
to participate, as well as to
communicate in other ways (such
as resolutions).</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Greg</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">On
Fri, Mar 3, 2017 at 11:54 AM
Ayden Férdeline <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="mailto:icann@ferdeline.com" target="_blank">icann@ferdeline.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid
#cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm
0cm6
.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">+1
Volker</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">-
Ayden </div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">--------
Original Message
--------</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Subject:
Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg]
international law
enforcement association
resolution regarding
domain registration data</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Local
Time: 3 March 2017 9:21
AM</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">UTC
Time: 3 March 2017 09:21</div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">From:
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net"
target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">To:
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a></div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_gmailmsg">Good
thing that police are law
"enforcement" not
legislators. They can ask
for anything they like, it
is not like it has legal
binding status. It is a
wish list, nothing more...</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Am
02.03.2017 um 19:35
schrieb Greg Aaron:</div>
</div>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">The
International
Association of Chiefs
of Police (IACP) has
issued an official
resolution regarding
domain name
registration data. </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">The
resolution requests
that ICANN and related
parties provide
“continued access to
publicly available
databases concerning
the allocation of
Internet resources,
and in situations
where the maintenance
of these databases may
conflict with privacy
regulation, business
concerns, or
data-mining prevention
efforts, fully consult
with the International
law enforcement to
assist in the
resolution of these
potential conflicts
before removing or
restricting law
enforcement access to
this critical
information; and… that
IACP membership
coordinate the above
efforts to achieve the
goal of providing
consistent, equal, and
uniform access to the
above-referenced
resources for all of
the international law
enforcement
community.”</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Founded
in 1893, the IACP (<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer"
href="http://www.iacp.org"
target="_blank">www.iacp.org</a>)
is the professional
association for law
enforcement officers,
with members in 133
countries worldwide,
primarily
leadership-level
personnel in national,
state/provincial, and
local agencies. "The
Association's goals
are to advance the
science and art of
police services; to
develop and
disseminate improved
administrative,
technical and
operational practices
and promote their use
in police work; to
foster police
cooperation and the
exchange of
information and
experience among
police administrators
throughout the
world....and to
encourage adherence of
all police officers to
high professional
standards of
performance and
conduct."</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_m-8753655803420240241msoplaintext">The
text of the full
resolution is below
and contains the
rationales. It notes
that loss of access to
the currently
available data “would
severely cripple or
eliminate the ability
of law enforcement
agencies to conduct
investigation in a
timely manner.”</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_m-8753655803420240241msoplaintext"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_m-8753655803420240241msoplaintext">The
document is attached,
and also at: <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="noopener
noreferrer"
href="http://www.theiacp.org/Resolutions"
target="_blank">http://www.theiacp.org/<wbr>Resolutions</a> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">I
kindly request that
this be added to our
bank of reference
materials. (Thanks,
Lisa and Michelle.)</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Support
for Law Enforcement
Access to Publicly
Available and Accurate
Internet Address
Registration Data to
include privacy
protected registrant
information and
related Forensic
Resources to
facilitate
investigation of
Cybercrime and Cyber
Enabled Crime</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">Submitted
by: Communications and
Technology Committee</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">CTC.06.t16</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
this is an updated
version of an expired
2005 adopted
resolution then
submitted by the
Communications and
Technology Committee
as CT23.a05 and
adopted at the 112th
Annual Conference; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
the lawful
investigation of
Internet
communications is one
of the most valuable
tools available to law
enforcement in
identifying both the
perpetrators and
victims of crime; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
the Internet is global
in nature, and as
such, poses challenges
when conducting
multiagency
international
investigations,
including delays
imposed when obtaining
international legal
process; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
electronic or digital
evidence associated
with the Internet is
fleeting in nature,
and law enforcement
officials must obtain
timely access to this
information to fulfill
law enforcement
duties; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
criminals use the
anonymity and
international nature
of the Internet, and
the fleeting nature of
electronic or digital
evidence, to thwart
law enforcement
investigations; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
publicly available
databases containing
information involving
the allocation of
Internet resources and
who they are assigned
to, such as Internet
Protocol address space
and domain names, are
a critical tool used
by law enforcement,
and because these
databases are public
in nature, allow law
enforcement agencies
access to conduct
investigations in the
most timely manner
possible; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHERAS,
allocation of Internet
resources is expanding
rapidly due to
impending exhaustion
of Internet Protocol
Version 4 address
space and the
subsequent and
simultaneous
implementation of
Internet Protocol
Version 6 as well as
the implementation of
numerous new top level
domains by the
Internet Corporation
for the Assigned Names
and Numbers (ICANN),
accurate and easily
accessible registrant
information is now
even more important to
law enforcement than
in 2005 when the
original resolution
was adopted; and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
ICANN and its
International members
involved in the
creation of policy
consensus and
administration of this
information currently
are considering new
registrant data policy
which may seek to
restrict or eliminate
fluid public access
due to business,
privacy, or
data-mining concerns;
and</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">WHEREAS,
the elimination or
restriction of easy
fluid access to this
information would
severely cripple or
eliminate the ability
of law enforcement
agencies to conduct
investigation in a
timely manner; now
therefore be it</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">RESOLVED,
that the International
Association of Chiefs
of Police (IACP)
strongly urges the
related Internet
administration
communities, including
governments, regional
Internet registries,
the Internet
Corporation for
Assigned Names and
Numbers, Internet
Service Providers,
domain-name
registries,
domain-name
registrars, and
Internet service
providers to assist
law enforcement by
providing continued
access to publicly
available databases
concerning the
allocation of Internet
resources, and in
situations where the
maintenance of these
databases may conflict
with privacy
regulation, business
concerns, or
data-mining prevention
efforts, fully consult
with the International
law enforcement to
assist in the
resolution of these
potential conflicts
before removing or
restricting law
enforcement access to
this critical
information; and be it</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">FURTHER
RESOLVED, that the
IACP membership
coordinate the above
efforts to achieve the
goal of providing
consistent, equal, and
uniform access to the
above-referenced
resources for all of
the international law
enforcement community.</div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">******************************<wbr>****</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Greg
Aaron</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">Vice-President,
Product Management</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">iThreat
Cyber Group /
Cybertoolbelt.com</span></span></div>
<div
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"><span
class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt">mobile:
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<div
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<pre>______________________________<wbr>_________________</pre>
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<pre>-- </pre>
<pre>Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Mit freundlichen Grüßen,</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Volker A. Greimann</pre>
<pre>- Rechtsabteilung -</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Key-Systems GmbH</pre>
<pre>Im Oberen Werk 1</pre>
<pre>66386 St. Ingbert</pre>
<pre>Tel.: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:+49%206894%209396901" value="+4968949396901" target="_blank">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901</a></pre>
<pre>Fax.: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:+49%206894%209396851" value="+4968949396851" target="_blank">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851</a></pre>
<pre>Email: <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a></pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Web: <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.key-systems.net" target="_blank">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net" target="_blank">www.RRPproxy.net</a></pre>
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<pre> </pre>
<pre>Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin</pre>
<pre>Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken </pre>
<pre>Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP</pre>
<pre><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.keydrive.lu" target="_blank">www.keydrive.lu</a> </pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>------------------------------<wbr>--------------</pre>
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<pre>Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Best regards,</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Volker A. Greimann</pre>
<pre>- legal department -</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Key-Systems GmbH</pre>
<pre>Im Oberen Werk 1</pre>
<pre>66386 St. Ingbert</pre>
<pre>Tel.: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:+49%206894%209396901" value="+4968949396901" target="_blank">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901</a></pre>
<pre>Fax.: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:+49%206894%209396851" value="+4968949396851" target="_blank">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851</a></pre>
<pre>Email: <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a></pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Web: <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.key-systems.net" target="_blank">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net" target="_blank">www.RRPproxy.net</a></pre>
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<pre>CEO: Alexander Siffrin</pre>
<pre>Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken </pre>
<pre>V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP</pre>
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<pre> </pre>
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</blockquote>
<div>
<div class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal"> </div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">______________________________<wbr>_________________</div>
</div>
<div>
<div class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_MsoNormal">gnso-rds-pdp-wg
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<div><span class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#002e62">Greg
Shatan</span></b></span><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#002e62">
</span></b><span class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black">C: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:%28917%29%20816-6428" value="+19178166428" target="_blank">917-816-6428</a></span></span><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:black">
<span class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size">S: gsshatan</span>
<span class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size">Phone-to-Skype: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="tel:%28646%29%20845-9428" value="+16468459428" target="_blank">646-845-9428</a></span>
</span><a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com" target="_blank"><span class="m_4596522363738953646aolmail_size"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:#1155cc"></span></span></a><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com" target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.com</a></div>
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<div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">_________________________________
Note to self: Pillage BEFORE burning.</div>
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<pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
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</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann
- Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
Web: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.key-systems.net">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net">www.RRPproxy.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.domaindiscount24.com">www.domaindiscount24.com</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.BrandShelter.com">www.BrandShelter.com</a>
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
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Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.keydrive.lu">www.keydrive.lu</a>
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Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann
- legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
Web: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.key-systems.net">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net">www.RRPproxy.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.domaindiscount24.com">www.domaindiscount24.com</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.BrandShelter.com">www.BrandShelter.com</a>
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CEO: Alexander Siffrin
Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.keydrive.lu">www.keydrive.lu</a>
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