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    <p>Which goes back to why registrars need to offer a free "checkbox"
      option for their information to be redacted.  Done and done.<br>
    </p>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/1/2017 4:15 PM, allison nixon
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CACLR7wKEKuKOvGKjUrq5zBkzCEunnLJtN+HhFEYfmJH3e8fq0w@mail.gmail.com">
      <div dir="ltr">May as well add this part to it as well:
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>&gt;&gt;All those nice uses that whois data is currently
          put to that have nothing to do with the service that is
          provided to the data subject? Say goodbye to them now!</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>This gloating tone is not only unhelpful, but it's likely
          not even legally required. Relating to the subject of social
          media, there is no way that Facebook public profiles will be
          considered less sensitive than WHOIS data. The FindFace app
          can already demonstrate that a picture of a face can be used
          to identify an individual even if their name is not known. And
          I don't forsee Facebook shutting down over this. And if the
          laws do require a complete shutdown of all social media, then
          the laws are going to change.</div>
      </div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 1, 2017 at 5:06 PM, Gomes,
          Chuck via gnso-rds-pdp-wg <span dir="ltr">&lt;<a
              href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank"
              moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>&gt;</span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
            <div bgcolor="white" link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US">
              <div class="m_7791157209609218819WordSection1">
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:windowtext">I
                    apologize for using Volker’s message as an example
                    but I think it might serve as a useful lesson for
                    everyone. The clause I highlighted in yellow below
                    is derogatory and adds no value to the points made. 
                    I ask Volker and everyone to avoid derogatory
                    remarks and stick to the points that will
                    constructively contribute to the discussion.</span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:windowtext"> </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:windowtext">Chuck</span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><a
                    name="m_7791157209609218819__MailEndCompose"
                    moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:windowtext"> </span></a></p>
                <span></span>
                <div>
                  <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1
                    1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:windowtext">
                        <a
                          href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.<wbr>org</a>
                        [mailto:<a
                          href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg-bounces@icann.org"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-rds-pdp-wg-<wbr>bounces@icann.org</a>]
                        <b>On Behalf Of </b>Volker Greimann<br>
                        <b>Sent:</b> Thursday, June 01, 2017 12:09 PM<br>
                        <b>To:</b> <a
                          href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
                        <b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] [gnso-rds-pdp-wg] The
                        principle of consent</span></p>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <div class="h5">
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p><span style="background:yellow">As it has been
                        brought up by Dotzero in a very reckless manner,</span>
                      I feel it is important to point out what "consent"
                      actually means in the context of the GDPR:</p>
                    <p>First, implied consent is no longer sufficient
                      under the current regulation. The GDPR requires
                      that the data subject signals agreement to the
                      specific and defined use of its data by "a
                      statement or a clear affirmative action".</p>
                    <p>In other words, an explicit and seperate opt-in
                      is required, where the action of providing consent
                      is clearly distinguishable from any other matters
                      in a written document. This may be ticking a
                      seperate box on a website or choosing specific
                      technical settings, but in all cases it must be
                      based on an explanation of what it is that the
                      data subject is agreeing to. Silence, pre-ticked
                      boxes or inactivity is insufficient. Hiding the
                      consent clauses in the registration agreement is
                      insufficient.</p>
                    <p>This consent must be "freely given, specific,
                      informed and unambiguous."</p>
                    <p>Fun stuff comes in the next bit:</p>
                    <p><span class="m_7791157209609218819md">The
                        controller is required to provide “accurate and
                        full information on all relevant issues,”
                        including the nature of the data that will be
                        processed, the purposes of processing, the
                        identity of the controller, and<b> the identity
                          of any other recipients of the data</b>.</span></p>
                    <p><span class="m_7791157209609218819md">I will
                        highlight the salient part again: "ANY OTHER
                        RECIPIENTS OF THE DATA." So no expansion of
                        those with access at a later data, because that
                        would immediately invalidate the consent given.</span></p>
                    <p><span class="m_7791157209609218819md">Finally,
                        this:</span></p>
                    <p><span class="m_7791157209609218819md">"Importantly,
                        a controller may not make a service conditional
                        upon consent, unless the processing is necessary
                        for the service."
                      </span><br>
                      <span class="m_7791157209609218819md">So no
                        consent can be construed for any uses beyond the
                        functioning of the service, the internet and any
                        other use tied directly to the service. All
                        those nice uses that whois data is currently put
                        to that have nothing to do with the service that
                        is provided to the data subject? Say goodbye to
                        them now!</span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Further
                      reading for those so inclined:<br>
                      <a
href="https://iapp.org/news/a/top-10-operational-impacts-of-the-gdpr-part-3-consent/"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://iapp.org/news/a/top-<wbr>10-operational-impacts-of-the-<wbr>gdpr-part-3-consent/</a><br>
                      <br>
                      <span class="m_7791157209609218819md">Also note
                        that the consent provided by current registrant
                        does not satisfy the requirements, so what
                        happens with legacy data with regard to its
                        import into any RDS system will be a whole new
                        nightmare down the road.</span></p>
                    <div>
                      <p class="MsoNormal">Am 01.06.2017 um 17:41
                        schrieb Michael Peddemors:</p>
                    </div>
                    <blockquote
                      style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                      <p class="MsoNormal">+1 <br>
                        <br>
                        On 17-06-01 07:47 AM, Dotzero wrote: <br>
                        <br>
                      </p>
                      <blockquote
                        style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                        <p class="MsoNormal">The issue you raise is
                          addressed simply enough by requiring a privacy
                          <br>
                          disclosure be displayed at the time of domain
                          registration. This <br>
                          requirement can be incorporated into the ICANN
                          registry agreements. Note <br>
                          that this does not resolve the issue for CC
                          domains. <br>
                          <br>
                          Michael Hammer <br>
                          <br>
                          On Thu, Jun 1, 2017 at 10:43 AM, Stephanie
                          Perrin <br>
                          &lt;<a
                            href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
                            target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca</a>
                          <br>
                          <a
                            href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
                            target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">&lt;mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca&gt;</a>&gt;
                          wrote:
                          <br>
                          <br>
                              I certainly agree that if people enter
                          personal information as part <br>
                              of their DNS registration or their motor
                          vehicle licence <br>
                              registration, it is done with implied
                          consent... as long as there is <br>
                              sufficient information to permit them to
                          understand just how the <br>
                              data is being used and where it is going. 
                          However, as I tried to <br>
                              say with respect to registering a domain
                          name, I really don't think <br>
                              the average non-expert citizen who might
                          want to register a domain <br>
                              name would get enough information to truly
                          understand how far <br>
                              his/her information goes, and how
                          difficult it is to get it removed <br>
                              once it has appeared in the public
                          record.  We should build this <br>
                              system so that everyone understands it,
                          not just the experts. <br>
                          <br>
                              cheers Stephanie <br>
                          <br>
                          <br>
                              On 2017-06-01 05:18, jonathan matkowsky
                          wrote: <br>
                          <br>
                        </p>
                        <blockquote
                          style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                          <p class="MsoNormal">    Stephanie, <br>
                            <br>
                                ​I agree with you that we should not
                            conflate collection <br>
                                limitation principles with openness
                            principles. <br>
                            <br>
                                I respectfully disagree with most of
                            what you wrote in the first <br>
                                paragraph of your post script. <br>
                                Here we are talking about users
                            potentially entering personal or <br>
                                pseudonymous information when they are
                            not being asked for it (nor <br>
                                is it required) to begin with, and it is
                            not required for purposes <br>
                                of which it's being collected.​ That is
                            the <br>
                            <br>
                                ​scope <br>
                                 of what needs to be assessed <br>
                                ​if at all and how the scope needs to be
                            <br>
                                 defined from the beginning <br>
                                ​ if you were to conduct a PIA​ <br>
                                . <br>
                                ​ ​ <br>
                            <br>
                                ​ <br>
                                 ​ <br>
                                Personal information is not being used
                            or intended to be used just <br>
                                because a person decides to enter
                            personal information into a field. <br>
                                ​ <br>
                                The example of how you can combine
                            databases to re-identify a <br>
                                person based on the SOA record is the
                            equivalent of protecting <br>
                                domain names as personal information
                            because a person <br>
                                can register their driver's license <br>
                                ​ or name and date of birth​ <br>
                                as a domain name. <br>
                                ​ <br>
                                I would argue no PIA should be required
                            <br>
                                ​as a result ​ <br>
                                even in accordance even with best
                            practices. <br>
                                ​ <br>
                                A PIA needs to be conducted in a manner
                            that is commensurate with <br>
                                the level of privacy risk identified <br>
                                ​. <br>
                            <br>
                                I respectfully disagree with ​you that
                            thin data is personal. We <br>
                                are talking about identifiers (codes or
                            strings that represent an <br>
                                individual or device).  Many labels can
                            be used to point to <br>
                                individuals. Some are precise and most,
                            imprecise or vague. <br>
                                There's no question that an IP address
                            is a device identifier. <br>
                                Device IDs, MAC addresses can be a
                            source for user tracking.  But <br>
                                ​i <br>
                                ​dentifiers can be strong or weak
                            depending on how precise they <br>
                                are as well as the context. It cannot be
                            measured without taking <br>
                                linkability into consideration.  For
                            that reason, name servers are <br>
                                not the same as IP addresses or MAC
                            addresses any more so than the <br>
                                existence of a domain name is an
                            identifier. If a person chooses <br>
                                to use identifiable information when it
                            is not being asked for or <br>
                                required for purposes of which the data
                            is being collected, that <br>
                                does that mean we need to classify all
                            the data according to that <br>
                                unlikely scenario. Those setting up
                            their own DNS would be <br>
                                relatively speaking, sophisticated
                            Internet users that presumably <br>
                                know the basics of how DNS operates in
                            any case, so by entering <br>
                                the information in that way, they are
                            choosing to customize their <br>
                                DNS in a personal way similar to a
                            person that chooses to show <br>
                                personal information on their license
                            plate number. <br>
                            <br>
                                ​I know that the motor vehicle registry
                            is restricted now in most <br>
                                places so that you would need a subpoena
                            to get that kind of <br>
                                personal information. This is also true
                            of an IP address though <br>
                                and IP providers. The fact is a person
                            can put their name and date <br>
                                of birth on a license plate if they want
                            to customize it. And then <br>
                                they get on the road. That does not mean
                            the license plate numbers <br>
                                are all personal information. It's
                            pseudonymous data. It is true <br>
                                that it is a stronger identifier than an
                            IP address insofar as if <br>
                                you subpoena the motor vehicle registry
                            operator, you will get the <br>
                                personal information behind that license
                            plate number. If you <br>
                                subpoena the ISP, you MIGHT get the
                            personal information depending <br>
                                on the nature of the IP address. It's
                            still true that to drive a <br>
                                car, you need to show your license plate
                            number on the vehicle. <br>
                            <br>
                                I would argue that thin Whois data is
                            pseudonymous or personal <br>
                                data to the same extent that a person
                            can choose to _customize_ a <br>
                                license plate if they want to, and put
                            personal or psuedonymous <br>
                                data into fields <br>
                                for which the data being collected does
                            not ask for or require <br>
                                them to do so. <br>
                                ​ <br>
                            <br>
                                A <br>
                                 person can register their driver's
                            license as a domain name. <br>
                                They can use a personal email in their
                            SOA record, or personal NS. <br>
                                Just because it's theoretically possible
                            for someone to enter <br>
                                pseudonymous (or even personal) data
                            into multiple databases when <br>
                                they are not being asked for it, and
                            those combination of choices <br>
                                make it possible to identify them, does
                            not mean one of the sets <br>
                                (Thin Whois) should be classified as
                            personal information subject <br>
                                to a PIA. <br>
                            <br>
                                ​ <br>
                            <br>
                                Jonathan Matkowsky, <br>
                                VP – IP &amp; Brand Security <br>
                                USA:: <a
                              href="tel:%28347%29%20467-1193"
                              value="+13474671193" target="_blank"
                              moz-do-not-send="true">1.347.467.1193</a>
                            <a href="tel:%28347%29%20467-1193"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">&lt;tel:%28347%29%20467-1193&gt;</a>
                            | Office::
                            <br>
                                <a href="tel:+972%208-926-2766"
                              value="+97289262766" target="_blank"
                              moz-do-not-send="true">+972-(0)8-926-2766</a>
                            <a href="tel:+972%208-926-2766"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">&lt;tel:+972%208-926-2766&gt;</a>
                            <br>
                                Emergency mobile:: <a
                              href="tel:+972%2054-924-0831"
                              value="+972549240831" target="_blank"
                              moz-do-not-send="true">+972-(0)54-924-0831</a>
                            <a href="tel:+972%2054-924-0831"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">&lt;tel:+972%2054-924-0831&gt;</a>
                            <br>
                                Company Reg. No. 514805332 <br>
                                11/1 Nachal Chever, Modiin Israel <br>
                                Website <a
                              href="http://www.riskiq.co.il"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">&lt;http://www.riskiq.co.il&gt;</a>
                            <br>
                                RiskIQ Technologies Ltd. (wholly-owned
                            by RiskIQ, Inc.) <br>
                            <br>
                                On Thu, Jun 1, 2017 at 12:02 AM,
                            Stephanie Perrin <br>
                                &lt;<a
                              href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca</a>
                            <br>
                                <a
                              href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">&lt;mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.<wbr>utoronto.ca&gt;</a>&gt;
                            wrote:
                            <br>
                            <br>
                                    Your summary today was great Andrew.
                            <br>
                            <br>
                                    I am not arguing about the
                            disclosure of thin data.  We <br>
                                    already voted on unauthenticated
                            mandatory disclosure, weeks <br>
                                    ago (or at least it feels like weeks
                            ago).  Lets please move <br>
                                    on.  We are debating this yet again,
                            because people keep <br>
                                    asking, is thin data personal? 
                            [lots of people missed the <br>
                                    last call]  The answer is yes
                            (IMHO).  Does that mean it <br>
                                    cannot be disclosed?  The answer is
                            no.  Does the <br>
                                    proportionality principle apply? 
                            Yes.  Have we already gone <br>
                                    through this?  Yes.  Can we come
                            back to it?  Yes, but <br>
                                    hopefully only if we have to.....we
                            will have to when we get <br>
                                    to data elements. <br>
                            <br>
                                    cheers Stephanie <br>
                                    PS a fundamental problem here is
                            that people try to categorize <br>
                                    information that in their view
                            should be disclosed, as not <br>
                                    personal information.  This fight
                            has gone on for years over <br>
                                    IP address, for instance.  The
                            important question is not <br>
                                    actually whether it is personal data
                            or not, it is "do you <br>
                                    need to disclose it to make things
                            work?"....and if the answer <br>
                                    is yes then you try to mitigate the
                            disclosure and try to keep <br>
                                    it minimized to what is absolutely
                            required.  Hence the PIA, <br>
                                    which should employ both data
                            minimization and the test in the <br>
                                    proportionality principle as
                            techniques to evaluate data elements. <br>
                                    A good and really simple example is
                            a phone number.  IS it <br>
                                    personal info?  (the telcos fought
                            for years, trying to claim <br>
                                    they owned it and it was not
                            personal).  Obviously it pertains <br>
                                    to you, people feel strongly that it
                            is personal (culturally <br>
                                    relative of course but...) and yet
                            if noone ever learns your <br>
                                    number your phone won't ever receive
                            a call.  That does not <br>
                                    mean you have to disclose it
                            everywhere.....only where <br>
                                    necessary.  And it should mean that
                            it does not have to follow <br>
                                    you everywhere, but that is becoming
                            increasingly hard to <br>
                                    manage.... <br>
                            <br>
                                    By the way, informed consent is not
                            the same as transparency <br>
                                    requirements.  Transparency
                            requirements are exactly <br>
                                    that....you have to be transparent
                            about what you are doing <br>
                                    with data.  Let us not conflate that
                            with consent. <br>
                            <br>
                                    I will quit now and stop trying to
                            answer questions.  I would <br>
                                    like to humbly suggest, however,
                            that we have a real shortage <br>
                                    of basic understanding of how data
                            protection law works and is <br>
                                    interpreted.  If there is a data
                            protection law expert that <br>
                                    folks might listen to, we should
                            hire that person to advise <br>
                                    us.  It might save a lot of time. <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                                    On 2017-05-31 16:00, Andrew Sullivan
                            wrote: <br>
                            <br>
                          </p>
                          <blockquote
                            style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                            <p class="MsoNormal">        Hi, <br>
                              <br>
                                      On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 03:20:59PM
                              -0400, Stephanie Perrin wrote: <br>
                              <br>
                            </p>
                            <blockquote
                              style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                              <p class="MsoNormal">        That does not
                                mean we need to protect it, it means we
                                have to examine it in
                                <br>
                                        terms of DP law.  May I repeat
                                the suggestion that Canatacci made in <br>
                                        Copenhagen in response to a
                                question.....(I forget the precise
                                question he
                                <br>
                                        was asked, sorry). If you want
                                to figure out whether you have to
                                protect <br>
                                        something or not, do a privacy
                                impact assessment. </p>
                            </blockquote>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"
                              style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">        As I
                              think I've said more than once in this
                              thread, I think we _have_
                              <br>
                                      done that assessment and I think
                              the answers are obvious and I think <br>
                                      therefore that there is nothing
                              more to say about this principle in <br>
                                      respect of thin data: <br>
                              <br>
                                          - the data is either necessary
                              for the operation of the system <br>
                                            itself or else necessary for
                              distributed operation and <br>
                                            troubleshooting on the
                              Internet. <br>
                              <br>
                                          - the data does not expose
                              identifying information about anyone, <br>
                                            except in rather strained
                              examples where the identifying <br>
                                            information is already
                              completely available via other means. <br>
                              <br>
                                      What more is one supposed to do? <br>
                              <br>
                                      Best regards, <br>
                              <br>
                                      A </p>
                          </blockquote>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"
                            style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
                            <br>
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                        </blockquote>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                          style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
                          <br>
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                        <br>
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                    </blockquote>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><br>
                      <br>
                    </p>
                    <pre>-- </pre>
                    <pre>Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Mit freundlichen Grüßen,</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Volker A. Greimann</pre>
                    <pre>- Rechtsabteilung -</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Key-Systems GmbH</pre>
                    <pre>Im Oberen Werk 1</pre>
                    <pre>66386 St. Ingbert</pre>
                    <pre>Tel.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396901" value="+4968949396901" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901</a></pre>
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                    <pre>Email: <a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a></pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
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                    <pre>Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin</pre>
                    <pre>Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken </pre>
                    <pre>Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP</pre>
                    <pre><a href="http://www.keydrive.lu" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.keydrive.lu</a> </pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>------------------------------<wbr>--------------</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Best regards,</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Volker A. Greimann</pre>
                    <pre>- legal department -</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Key-Systems GmbH</pre>
                    <pre>Im Oberen Werk 1</pre>
                    <pre>66386 St. Ingbert</pre>
                    <pre>Tel.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396901" value="+4968949396901" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901</a></pre>
                    <pre>Fax.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396851" value="+4968949396851" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851</a></pre>
                    <pre>Email: <a href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a></pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
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                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>CEO: Alexander Siffrin</pre>
                    <pre>Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken </pre>
                    <pre>V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534</pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
                    <pre>Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP</pre>
                    <pre><a href="http://www.keydrive.lu" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.keydrive.lu</a> </pre>
                    <pre> </pre>
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                    <pre> </pre>
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                    <pre> </pre>
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        <div><br>
        </div>
        -- <br>
        <div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">_________________________________<br>
          Note to self: Pillage BEFORE burning.</div>
      </div>
      <br>
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      <br>
      <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________
gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list
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    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">-- 
--

John Bambenek</pre>
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