<div dir="ltr"><div>To be honest, I feel like I've wasted a year+ on this and I question how likely I'll be to participate in future efforts. The juice just isn't worth the squeeze.<br><br></div>Michael Hammer<br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, May 14, 2018 at 8:56 AM, Stephanie Perrin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca" target="_blank">stephanie.perrin@mail.utoronto.ca</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">I agree. It will be
hard to get people to try again if we cannot be honest with
ourselves and try to figure out how to fix the broken bits.</font></font></p><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
<p><font size="+1"><font face="Lucida Grande">Stephanie Perrin</font></font><br>
</p></font></span><div><div class="h5">
<div class="m_5030150387878859022moz-cite-prefix">On 2018-05-13 22:50, Andrew Sullivan
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">I
am perfectly content for the leadership to express their
individual opinions that we failed.
<br>
<br>
But indeed, in _my_ opinion, if we are incapable of admitting we
failed here, then the GNSO process is far too broken to be useful.
If we cannot admit our failure, no victory will ever be possible
except by accident.
<br>
<br>
Best regards,
<br>
<br>
A
<br>
<br>
--
<br>
Please excuse my clumbsy thums
<br>
----------
<br>
On May 13, 2018 22:06:48 Rubens Kuhl <a class="m_5030150387878859022moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:rubensk@nic.br" target="_blank"><rubensk@nic.br></a> wrote:
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<blockquote type="cite">On 13 May 2018, at 21:54, Andrew
Sullivan <a class="m_5030150387878859022moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ajs@anvilwalrusden.com" target="_blank"><ajs@anvilwalrusden.com></a> wrote:
<br>
<br>
On Fri, May 11, 2018 at 01:00:29AM -0300, Rubens Kuhl wrote:
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<br>
Even saying so would require a consensus of the WG.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Nonsense. The leadership can say whatever they want "in their
<br>
judgement" about the WG.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
That still doesn't constitute a WG position. It's basically
their individual positions.
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"> If that's not true, I don't understand
what
<br>
the meaning of the term "the leadership" is.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
In GNSO practices, shepherding instead of ruling.
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<br>
Still, I would like to propose something more radical: that
the WG
<br>
actually does produce such a rough consensus.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
In GNSO lingo, consensus is what would be called rough consensus
in IETF.
<br>
<br>
<br>
Rubens
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<br>
A
<br>
<br>
<br>
--
<br>
Andrew Sullivan
<br>
<a class="m_5030150387878859022moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ajs@anvilwalrusden.com" target="_blank">ajs@anvilwalrusden.com</a>
<br>
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