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Hi,<br>
<br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://gnso.icann.org/en/improvements/new-constituency-recog-process-24jun11en.pdf">http://gnso.icann.org/en/improvements/new-constituency-recog-process-24jun11en.pdf</a><br>
<br>
<div data-canvas-width="27.504400000000004" style="left: 96px; top:
408.108px; font-size: 26.6px; font-family: serif; transform:
scaleX(1.12954);">II.</div>
<div data-canvas-width="66.60640000000001" style="left: 156.01px;
top: 408.108px; font-size: 26.6px; font-family: serif; transform:
scaleX(1.02471);">Scope</div>
<div data-canvas-width="165.4" style="left: 748.8px; top: 461.88px;
font-size: 20px; font-family: serif; transform: scaleX(0.999396);">The
processes, procedures, and criteria described in this document
apply to Constituency applications </div>
<div data-canvas-width="581.9999999999999" style="left: 279.8px;
top: 507.88px; font-size: 20px; font-family: serif; transform:
scaleX(0.999714);">intended for the Non-Commercial Stakeholder
Group (NCSG) and Commercial Stakeholder Group (CSG) within the
Non-Contracted Parties House (ref. ICANN Bylaws, Article X,
Section 5.4). </div>
<br>
So while people can petition the Board to form constituencies in the
RySG or RsSG, they are not subject to this process as far as i know.<br>
<br>
There may be a newer reference but i can't find it.<br>
<br>
<br>
avri<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 04-May-15 18:28, Gomes, Chuck wrote:<br>
</div>
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Avri,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I
never thought that the constituency procedure was only
created for the NCPH. As far as I understand, the
procedures could be applied in the CPH as well. It so
happened that the RySG developed a process for including new
groups without creating some of the complexities associated
with constituencies. But I don’t think that means that a
group couldn’t apply to be a constituency.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Chuck<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:owner-gnso-review-dt@icann.org">owner-gnso-review-dt@icann.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:owner-gnso-review-dt@icann.org">mailto:owner-gnso-review-dt@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Avri Doria<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, May 03, 2015 12:05 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:gnso-review-dt@icann.org">gnso-review-dt@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [gnso-review-dt] Personal comment on
newest revision of the Westlake review<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">These
comments are my own personal comments and do not reflect a
negotiated set of comments from amongst the NCSG members of
the Working party.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">While
I can personally support most of the recommendations made by
Westlake in the report, I do have questions and concerns
with some of the discussions in document. First I will
mention the specific recommendations for which I have
questions, later I list comments based on their page number.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l5
level1 lfo1;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Rec
22 seems too limited. Shouldn’t the GNSO council also
concern itself with the subject having been adequately
covered. More discussion below.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l3
level1 lfo2;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Rec
26 seems to include the issue that the rules for new
constituencies have not been followed.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">While
Westlake, and many others, do not like the rules as
established by the Board’s SIC, I do not believe there is
evidence of those rules having be flaunted or otherwise
ignored.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">It
should also be noted that the methods for initiating new
constituencies was only created for the NCPH and not for the
CPH. So perhaps a recommendation needs include some
discussion of creating a set of rules applicable to both
houses equally.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
agree that the default should include creating the new
constituencies, though perhaps we need a lighter weight
notion of constituency that is topical or based on interest,
that is easier to create and sunset. I also believe that
constituency creation needs to be done according to a set of
rules and that they need to be created in the proper
stakeholder groups. I think the evidence of the possible
constituencies Westlake discussed is that they did not apply
to the correct stakeholder group. One could question
whether the current setup of the GNSO allowed any proper
place for these constituencies.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">An
issue that could be discussed is whether the division of the
GNSO in 4 SG, leaves some organizations homeless as they may
either fit into any of the 4 SGs, or may be hybrid
organizations that cannot find a home in a strictly
segmented set of stakeholder groups. Is there a SG for
every possible constituency?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l16
level1 lfo3;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
13<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">Complexity
deters newcomers</span><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Is
the report assuming that complexity can be removed, or that
it be mitigated by better explanations.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4
level1 lfo4;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
14
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">In
addition, the current structure of the GNSO has been in
place for only about three years. From the Westlake Review
Team’s professional experience of structural change in many
organisations of differing types, this represents only a
relatively short time for it to become firmly established
and for people to be fully familiar with it.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
review could also have included an analysis of why such an
oppositional organization arrangement was a good thing that
should be allowed to become firmly established. I question
the degree to which the deleterious effects have been
adequately studied. In most all of the organization
dynamics literature I have ever read, there is a negative
effect to creating a set of oppositional structures, as was
done in the past GNSO reform. Westlake could have done a
great service by including an analysis of this situation and
the many ways in which this oppositional setup has affected
the GNSO. Yes, we have learned to live with it, but largely
we do that by avoiding the contentious issues as much as
possible. Even Section 9 of the Westlake report that has an
extensive discussion of the structural issue does not
recommend further study.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Since
Westlake does not wish to recommend further work on this
subject, I recommend that the GNSO Review Party make its own
recommendation vis a vis further work on this topic.
Various members of the Board have been quite outspoken on
the idea that in the ICANN bottom-up model, if we don’t like
the structure, then we should recommend a way to fix it. We
do not need a review or a SIC to give us permission to fix
what needs to be fixed. We should just do it. Perhaps this
is an issue that needs to be taken to GNSO Council.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l13
level1 lfo5;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
40<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
ATRT2 figures are from 2013. Has there been any work done
to check and see whether there has been any change since
then or what the rate of change is? </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l2
level1 lfo6;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
43,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
description of the Policy & Implementation team work
seems incomplete and dated. Might be worth giving a
timestamp for when that description was made.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l10
level1 lfo7;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
50<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">The
average length of a PDP is between 2 and 3 years</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">All
the other figures in that section appear to be in days.
Would be interesting to know what the actual average was in
days. 2-3 years is such a wide range. Standard deviation
would also be interesting. This comments also relates to
the charts on Section 9. At the very least, there should be
annotation that this data come from before outreach and does
not show any effects that might have been achieved by the
outreach program.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l8
level1 lfo8;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
71<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Among
the things I have assumed the council should ensure, in
addition to those listed, is that all of the issues have had
a full exploration and that the opinions of all stakeholders
as is possible has been taken adequately into account. As
this does not figure on the Westlake list, I am wondering
whether they consider this an inappropriate activity for the
council. Does Westlake consider it appropriate for the GNSO
council to send a report back to a WG if they feel the work
has not been complete in respect to diversity of view or
full discussion of substance? There are issues concerned
with the substance of an issue, yet Westlake seems to
indicate that the council should have no concern for the
substance.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l17
level1 lfo9;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
72
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">We
acknowledge that the Board is the peak governing body of
ICANN, so it would be inappropriate to limit its authority</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
current CWG Accountability has taken issue with a structure
where the Board is supreme in all substantive issues. Would
Westlake see this as inappropriate?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0
level1 lfo10;vertical-align:baseline">
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style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
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style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
81<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">Following
the BGC WG review, but before the new and final Constituency
process was implemented (2011), staff developed a two-step
process (Notice of Intent to form a New Constituency, New
Constituency petition and Charter applications) for new
constituency applications</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
Westlake does not note that this procedure was created only
for the NCPH. There is not such procedure for creating
constituencies in the CPH. It has never been clear why such
a policy should only apply to half of the GNSO. Does
Westlake have any input on this situation? Did it figure
into the analysis?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l9
level1 lfo11;vertical-align:baseline">
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style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
82<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">and
took no action on the Consumer Constituency as it was still
being worked on</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">It
should be noted that while the candidate constituency still
exists in the NCSG, and it still holds observer seats in all
NCSG committees as defined in the NCSG Charter, it has not
been active in years. Despite this, no attempt has been made
to end its candidacy. Several attempts have been made to
resurrect it, and some NCSG members still hold out hope for
it (I am a NCSG member of the candidate Consumer
constituency as well as of NCUC and supported its creation)
completing the ICANN policy and NCSG charter’s required
activities for full status. Would seem appropriate to
discuss the case completely as opposed to allowing it to
appear that this was somehow a prejudicial act by the NCSG.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l15
level1 lfo12;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
83<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">In
the discussion of the Cybercafe constituency applications
Westlake avoids several salient facts:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l14
level1 lfo13;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
NCSG charter, as approved by the ICANN Board, as well as the
defined process for creating new constituencies requires the
constituencies not only be appropriate to the SG group to
which they are applying, i.e be non commercial in the NCSG
or be commercial in the CSG, but that there should not be an
overlap with existing constituencies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l14
level1 lfo13;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">The
statement related to the fact that if the applicants of the
Cybecafe had paid attention to the requirements for the
NCSG, they would have realized that as commercial entities
they were not qualified for the Non Commercial SG. This was
backed up by the Board.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Again
this makes the NCSG look like it did some inappropriate when
it was following procedures and its own Board approved
charter.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Does
Westlake recommend that:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l12
level1 lfo14;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">It
is ok to put commercial constituencies in the NCSG and non
commercial constituencies in the CSG?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l12
level1 lfo14;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">It
is ok to create constituencies with overlapping mandates on
the same SG?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Does
Westlake have a recommendation for how to handle groups that
file an intent to form a constituency without being fit for
any of the four existing SGs?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l6
level1 lfo15;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
85<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">What
evidence is there to substantiate:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">-
Less ‘pure’ or altruistic motives, such as protecting one’s
own position, status in the GNSO/ICANN community (or with an
employer), or,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:1.0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#783F04">−
In other instances, individual concerns that if someone new
comes in, the replaced incumbent will lose their own travel
funding, regardless of the GNSO’s greater interest of having
the most appropriate people for the role – rather than just
those who can defend their positions the most effectively.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">What
Westlake interprets as ‘protecting a patch’ may just be a
strong feeling in support of adhering to the processes as
negotiated and agreed to by constituencies, stakeholder
groups and the Board. To indicate otherwise based on
hearsay and without adequate substantive proof is somewhat
disparaging of hard working sincere individuals. While this
may indeed occur, I am also not well placed to judge the
intentions of others, it seems inappropriate to include such
claims in a review. Isn’t it enough to say that not enough
has been done to create new constituencies without casting
aspersions on a population of hard working volunteers? Such
evaluations, albeit very general and not about any
individual or SG, seems like they should be avoided in a
review.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l11
level1 lfo16;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
91<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">NPOC
is used both as an example of the only new constituency
chartered and as a bludgeon against the NCSG. Yes, there
have been, and occasionally still are rough times between
the sister non commercial constituencies. But we work
together and produce substantive NCSG statements that
include the support of both constituencies, our candidate
constituency and individuals. Not only did we successfully
negotiate the creation of this new constituency according to
rules that were being developed as part of the process
itself, the NCSG charter was written with a full set of
appeals for any occasion in which a constituency, or any
group of participants, felt that the NCSG Committee
decisions treated them unfairly or improperly. Initiating
these NCSG appeals takes a very low threshold (15 members
out of hundreds), yet not a single appeal has been initiated
since the charter was approved in 2011.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">A
claim is also made about the lack of new leadership in the
NCUC and the NCSG. If one were to look at the leadership of
the NCSG, or NCUC for that matter, more than half got
involved with ICANN in the last few years. Many are
newcomers in their first 2-3 years of participation in the
NCSG. Yes some of us old timers still hold posts, but we
are by no means the majority. Many of our senior members
work in the background on WGs and CWGs and penning draft
statements without holding a leadership post. Many of the
senior people long for a new younger generation to take of
the SG and actively recruit replacements for the roles they
hold. Would have been good to see that accounted for in the
analysis.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7
level1 lfo17;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
113<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
believe in the discussion of the GNSO as an artificial
construct Westlake makes a category error. But first, in a
sense all of the SOAC are essentially artificial constructs
that have evolved over the course of years to reflect the
reality of participation. The category error has to do with
comparing the GNSO to the ALAC. That is wrong. The GNSO is
to the GNSO Council as the At-Large is to the ALAC. One
cannot compare the GNSO with the ALAC, though they could
compare the GNSO Council to the ALAC. As someone who
participates in both the At-large ,and the GNSO, I believe
there is very little difference between the relationship
among the RALOs of the At-large and the relationship among
SGs of the GNSO. I see them as similar structure, though
along different discrimination lines, geography and
interest. This is not to say wee don’t need better
communication across the silos, but merely to argue that the
GNSO is not that different in this respect of other
organizations that have a layers internal structure.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1
level1 lfo18;vertical-align:baseline">
<!--[if !supportLists]--><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span
style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt
"Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><!--[endif]--><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Page
116<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
find the appropriation of Sir Winston’s adage a bit
overstated in relation to the GNSO. He was talking about
Democracy. While the quote can be appropriately applied to
something as fundamental as the multistakeholder model of
participatory democracy, I find its application to the GNSO
a bit puzzling. Even if the quote did not trivialize the
original utterance, I see little basis for a judgement that
many other schemes have been tried and been shown to be
wanting. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p style="margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Despite
my comments, I want to reiterate that I take little issue
with the specific recommendations. I thank the Westlake
Review team for having produced a mostly balanced 2nd
revision of their report and for giving us yet another
chance to review their work before it is submitted.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p
style="mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:0in"><span
style="font-size:11.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Avri
Doria</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
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