<div dir="ltr">&gt;&gt;<span style="font-size:12.8px"> &#39;what&#39; that information can or may be used for</span><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">Enforced how? WHOIS is not the only outlet for information collected by registrars. And even if WHOIS thin data was put behind a EULA, the rest of it can&#39;t be. You can&#39;t put a DNS query behind a EULA. We can&#39;t pretend there are restrictions on this data.</span></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 12:59 PM, Michael Peddemors <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a href="mailto:michael@linuxmagic.com" target="_blank">michael@linuxmagic.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">+1 and a good enough statement to propose a discussion consensus around.<br>
<br>
o Because it cannot be assured that in some jurisdictions, information contained in &#39;Thin Data&#39; may be considered &#39;personal information&#39;, and thus fall under various privacy regulations, it is a requirement by ICANN and registrars to get &#39;informed consent&#39; from the party or parties registering a domain name.<br>
<br>
But I don&#39;t think that is yet in the time-line of discussions.<br>
<br>
We can however work on forming a statement of &#39;what&#39; that information can or may be used for, to help form the basis of disclosure needed for that informed consent<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
On 17-05-31 09:49 AM, jonathan matkowsky wrote:<br>
</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class="">
I agree with Stephanie that the way to address the concerns are to make<br>
sure users have provided informed consent. The registration agreement<br>
should have a provision under applicable law.<br>
<br>
On Wed, 31 May 2017 at 19:40 Stephanie Perrin<br>
&lt;<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoront<wbr>o.ca</a><br></span><span class="">
&lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
    I think it is a very good summary.  One issue which we do not<br>
    discuss very often is the fact that end users who register a domain<br>
    name do not understand very well (if at all) what the implications<br>
    for their privacy are.  A requirement of most data protection law is<br>
    to provide transparency with respect to what happens to personal<br>
    data.  This job, in my view, has not been tackled by ICANN in the<br>
    required way.  So while I agree with the summary, it raises the<br>
    issue, for those of us who do not understand what an SOA record is,<br>
    what thin data is, how the DNS operates, etc. there is an obligation<br>
    on ICANN, through its contractual control of the registries and<br>
    registrars, to provide greater clarity about how personal data is<br>
    managed, and what the risks might be for the individual.  Simply<br>
    saying &quot;Let&#39;s remember we are talking about the public, open<br>
    Internet here. Nobody has to participate that doesn&#39;t want to, just<br>
    like if I don&#39;t want anyone to see my license plate number on the<br>
    road, I don&#39;t have to drive a car either. &quot;  is not adequate.<br>
    (Licence registries, by the way, have become private in most<br>
    jurisdictions because of the risk to registrants, so the chances of<br>
    being stalked by some nut with road rage have mercifully<br></span>
    decreased).____<br>
<br>
    __ Stephanie Perrin<br>
    __<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
    On 2017-05-31 11:07, Gomes, Chuck via gnso-rds-pdp-wg wrote:<br>
</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><span class="">
<br>
    I am open to disagreement, but it seems to me that Jonathan<br>
    provides a good summary and maybe even a fair conclusion of the<br>
    extensive discussion that has occurred on this thread since<br>
    Tuesday.  Rather than continuing the extensive back and forth,<br>
    which in my assessment is mostly repeating things that have<br>
    already been said several times, I request that anyone who<br>
    disagrees with Jonathan’s conclusions to identify what you<br></span>
    disagree with and provide your reasoning.____<br>
<br>
    __ __<br>
<br>
    Chuck____<br>
<br>
    __ __<br>
<br>
    *From:*<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces<wbr>@icann.org</a><br>
    &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounce<wbr>s@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
    [mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounce<wbr>s@icann.org</a>] *On Behalf Of *jonathan<br>
    matkowsky<br>
    *Sent:* Wednesday, May 31, 2017 10:52 AM<br>
    *To:* Dotzero &lt;<a href="mailto:dotzero@gmail.com" target="_blank">dotzero@gmail.com</a>&gt; &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:dotzero@gmail.com" target="_blank">dotzero@gmail.com</a>&gt;;<br>
    Volker Greimann &lt;<a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>&gt;<br>
    &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.<wbr>net</a>&gt;<br>
    *Cc:* RDS PDP WG &lt;<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
    &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.<wbr>org</a>&gt;<br>
    *Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Principle on<br>
    Proportionality for &quot;Thin Data&quot;access____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    I think the discussion here reflects confusion between what&#39;s<br>
    available in DNS based on the domain name alone, and Thin Whois<br>
    data. The fact of whether SOA records or A records may contain PII<br></span>
     is a totally separate issue than Thin Whois data elements.____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    Based on a domain name alone, one can use it to query DNS for<br>
    record elements that may contain PII or when combined with other<br>
    data, can be used to obtain PII. But all of this PII is in the<br>
    public domain voluntarily by their owners, and more importantly,<br>
    is outside the framework of discussion, which is limited to Whois<br></span>
    database--not DNS. They are simply not the same.____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    So the fact that you can get SOA records from the domain name<br>
    alone begs the question of whether the domain name needs to be<br>
    protected because when combined with other data elements, can be<br></span>
    used to obtain PII.____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    But the domain names are publicly available on the internet by<br>
    virtue of being in the zone files. So the fact you can obtain the<br>
    domain from thin Whois doesn&#39;t make it any more available than it<br></span>
    is from the zone files. It is outside the framework of discussion.____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    The thin Whois database is not what is making domain names<br>
    available--so the SOA records for the domain is not a good<br>
    example, even if someone put PII in that field--as that is an<br>
    issue of domain names being publicly available together with DNS.<br></span>
    Totally outside the framework of discussion.____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    The creation date of a domain, the NS records, when the domain was<br>
    last updated, and the registrar of record are simply not by any<br>
    stretch of the imagination arguably PII by virtue of Whois. This<br>
    is information that was voluntarily made public by virtue of using<br></span>
    the public Internet which relies on DNS. ____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    Privacy enthusiasts can use .Onion if they want to. But if they<br>
    want to use the open Internet, that means some basic data by<br>
    definition is publicly available in the DNS. If they want to<br>
    protect their privacy, then they need to use common sense and not<br></span>
    put information they dont want to be made public into the public. ____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    The creation date is as a matter of fact, used as one of several<br>
    indicators to show a domain engaged in malicious activity was<br>
    unlikely a victim of being compromised. It is a critical piece of<br></span>
    data but also not by any stretch of the wildest imagination PII. ____<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    The principle of proportionality doesn&#39;t apply to thin data unless<br>
    you want to argue it applies to the very fact a domain name record<br>
    was created in the public Internet. By creating the record, a user<br>
    has chosen to make that record&#39;s existence public--regardless of<br>
    whether they use privacy protection or not. If I register my name<br>
    and birthday as a domain name, it is PII, but PII that I chose to<br>
    be made publicly available by virtue of creating the domain and<br>
    putting it into the zone. Does that mean I am somehow entitled to<br>
    have all the RFCs re-written for me and for the public  Internet<br>
    to be made private? Of course not. So when people make things<br>
    public voluntarily by virtue of participating in society, the<br>
    principles of data protection apply differently. Let&#39;s remember we<br>
    are talking about the public, open Internet here. Nobody has to<br>
    participate that doesn&#39;t want to, just like if I don&#39;t want anyone<br>
    to see my license plate number on the road, I don&#39;t have to drive<br></span>
    a car either. ____<br>
<br>
    __ __<br>
<br>
    __ __<br>
<br>
    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
    On Wed, 31 May 2017 at 16:50 Dotzero &lt;<a href="mailto:dotzero@gmail.com" target="_blank">dotzero@gmail.com</a><br></span>
    &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:dotzero@gmail.com" target="_blank">dotzero@gmail.com</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:____<span class=""><br>
<br>
        Translation (per Google translate) of what Volker posted:<br>
<br>
        &quot;On the basis of the ECJ ruling, the factual feature&quot; personal<br>
        data &quot;of § 12 (1) and (2) TMG in conjunction with § 3 (1) BDSG<br>
        must be interpreted in accordance with the guidelines: a<br>
        dynamic IP address provided by a provider of online media<br>
        services In the case of access by a person to a website, which<br>
        is made generally accessible by the provider, constitutes a<br>
        (protected) personal date for the provider.<br>
<br>
        The IP address can only be stored as a personal date under the<br>
        prerequisites of § 15 (1) TMG. This provision is to be applied<br>
        in accordance with the provisions of Article 7 (f) of<br>
        Directive 95/46 EC, as interpreted by the Court of Justice, to<br>
        the effect that a provider of on-line media services may<br>
        collect personal data of a user without the consent of the<br>
        user of the services To the extent that their collection and<br>
        use is necessary to ensure the general functioning of the<br>
        services. However, there is a need to balance the interests<br></span>
        and the basic rights and freedoms of the users. &quot;____<br>
<br>
        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
        On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 9:47 AM, Volker Greimann<br></span>
        &lt;<a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a> &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.<wbr>net</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
        wrote:____<span class=""><br>
<br>
            Why, just this month the German Bundesgerichtshof<br>
            confirmed this in a review of a decision of the state<br></span>
            court Berlin ( Az. VI ZR 135/13):____<br>
<br>
            <a href="http://juris.bundesgerichtshof.de/cgi-bin/rechtsprechung/document.py?Gericht=bgh&amp;Art=pm&amp;Datum=2017&amp;Sort=3&amp;nr=78289&amp;pos=0&amp;anz=74____" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://juris.bundesgerichtshof<wbr>.de/cgi-bin/rechtsprechung/<wbr>document.py?Gericht=bgh&amp;Art=<wbr>pm&amp;Datum=2017&amp;Sort=3&amp;nr=78289&amp;<wbr>pos=0&amp;anz=74____</a><span class=""><br>
<br>
            It followed the decision of the European Court from<br></span>
            October last year:____<br>
<br>
            C-582/14, NJW 2016, 3579____<br>
<br>
            The German explanation:____<br>
<br>
            /&quot;Auf der Grundlage des EuGH-Urteils ist das<span class=""><br>
            Tatbestandsmerkmal &quot;personenbezogene Daten&quot; des § 12 Abs.<br>
            1 und 2 TMG in Verbindung mit § 3 Abs. 1 BDSG<br>
            richtlinienkonform auszulegen: Eine dynamische IP-Adresse,<br>
            die von einem Anbieter von Online-Mediendiensten beim<br>
            Zugriff einer Person auf eine Internetseite, die dieser<br>
            Anbieter allgemein zugänglich macht, gespeichert wird,<br>
            stellt für den Anbieter ein (geschütztes)<br></span>
            personenbezogenes Datum dar. /____<br>
<br>
            /Als personenbezogenes Datum darf die IP-Adresse nur unter<span class=""><br>
            den Voraussetzungen des § 15 Abs. 1 TMG gespeichert<br>
            werden. Diese Vorschrift ist richtlinienkonform<br>
            entsprechend Art. 7 Buchst. f der Richtlinie 95/46 EG – in<br>
            der Auslegung durch den EuGH – dahin anzuwenden, dass ein<br>
            Anbieter von Online-Mediendiensten personenbezogene Daten<br>
            eines Nutzers dieser Dienste ohne dessen Einwilligung auch<br>
            über das Ende eines Nutzungsvorgangs hinaus dann erheben<br>
            und verwenden darf, soweit ihre Erhebung und ihre<br>
            Verwendung erforderlich sind, um die generelle<br>
            Funktionsfähigkeit der Dienste zu gewährleisten. Dabei<br>
            bedarf es allerdings einer Abwägung mit dem Interesse und<br></span>
            den Grundrechten und -freiheiten der Nutzer.&quot;/____<br>
<br>
            Hope this helps.____<br>
<br>
            __ __<br>
<br>
            Am 31.05.2017 um 15:38 schrieb Paul Keating:____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                    See: recent Europrean court decisions on IP<br></span>
                    addresses as PII.____<br>
<br>
                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                Can you please provide the citations?  I a-m not aware<br></span>
                of any court decision issuingsuch a broad ruling. ____<br>
<br>
                __ __<br>
<br>
                Thanks,____<br>
<br>
                __ __<br>
<br>
                Paul<br>
<br>
                Sent from my iPad____<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
                On 31 May 2017, at 12:20, Volker Greimann<br>
                &lt;<a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a><br></span>
                &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank">vgreimann@key-systems.<wbr>net</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                    In some cases the ability to use data set A in<br>
                    combination with data set B to enable one to<br></span>
                    identify an individual turns data set A into PII. ____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                    See: recent Europrean court decisions on IP<br></span>
                    addresses as PII.____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                    I am with you in viewing thin data as rather<br>
                    unlikely to be defined as PII, but depending on<br>
                    how this data is used it is not inconceivable that<br>
                    it may be found to contain PII depending on the<br></span>
                    use. Unlikely, but not impossible.____<br>
<br>
                    Volker____<br>
<br>
                    __ __<br>
<br>
                    Am 30.05.2017 um 23:40 schrieb Paul Keating:____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                        Im sorry but i don&#39;t see the logic here (or<br></span>
                        the legal constraint)____<br>
<br>
                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                        Privacy laws protect personal data of<br>
                        INDIVIDUALS.  They do t protect non-personal<br></span>
                        data or data from non-individuals.____<br>
<br>
                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                        Nothing on the list below is personal data.<br>
                        And no e of the principles given by Natalie<br></span>
                        apply.____<br>
<br>
                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                        The fact that i could use the data to obtain<br>
                        other data is irrelevant.  I can use a car to<br>
                        rob a bank but that itself is not a reason to<br></span>
                        restrict access to automobiles.____<br>
<br>
                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                        Me thinks you are trying to create a scarcity<br>
                        for some reason.<br>
<br></span>
                        Sent from my iPad____<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
                        On 30 May 2017, at 23:22, Chris Pelling<br>
                        &lt;<a href="mailto:chris@netearth.net" target="_blank">chris@netearth.net</a><br></span>
                        &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:chris@netearth.net" target="_blank">chris@netearth.net</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:____<br>
<br>
                            ok - a thought :____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                            Thin data includes nameservers, being able<br></span>
                            to *_mass_* collect thin data gaining NS<span class=""><br>
                            information then allows you to do a DIG of<br>
                            a SOA record on the DNS service to gain<br></span>
                            the email address of the hostmaster : ____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                            Some examples (radomly picked from the<br></span>
                            list)  :____<br>
<br>
                            <a href="http://gmail.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">gmail.com</a> &lt;<a href="http://gmail.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://gmail.com</a>&gt; :____<br>
<br>
                            SOA     <a href="http://ns1.google.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">ns1.google.com</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://ns1.google.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ns1.google.com</a>&gt;.<br>
                            <a href="http://dns-admin.google.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">dns-admin.google.com</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://dns-admin.google.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://dns-admin.google.com</a>&gt;. 157458041<br>
                            900 900 1800 60<br>
                            <a href="http://netearthone.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">netearthone.com</a> &lt;<a href="http://netearthone.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://netearthone.com</a>&gt;____<br>
<br>
                            SOA     <a href="http://ns1.netearth.net" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">ns1.netearth.net</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://ns1.netearth.net" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ns1.netearth.net</a>&gt;.<br>
                            <a href="http://root.netearthone.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">root.netearthone.com</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://root.netearthone.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://root.netearthone.com</a>&gt;. <a href="tel:2016090201" value="+12016090201" target="_blank">2016090201</a><br>
                            &lt;tel:%28201%29%20609-0201&gt; 14400 3600<br>
                            1209600 86400____<br>
<br>
                            <a href="http://law.es" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">law.es</a> &lt;<a href="http://law.es" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://law.es</a>&gt;____<br>
<br>
                            SOA     <a href="http://ns1.eurodns.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">ns1.eurodns.com</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://ns1.eurodns.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ns1.eurodns.com</a>&gt;.<br>
                            <a href="http://hostmaster.eurodns.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">hostmaster.eurodns.com</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://hostmaster.eurodns.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://hostmaster.eurodns.com</a><wbr>&gt;.<br>
                            <a href="tel:2016061402" value="+12016061402" target="_blank">2016061402</a> &lt;tel:%28201%29%20606-1402&gt;<br>
                            43200 7200 1209600 86400____<br>
<br>
                            <a href="http://riskiq.net" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">riskiq.net</a> &lt;<a href="http://riskiq.net" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://riskiq.net</a>&gt;____<br>
<br>
                            SOA     <a href="http://ns-1754.awsdns-27.co.uk" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">ns-1754.awsdns-27.co.uk</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://ns-1754.awsdns-27.co.uk" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://ns-1754.awsdns-27.co.u<wbr>k</a>&gt;.<br>
                            <a href="http://awsdns-hostmaster.amazon.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">awsdns-hostmaster.amazon.com</a><br>
                            &lt;<a href="http://awsdns-hostmaster.amazon.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://awsdns-hostmaster.amaz<wbr>on.com</a>&gt;. 1<br>
                            7200 900 1209600 86400____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                            Now as you can see - those above examples<br>
                            allow you to get (or build) an email<br>
                            list.  Most will normally point to the<br>
                            providers service, but, some that are<br></span>
                            DIY&#39;ing their hosting, it might not be.____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<br>
<br>
                            Kind regards,<br>
<br>
                            Chris____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<br>
<br>
                            ------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------<br>
<br>
                            *From: *&quot;allison nixon&quot; &lt;<a href="mailto:elsakoo@gmail.com" target="_blank">elsakoo@gmail.com</a><br>
                            &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:elsakoo@gmail.com" target="_blank">elsakoo@gmail.com</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
                            *To: *&quot;nathalie coupet&quot;<br>
                            &lt;<a href="mailto:nathaliecoupet@yahoo.com" target="_blank">nathaliecoupet@yahoo.com</a><br>
                            &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:nathaliecoupet@yahoo.com" target="_blank">nathaliecoupet@yahoo.c<wbr>om</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
                            *Cc: *&quot;gnso-rds-pdp-wg&quot;<br>
                            &lt;<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
                            &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.<wbr>org</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
                            *Sent: *Tuesday, 30 May, 2017 21:52:32<br>
                            *Subject: *Re: [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] Principle<br>
                            on Proportionality for<br>
                            &quot;Thin        Data&quot;access____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                            so can you name one specific example of<br></span>
                            how someone could abuse thin data?____<br>
<br>
                            __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                            On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 4:50 PM, nathalie<br>
                            coupet via gnso-rds-pdp-wg<br>
                            &lt;<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br></span>
                            &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.<wbr>org</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:____<br>
<br>
                                *Abuse* is the improper usage or<br>
                                treatment of an entity<br>
                                &lt;<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entity" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki<wbr>/Entity</a>&gt;, often<br>
                                to unfairly<br>
                                &lt;<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Distributive_justice" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki<wbr>/Distributive_justice</a>&gt; or<span class=""><br>
                                improperly gain benefit. In our<br>
                                context, abuse is the improper usage<br>
                                of WHOIS/RDS to unfairly or improperly<br>
                                gain access to information or to game<br></span>
                                the system. ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                Here are some of the overarching<br>
                                principles which should guide us when<br></span>
                                building RDS: ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<br>
<br>
                                DATA LIFECYCLE<br>
                                 PRIVACY PRINCIPLE<br>
                                                  PROTECTION MEASURE____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                Collection<br>
                                Proportionality and purpose<br>
                                specification                     Data<br></span>
                                minimisation, Data quality____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                Storage<br>
                                Accountability, Security measures,<br>
                                Sensitive data<br>
                                Confidentiality, Encryption,<br></span>
                                Pseudonomisation____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                Sharing and processing Lawfulness and<br>
                                fairness, Consent, Right of access<br>
                                 Data access control, Data leakage<br></span>
                                prevention____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                Deletion<br>
                                Openness, Right to erasure<br>
                                                           Retention,<br></span>
                                Archival, Erasure____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<br>
<br>
                                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                If such principles are not respected,<br>
                                ICANN will be liable. Consumers don&#39;t<br>
                                need to have all the thin data when<br>
                                making a query. This could protect<br>
                                them and enable them to have access to<br>
                                the RDS without raising much<br></span>
                                opposition.  ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                Now, we could discuss the possibility<br>
                                for broader query types. These<br>
                                principles would still apply, but<br>
                                would be contextualized in order to<br>
                                take into account new sets of<br>
                                parameters for each broader query. By<br>
                                increasing granularity as much as<br>
                                possible, while applying these<br>
                                aformentioned principles, we just<br>
                                might find a way to accomodate<br></span>
                                everyone.  ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<br>
<br>
                                __ __<br>
<br>
                                 ____<br>
<br>
                                Nathalie ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                On Tuesday, May 30, 2017 4:00 PM, John<br>
                                Horton &lt;<a href="mailto:john.horton@legitscript.com" target="_blank">john.horton@legitscript.com</a><br></span>
                                &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:john.horton@legitscript.com" target="_blank">john.horton@legitscrip<wbr>t.com</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
                                wrote:____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                I was going to reply to Natalie&#39;s<br>
                                email as well, but Paul&#39;s comments<br></span>
                                capture my thoughts, so: *+1. *____<br>
<br>
<br>
                                ____<br>
<br>
                                John Horton<br>
                                President and CEO, LegitScript____<br>
<br>
                                ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<br>
<br>
                                *Follow****Legit**Script*: LinkedIn<br>
                                &lt;<a href="http://www.linkedin.com/company/legitscript-com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.linkedin.com/compa<wbr>ny/legitscript-com</a>&gt;<br>
                                |  Facebook<br>
                                &lt;<a href="https://www.facebook.com/LegitScript" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://www.facebook.com/Legi<wbr>tScript</a>&gt;  |<br>
                                 Twitter<br>
                                &lt;<a href="https://twitter.com/legitscript" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://twitter.com/legitscri<wbr>pt</a>&gt;  |<br>
                                 _Blog<br>
                                &lt;<a href="http://blog.legitscript.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://blog.legitscript.com/</a>&gt;<wbr>_ | Google+<br>
                                &lt;<a href="https://plus.google.com/112436813474708014933/posts" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://plus.google.com/11243<wbr>6813474708014933/posts</a>&gt;____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<br>
<br>
                                ____<br>
<br>
                                __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 12:57 PM, Paul<br>
                                Keating &lt;<a href="mailto:paul@law.es" target="_blank">paul@law.es</a><br></span>
                                &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:paul@law.es" target="_blank">paul@law.es</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:____<br>
<br>
                                    Natalie,____<br>
<br>
                                    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                    Thank you for the email.  Im<br>
                                    copying the list because i see<br>
                                    others have replied to your<br></span>
                                    comment.____<br>
<br>
                                    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                    I strenuously object to the<br>
                                    concept.  We are discussing THIN<br>
                                    DATA ONLY HERE.  Unless someone<br>
                                    can explain to me why any of this<br>
                                    data set has privacy concerns this<br>
                                    is a non-issue.  I would certainly<br>
                                    appreciate someone explaining<br>
                                    what, if any, privacy issues are<br></span>
                                    perceived to be at issue here.____<br>
<br>
                                    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                    Moreover, while you suggest that<br>
                                    the idea escapes the need to<br>
                                    declare a purpose, it does nothing<br>
                                    but reinforce a subjective<br>
                                    criteria based system in which the<br>
                                    declared purpose is used to<br>
                                    somehow limit the data being<br></span>
                                    retrieved.____<br>
<br>
                                    __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                    If i am missing something please<br></span>
                                    let me know. ____<br>
<br>
<br>
                                    Paul____<br>
<br>
<br>
                                    Sent from my iPad____<span class=""><br>
<br>
<br>
                                    On 30 May 2017, at 21:08, nathalie<br>
                                    coupet via gnso-rds-pdp-wg<br>
                                    &lt;<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br></span>
                                    &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.<wbr>org</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:____<br>
<br>
                                        Hi Paul,____<br>
<br>
                                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                        In the context of thin data,<br>
                                        in view of the opposition of<br>
                                        some to allow unauthenticated<br>
                                        access to all the thin data,<br>
                                        the principle of<br>
                                        proportionality serves as an<br>
                                        over-arching principle at this<br>
                                        particular phase in our work<br>
                                        in order to protect data from<br>
                                        abuse while not restricting<br></span>
                                        access.   ____<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                        Thin data must be<br>
                                        proportionate to the query, be<br>
                                        useful for that particular<br>
                                        query. All and any other thin<br>
                                        data foreign to this query<br>
                                        should not be shared. This<br>
                                        principle potentially avoids<br>
                                        having to resort to<br>
                                        &#39;legitimate purposes&#39; which<br>
                                        cannot be verified for<br></span>
                                        unauthenticated access.   ____<br>
<br>
                                         ____<br>
<br>
                                         ____<br>
<br>
                                        Nathalie ____<br>
<br>
                                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                        On Tuesday, May 30, 2017 2:44<br>
                                        PM, &quot;Gomes, Chuck via<br>
                                        gnso-rds-pdp-wg&quot;<br>
                                        &lt;<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br></span>
                                        &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.<wbr>org</a>&gt;&gt;<br>
                                        wrote:____<br>
<br>
                                        __ __<span class=""><br>
<br>
                                        Because Nathalie was the<br>
                                        originator and was unable to<br>
                                        speak on the call, I encourage<br>
                                        her to describe the nature of<br></span>
                                        the issue on this thread.____<br>
<br>
                                         ____<br>
<br>
                                        Chuck____<br>
<br>
                                         ____<br>
<br>
                                        *From:*gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces<wbr>@icann.<br>
                                        &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounce<wbr>s@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
<br>
</blockquote><span class="">
--<br>
jonathan matkowsky, vp - ip &amp; head of global brand threat mitigation<br>
<br>
<br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
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<br>
</span></blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
&quot;Catch the Magic of Linux...&quot;<br>
------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------<br>
Michael Peddemors, President/CEO LinuxMagic Inc.<br>
Visit us at <a href="http://www.linuxmagic.com" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.linuxmagic.com</a> @linuxmagic<br>
------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------<br>
A Wizard IT Company - For More Info <a href="http://www.wizard.ca" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.wizard.ca</a><br>
&quot;LinuxMagic&quot; a Registered TradeMark of Wizard Tower TechnoServices Ltd.<br>
------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>------------<br>
<a href="tel:604-682-0300" value="+16046820300" target="_blank">604-682-0300</a> Beautiful British Columbia, Canada<br>
<br>
This email and any electronic data contained are confidential and intended<br>
solely for the use of the individual or entity to which they are addressed.<br>
Please note that any views or opinions presented in this email are solely<br>
those of the author and are not intended to represent those of the company.<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list<br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">_________________________________<br>Note to self: Pillage BEFORE burning.</div>
</div>