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<p>Hi Greg,</p>
<p>I did not see this memo referenced in the GAC communique and my
comment was entirely in response to that. As I had read the
communique in its entirety when it was published, I had some time
to digest it already and noted that it did not contain anything
substantially new and was easily implementable by any new RDS with
tiered access. <br>
</p>
<p>I also noted that the communique mainly refers to quick and
lawful access, but not necessarily open or easy access although
that point can certainly be argued. <br>
</p>
<p>I did not see any reference to the memo you reference, to the
contrary the GAC refers specifically to the outside counsel
already tasked by ICANN, e.g. Hamilton.</p>
<p>Best,</p>
<p>Volker<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 03.11.2017 um 16:29 schrieb Greg
Shatan:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CA+aOHUQr1wfLUTbO-v8FQHgv1btTX7ypZQL_drzd6M+bbTX4hA@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Volker,</div>
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Vicky's statement about
"another perspective" refers to the Taylor Wessing memo.
Unless you saw the 21 page memo previously, I doubt that you
read it fully in 8 minutes enabling you to dismiss it as
"another perspective." I would hope that you give other
perspectives a little more time and consideration than that. </div>
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Of course, you may have
thought she was referring to the GAC Communique (so many
commas...) -- even then, the apparent ability to fit new
inputs to a pre-existing point of view with such rapidity is
either impressive or concerning.</div>
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default"
style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">Greg</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Nov 3, 2017 at 10:19 AM, Volker
Greimann <span dir="ltr"><<a
href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p>Hi Victoria,</p>
<p>I would not necessarily see these as uses as the board
calls them as purposes but indeed as use cases of
current whois.</p>
<p>It also appears that these use cases can also be served
by alternative RDS systems (such as a tiered access
system) without rejecting the GAC advice. <br>
</p>
<p>So while this makes interesting reading and gives some
guidelines for our work, I do not see this ultimately as
"another perspective". It just restates our mission.</p>
<p>Best,</p>
<p>Volker<br>
</p>
<div>
<div class="h5"> <br>
<div class="m_2015730192005420593moz-cite-prefix">Am
03.11.2017 um 15:11 schrieb Victoria Sheckler:<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div class="h5">
<div class="m_2015730192005420593WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">ICYMI, please see the
attached GAC communique, which includes GAC
advice on GDPR/WHOIS ( the relevant GAC advice
is copied below) and legal advice on WHOIS/GDPR
from Taylor Wessing which was commissioned by
the IPC, which provides another perspective on
thinking about RDS/WHOIS and GDPR. -Vicky</p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:13.0pt;color:windowtext">3.
GDPR/WHOIS </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:1.0pt;margin-left:.75in"><b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">a.
The GAC advises the ICANN Board that: </span></b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">i.
the 2007 GAC WHOIS Principles (attached)
continue to reflect the important public
policy issues associated with WHOIS services.
Accordingly, ICANN should take these issues
into account as it moves forward with its
planning to comply with the European Union’s
General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR). In
these principles, the GAC has notably
recognized that WHOIS data (also known as
Registration Directory Services) is used for a
number of legitimate activities, including: 1.
Assisting law enforcement authorities in
investigations and in enforcing national and
international laws, assisting in combatting
against abusive use of internet communication
technologies; </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:1.0pt;margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">2.
Assisting businesses, other organizations, and
users in combatting fraud, complying with
relevant laws, and safeguarding the interests
of the public; </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:1.0pt;margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">3.
Combatting infringement and misuse of
intellectual property; and </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">4.
Contributing to user confidence in the
Internet as a reliable and efficient means of
information and communication by helping users
identify persons or entities responsible for
content and services online. </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext"> </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">Accordingly,
</span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">b.
the GAC advises the ICANN Board that: </span></b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">i.
as it considers how to comply with the GDPR
with regard to WHOIS, it should use its best
efforts to create a system that </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:1.25pt;margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">continues
to facilitate the legitimate activities
recognized in the 2007 Principles, including
by: 1. Keeping WHOIS quickly accessible for
security and stability purposes, for consumer
protection and law enforcement investigations,
and for crime prevention efforts, through
user-friendly and easy access to comprehensive
information to facilitate timely action. </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">2.
Keeping WHOIS quickly accessible to the public
(including businesses and other organizations)
for legitimate purposes, including to combat
fraud and deceptive conduct, to combat
infringement and misuse of intellectual
property, and to engage in due diligence for
online transactions and communications. </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext"> </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">In
order to promote the public interest, and in
response to the ICANN CEO’s invitation to
contribute questions pertaining to legal
advice on the interpretation and application
of the GDPR, </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:1.25pt;margin-left:.75in"><b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">c.
the GAC also advises the ICANN Board to: </span></b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">i.
seek information from its outside counsel
tasked with providing guidance on GDPR issues
that addresses the following issues: 1. What
are the options under the GDPR to ensure the
lawful availability of WHOIS/RDS data for
consumer protection and law enforcement
activities In particular, are there changes to
policy or the legal framework that should be
considered with a view to preserving the
functionality of the WHOIS to the greatest
extent possible for these purposes and others
also recognized as legitimate? This question
includes tasks carried out in the public
interest and tasks carried out for a
legitimate purpose, including preventing fraud
and deceptive activities, investigating and
combatting crime, promoting and safeguarding
public safety, consumer protection,
cyber-security etc. </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">2.
What are the options under the GDPR to ensure
the lawful availability of WHOIS/RDS data for
the public, including businesses and other
organizations? This question includes tasks
carried out in the public interest and tasks
carried out for a legitimate purpose,
including preventing fraud and deceptive
activities, investigating and combatting crime
as well as infringement and misuse of
intellectual property, promoting and
safeguarding public safety, consumer
protection, cyber-security etc. </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.25in;page-break-before:always"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">Finally,
</span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">d.
the GAC also advises the ICANN Board that: </span></b><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">i.
it is urgent to address these issues and that
the GAC should be fully involved in the design
and implementation of any (including interim)
solution and requests that ICANN practice
transparency vis-à-vis the multistakeholder
community in its GDPR activities. </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.75in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext"> </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext"> </span></p>
<p class="m_2015730192005420593Default"
style="margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;color:windowtext">RATIONALE
</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.25in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt">This advice reflects
the view of governments that the continued and
lawful availability of WHOIS/RDS data for
consumer protection, intellectual property
rights protection and law enforcement
activities is a vital public concern and that
ICANN should strive to explore all possible
mechanisms under the GDPR to ensure that this
data remains available for legitimate
activities that protect the public and promote
a safe, secure, and trustworthy online
environment.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
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<p
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style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#221f72">Vicky
Sheckler</span><span
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style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#221f72"></span></p>
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<p
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style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666">SVP,
Deputy General
Counsel</span><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"></span></p>
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<p
class="MsoNormal"
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style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666">Recording
Industry
Association of
America</span><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"></span></p>
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class="MsoNormal"
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style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#221f72">e.<b> </b></span><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"><a
href="mailto:vsheckler@riaa.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:#666666">vsheckler@riaa.com</span></a></span><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"></span></p>
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href="http://www.riaa.com/" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
style="color:#666666">riaa.com</span></a></span><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"></span></p>
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href="tel:%28202%29%20857-9603" value="+12028579603" target="_blank"
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style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666">1025
F Street, NW</span><span
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windowtext
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alt="https://esr-storage.s3.amazonaws.com/images/8188/45126/icons/57bded46376ad.jpg"
class=""
height="24"
width="24"
border="0"></span></a><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"></span></p>
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style="line-height:12.0pt"><a
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target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
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windowtext
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class=""
height="24"
width="24"
border="0"></span></a><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#666666"></span></p>
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<td
style="padding:0in
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windowtext
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width="23"
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style="width:5.0in;height:.8333in"
id="m_2015730192005420593Picture_x0020_6"
src="cid:part14.42A64B63.3335A1A6@key-systems.net"
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class="" height="80"
width="480"
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class="m_2015730192005420593mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
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</div>
<pre>______________________________<wbr>_________________
gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a>
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg</a></pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class="m_2015730192005420593moz-signature" cols="72">--
Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann
- Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396901" value="+4968949396901" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901</a>
Fax.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396851" value="+4968949396851" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851</a>
Email: <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
Web: <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.key-systems.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.RRPproxy.net</a>
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.domaindiscount24.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.domaindiscount24.com</a> / <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.BrandShelter.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.BrandShelter.com</a>
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.facebook.com/KeySystems</a>
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.twitter.com/key_systems" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.twitter.com/key_systems</a>
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.keydrive.lu" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.keydrive.lu</a>
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
------------------------------<wbr>--------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann
- legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396901" value="+4968949396901" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901</a>
Fax.: <a href="tel:+49%206894%209396851" value="+4968949396851" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">+49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851</a>
Email: <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
Web: <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.key-systems.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.RRPproxy.net</a>
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.domaindiscount24.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.domaindiscount24.com</a> / <a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.BrandShelter.com" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.BrandShelter.com</a>
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.facebook.com/KeySystems</a>
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.twitter.com/key_systems" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.twitter.com/key_systems</a>
CEO: Alexander Siffrin
Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
<a class="m_2015730192005420593moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.keydrive.lu" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">www.keydrive.lu</a>
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
</pre>
</div>
<br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
gnso-rds-pdp-wg mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org"
moz-do-not-send="true">gnso-rds-pdp-wg@icann.org</a><br>
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href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rds-pdp-wg"
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</blockquote>
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<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
Bei weiteren Fragen stehen wir Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen,
Volker A. Greimann
- Rechtsabteilung -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
Web: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.key-systems.net">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net">www.RRPproxy.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.domaindiscount24.com">www.domaindiscount24.com</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.BrandShelter.com">www.BrandShelter.com</a>
Folgen Sie uns bei Twitter oder werden Sie unser Fan bei Facebook:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems">www.facebook.com/KeySystems</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.twitter.com/key_systems">www.twitter.com/key_systems</a>
Geschäftsführer: Alexander Siffrin
Handelsregister Nr.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
Umsatzsteuer ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.keydrive.lu">www.keydrive.lu</a>
Der Inhalt dieser Nachricht ist vertraulich und nur für den angegebenen Empfänger bestimmt. Jede Form der Kenntnisgabe, Veröffentlichung oder Weitergabe an Dritte durch den Empfänger ist unzulässig. Sollte diese Nachricht nicht für Sie bestimmt sein, so bitten wir Sie, sich mit uns per E-Mail oder telefonisch in Verbindung zu setzen.
--------------------------------------------
Should you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us.
Best regards,
Volker A. Greimann
- legal department -
Key-Systems GmbH
Im Oberen Werk 1
66386 St. Ingbert
Tel.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 901
Fax.: +49 (0) 6894 - 9396 851
Email: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:vgreimann@key-systems.net">vgreimann@key-systems.net</a>
Web: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.key-systems.net">www.key-systems.net</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.RRPproxy.net">www.RRPproxy.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.domaindiscount24.com">www.domaindiscount24.com</a> / <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.BrandShelter.com">www.BrandShelter.com</a>
Follow us on Twitter or join our fan community on Facebook and stay updated:
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.facebook.com/KeySystems">www.facebook.com/KeySystems</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.twitter.com/key_systems">www.twitter.com/key_systems</a>
CEO: Alexander Siffrin
Registration No.: HR B 18835 - Saarbruecken
V.A.T. ID.: DE211006534
Member of the KEYDRIVE GROUP
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.keydrive.lu">www.keydrive.lu</a>
This e-mail and its attachments is intended only for the person to whom it is addressed. Furthermore it is not permitted to publish any content of this email. You must not use, disclose, copy, print or rely on this e-mail. If an addressing or transmission error has misdirected this e-mail, kindly notify the author by replying to this e-mail or contacting us by telephone.
</pre>
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