[gnso-rpm-wg] SOLICITING TMCH PROPOSALS --- RE: Agenda and documents for Wednesday Working Group meeting (12 April)

Paul Keating paul at law.es
Tue Apr 11 23:06:53 UTC 2017


Apologies if I have mixed and matched WGs

 Generally agree as to pressure but the examiners are attempting to unify language for obvious reasons no?  Nothing like charging more to limit descriptions.  :-0

Infringement is all about defendant's use vs how the applicant described their goods/services. So disagree completely there.


Sent from my iPad

> On 12 Apr 2017, at 00:54, Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> This thread wasn't about the TMCH transparency issue.  You are mixing your threads up, or you are trying to flog everyone into talking about nothing but "transparency" on every thread in the RPM group.
> 
> As concerns classifications, I stand by my earlier statement as entirely correct.  I wish you were right in saying that as a registrant (or more accurately, an applicant) "you remain free to describe goods/services as you see fit."  If this were the case, there are hundreds of seriously confused Trademark Examiners and Supervisors at the USPTO.  There is a substantial amount of both rigor and formalism in preparing an acceptable description of goods and services for a trademark application (and you are most definitely limited by the Nice Classification system), and Examiners are not shy about issuing Office Actions in that regard for any number of infirmities in the "ID".  In spite of your cynicism, I have not generally found Examiners trying to divide descriptions into classes as a revenue generation tool.  Rather they are following largely the same practices I've seen over the years.
> 
> And then, when you get to an infringement analysis it matters not a whit.
> 
> Greg
> 
> Greg Shatan
> C: 917-816-6428
> S: gsshatan
> Phone-to-Skype: 646-845-9428
> gregshatanipc at gmail.com
> 
> 
> 
>> On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 6:45 PM, Paul Keating <paul at law.es> wrote:
>> Greg,
>> 
>> While we can all bicker about the scope of trademark rights, How are your comments related to the TMCH transparency issue?
>> 
>> As concerns classifications, you are entirely incorrect.  As-registrant you remain free to describe goods/services as you see fit. You are not limited by class. The only requirement at issue is that you accurately describe the goods and services.  Attempts are made to regulate language for obvious reasons.
>> 
>> Of course if your description crosses over into another NICE code then your client gets to pay more.  That renders the NICE code system a billing mechanism.   Let's not try to make things bigger than they really are.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 12 Apr 2017, at 00:28, Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Rebecca,
>>> 
>>> I and many of the other WG members on this list routinely practice trademark law and are quite clear on the requirements for a valid mark.  Our clients depend on that.
>>> 
>>> As you must know, although trademarks are ordinarily and routinely registered in identified classes of goods and services using the Nice Classifications, trademark registrations (which should be distinguished from trademarks) in most regimes rarely "cover" identified classes of goods.  On the one hand, registrations in certain regimes such as the US cannot ordinarily and routinely be made for an entire class of goods and services, but rather must be made for a more limited list of goods and services within the class, while on the other hand, certain regimes are open to "registering the class."  
>>> 
>>> Furthermore, the "identified class" of goods and services is not particularly in determining the scope of a brandowner's rights.  In an infringement analysis under US law, one looks at "related goods and services" including the natural zone of expansion and the likelihood of bridging the gap.  (There can be some interesting surprises in the law regarding findings of "relatedness" and "non-relatedness."  As a younger lawyer, I would amuse myself by leafing through the "Products Comparison Manual for Trademark Users."  I don't know if you did that as well, but I'll admit I'm a bit wonky that way.)  
>>> 
>>> Indeed, the disinterest in Nice Classifications in infringement analysis goes beyond "not particularly germane."  In "both opposition proceedings and federal court actions in the United States, it has been held that the classification of goods and services has no bearing on the determination of likelihood of confusion. The purpose of classification of goods is for internal administration and convenience at the Patent and Trademark Office. Classification does not limit or extend a registrant's rights."   http://www.inta.org/Advocacy/Pages/UseofClassificationinLikelihoodofConfusionAnalysis.aspx 
>>> 
>>> The Nice Classifications are a formalistic and somewhat antiquated taxonomy of Classes of Goods and Services, and anyone who regularly needs to classify the good or service of a product for a trademark application will occasionally find themselves trying to put a round peg in a square hole. It comes with the job when prosecuting trademarks. The Nice Classifications often do not line up well with commercial realities, as the courts have long recognized.  Any attempt to use them as if they are dispositive of the reach of any brandowner's rights would be making an unfortunate mistake.
>>> 
>>> I'll let Paul McGrady respond to your charge that his reference is "incredibly misleading."
>>> 
>>> Best regards,
>>> 
>>> Greg
>>> 
>>> Greg Shatan
>>> C: 917-816-6428
>>> S: gsshatan
>>> Phone-to-Skype: 646-845-9428
>>> gregshatanipc at gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 5:54 PM, Rebecca Tushnet <Rebecca.Tushnet at law.georgetown.edu> wrote:
>>>> As a signatory: (1) I and many of the other signatories routinely
>>>> teach trademark law and are pretty clear on the requirements for a
>>>> valid mark; (2) email, unlike the TMCH, does not exist only to
>>>> implement rights protection measures, and thus email is not an
>>>> appropriate target of this working group or the scholars' letter but
>>>> the TMCH, its contents, its openness, and its uses are; (3) your
>>>> quotation of ACPA is incredibly misleading.  As you must know,
>>>> trademarks ordinarily and routinely cover identified classes of goods
>>>> and services, and ACPA doesn't change that--it just provides for
>>>> liability for specific kinds of bad faith registrations.
>>>> Rebecca Tushnet
>>>> Georgetown Law
>>>> 703 593 6759
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 4:50 PM, Paul McGrady <policy at paulmcgrady.com> wrote:
>>>> > STRICTLY IN MY PERSONAL CAPACITY
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Hi Phil,
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks for your note.  The “Trademark Scholars Letter” you reference seems
>>>> > to imply that the TMCH is “recently demanded by trademark owners.”  Quite
>>>> > the opposite – it is an implemented RPM that has been out there for years
>>>> > now and is up for review.  With due respect to the contribution made by the
>>>> > “Trademark Scholars Letter”, it does not appear to be keeping pace with the
>>>> > facts on the ground.  It also conflates the TMCH itself with the Sunrise and
>>>> > Claims which draw upon data from the TMCH.  The TMCH is a database, not an
>>>> > RPM.  While it is used in conjunction with the Sunrise and Claims RPM, so
>>>> > are all sorts of other technologies (email, as an example) and that doesn’t
>>>> > make those other technologies an RPM.  Also, the ““Trademark Scholars
>>>> > Letter” doesn’t cite to authorities supporting many of the claims it makes
>>>> > (which is odd for a letter seeking special status as ‘scholarship.”).
>>>> > Lastly, the “Trademark Scholars Letter” contains statements which are
>>>> > questionable at best.  For example, the claim that “Under U.S. and most
>>>> > other countries’  trademark laws, ordinarily a trademark  right only exists
>>>> > within a distinct class of goods or services” which is exactly the opposite
>>>> > of what the ACPA states about trademark rights as applied in the
>>>> > cybersquatting context namely that the analysis is “without regard to the
>>>> > goods or services of the parties.”
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Like you, I’m a great advocate of rigor and accuracy, and as such I am not
>>>> > hanging too many hats on the “Trademark Scholars Letter.”
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Best,
>>>> >
>>>> > Paul
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org [mailto:gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Phil Corwin
>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2017 2:12 PM
>>>> > To: Greg Shatan <gregshatanipc at gmail.com>
>>>> > Cc: gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Subject: Re: [gnso-rpm-wg] SOLICITING TMCH PROPOSALS --- RE: Agenda and
>>>> > documents for Wednesday Working Group meeting (12 April)
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Greg:
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > To clarify, I was referencing significant TMCH issues that can be addressed,
>>>> > if a WG member or members wish to, by the submission of specific proposals
>>>> > over the coming weeks as we strive to conclude, to the full extent possible,
>>>> > our consideration of TMCH matters and move on to Sunrise Registrations and
>>>> > TM Claims Notices. I was not restricting examples to what is on our agenda
>>>> > for this Wednesday and I was not trying to be inflammatory.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > I am frankly quite surprised at your statement, “I am at a loss to see how
>>>> > the TMCH database itself gives unfair advantage to TM owners, nor do I
>>>> > believe I have seen any suggestion to that effect. “
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > The “Trademark Scholars Letter” transmitted t this WG by EFF and extensively
>>>> > on this list discussed makes precisely that point:
>>>> >
>>>> >                 We are concerned that the expansive protections recently
>>>> > demanded by trademark owners
>>>> >
>>>> > are inconsistent with basic propositions of trademark law.
>>>> >
>>>> > A case in point is the Trademark Clearinghouse, a mechanism established for
>>>> > the new
>>>> >
>>>> > gTLDs that gives trademark owners special rights to prevent the registration
>>>> > of domain
>>>> >
>>>> > names that contain their trademarks. Those registered in the Trademark
>>>> > Clearinghouse have
>>>> >
>>>> > access to a sunrise period that gives them priority access to domain names
>>>> > in a new gTLD,
>>>> >
>>>> > and to a trademark claims process that gives them early warning when domains
>>>> > the contain
>>>> >
>>>> > their trademarks are registered.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > I do not presently subscribe to the view that the TMCH is inconsistent with
>>>> > TM law and should be eliminated, but I wouldn’t be at all surprised to see a
>>>> > proposal to that end presented by a WG member given statements that have
>>>> > been made on this list.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Likewise, I am well aware that the TMCH is supportive database and not an
>>>> > RPM in itself, which is why my email used the term “placement in the TMCH
>>>> > database”.  I’m also very aware that TM+50 terms are eligible for TMCH
>>>> > registration, as well as terms protected by statute or treaty (which your
>>>> > response neglected to mention), but didn’t think I needed to put all of that
>>>> > in an example relating to possible proposals to expand eligible terms by
>>>> > making trademark+additional word or typographical variations of trademarks
>>>> > into the TMCH for this well-versed audience of WG members.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Lastly I will differ to some extent with your concern about “an unfortunate
>>>> > tendency to roll the TMCH (which is a database) together with Sunrise and
>>>> > Claims (which are RPMs)” in that, while the TMCH is a database and Sunrise
>>>> > and TM Claims are RPMs, I nonetheless see them as irrevocably interrelated.
>>>> > If there was no TMCH then there would be no foundation for the associated
>>>> > RPMs, and if we contract or expand the terms eligible for placement in the
>>>> > TMCH then the associated RPMs will contract or expand accordingly.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > I’m a great advocate of rigor and accuracy, especially when we get to
>>>> > actually debating specific proposals. But I hope the members of this WG will
>>>> > remember that the voluntary  co-chairs of this WG are devoting a great deal
>>>> > of effort to trying to keep it moving a long and on track and, cut us a
>>>> > little sympathetic slack when we employ some verbal shorthand on the
>>>> > assumption that sophisticated WG members will know the additional nuances
>>>> > and need not have them repeatedly pointed out.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Thank you and best regards,
>>>> >
>>>> > Philip
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Philip S. Corwin, Founding Principal
>>>> >
>>>> > Virtualaw LLC
>>>> >
>>>> > 1155 F Street, NW
>>>> >
>>>> > Suite 1050
>>>> >
>>>> > Washington, DC 20004
>>>> >
>>>> > 202-559-8597/Direct
>>>> >
>>>> > 202-559-8750/Fax
>>>> >
>>>> > 202-255-6172/Cell
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Twitter: @VlawDC
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > "Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: Greg Shatan [mailto:gregshatanipc at gmail.com]
>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2017 2:33 PM
>>>> > To: Phil Corwin
>>>> > Cc: George Kirikos; gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> > Subject: Re: [gnso-rpm-wg] SOLICITING TMCH PROPOSALS --- RE: Agenda and
>>>> > documents for Wednesday Working Group meeting (12 April)
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > I have some problems with the examples given here:
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > That means that if you are of a view that the TMCH should be eliminated
>>>> > because you believe it gives unfair advantage to TM owners you will have a
>>>> > chance to present a proposal to that effect.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Likewise, if you are of the view that additional terms besides registered
>>>> > trademarks should be eligible for placement in the TMCH database you will
>>>> > also have a chance to make your case and seek consensus support.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > In the first example, the first problem is that it is outside the four
>>>> > topics that Phil indicated were open for discussion in his follow-up email
>>>> > (design marks, G.I.s, “identical match” and TMDB confidentiality).  So it
>>>> > seems inappropriate (and a bit inflammatory) to suggest that this could be a
>>>> > submission in response to Mary's email.  Second, this seems to be yet
>>>> > another example of an unfortunate tendency to roll the TMCH (which is a
>>>> > database) together with Sunrise and Claims (which are RPMs).  I am at a loss
>>>> > to see how the TMCH database itself gives unfair advantage to TM owners, nor
>>>> > do I believe I have seen any suggestion to that effect.  TMCH on its own
>>>> > does nothing for trademark owners (other than take their money).  There
>>>> > have, of course, been suggestions that the RPMs that use the database
>>>> > (Sunrise and Claims) somehow give an unfair advantage to TM owners (not that
>>>> > I agree, of course).  So, it would seem that this example is in fact related
>>>> > to Sunrise and/or Claims and not to the TMCH itself, and is both incorrectly
>>>> > framed and premature (were it rewritten to refer to Sunrise and/or Claims
>>>> > rather than "the TMCH").  We need to be much more careful in keeping these
>>>> > concepts separate.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > The second example does seem to relate to an extent to one of the four open
>>>> > topics (G.I.s) but the example is factually inaccurate, since additional
>>>> > terms besides registered trademarks are already eligible for placement in
>>>> > the TMCH (TM+50 and "marks protected by statute or treaty").  It's not
>>>> > helpful to give the impression that the TMCH database is currently limited
>>>> > to registered trademarks (I would hope that most of us know that already,
>>>> > but that's not the point).  The discussion around G.I.s would more
>>>> > accurately be framed as whether terms that are not trademarks or previously
>>>> > abused strings containing trademarks should be eligible for the TMCH
>>>> > database.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > A little more rigor and accuracy will help us all, as we drink from the WG
>>>> > firehose....
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Greg
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Greg Shatan
>>>> > C: 917-816-6428
>>>> > S: gsshatan
>>>> > Phone-to-Skype: 646-845-9428
>>>> > gregshatanipc at gmail.com
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 1:21 PM, Phil Corwin <psc at vlaw-dc.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > George:
>>>> >
>>>> > I am consulting with other co-chairs and support staff in regard to what
>>>> > procedure we will follow when any member of this WG asserts that
>>>> > insufficient data has been obtained to resolve a proposed RPM modification
>>>> > on an informed basis, and that such data exists and can be accessed within a
>>>> > reasonable time. We'll get back to the full WG on that.
>>>> >
>>>> > In the interim I would point out  that the deadline of 19 April was proposed
>>>> > only in relation to the 4 questions on the structure and operations of the
>>>> > TMCH which the WG had agreed were still open (design marks, G.I.s,
>>>> > “identical match” and TMDB confidentiality). Some other questions have been
>>>> > closed for the time being, a few are being tabled for further discussion
>>>> > following WG work on Sunrise and Claims. These 4 questions have been
>>>> > discussed extensively for some time. Data needs were identified and sought.
>>>> > To the extent that a decision on any proposal on any of these 4 TMCH-related
>>>> > questions may be contingent on further data, it will be helpful if the type
>>>> > of data and (if possible) suggested source(s) can be indicated in the
>>>> > proposal.
>>>> >
>>>> > Also remember that we have always been clear that all decisions by the WG
>>>> > are not final and are subject to being revisited up until the submission of
>>>> > our Phase 1 Finales Report and recommendations, if intervening decisions and
>>>> > new information justifies such revisiting.
>>>> >
>>>> > So we are not trying to cut off any discussion prematurely. But this is not
>>>> > a debating society but a WG charged with making decisions and forwarding
>>>> > recommendations, and we do have a timeline we are trying to adhere to. That
>>>> > is why the co-chairs are now actively urging that we move the TMCH
>>>> > discussions away from open-ended discussions and toward focused debate on
>>>> > specific proposals.
>>>> >
>>>> > Finally --and this is solely a personal observation -- I think there are
>>>> > likely some issues where no amount of data will bring about consensus due to
>>>> > substantial differences in perspective.
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks and best regards,
>>>> > Philip
>>>> >
>>>> > Philip S. Corwin, Founding Principal
>>>> > Virtualaw LLC
>>>> > 1155 F Street, NW
>>>> > Suite 1050
>>>> > Washington, DC 20004
>>>> > 202-559-8597/Direct
>>>> > 202-559-8750/Fax
>>>> > 202-255-6172/Cell
>>>> >
>>>> > Twitter: @VlawDC
>>>> >
>>>> > "Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey
>>>> >
>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > From: gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org [mailto:gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org]
>>>> > On Behalf Of George Kirikos
>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2017 12:33 PM
>>>> > To: gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> > Subject: Re: [gnso-rpm-wg] SOLICITING TMCH PROPOSALS --- RE: Agenda and
>>>> > documents for Wednesday Working Group meeting (12 April)
>>>> >
>>>> > Phil:
>>>> >
>>>> > With respect, this timeline is too short, given that we've not even had
>>>> > answers/data to this working group's questions returned from Deloitte. e.g.
>>>> > just last week I specifically asked for the top 500 terms (not just the top
>>>> > 10), and I had asked for that prior to last week (i.e. during the Copenhagen
>>>> > calls in March). Other answers/data have not been provided, either (e.g.
>>>> > ICANN has the right to audit Deloitte's financials, to see if the fees to
>>>> > TMCH applicants/registries are reasonable, etc.), or the entire table of
>>>> > questions, etc. that was prepared that sought out relevant data.
>>>> >
>>>> > Proper order is: Data first, then analysis of the data, then proposals for
>>>> > changes, then conclusions.
>>>> >
>>>> > We can't go straight to proposals and then conclusions, without having
>>>> > received back all the data that this working group's members have requested.
>>>> >
>>>> > At some point, this PDP will have public comment periods, and the public
>>>> > comments will be able to say "you didn't do the work, didn't collect the
>>>> > data, refused to look for data, refused to analyze the data, refused to
>>>> > accept the conclusions that flowed from the data", etc. This PDP should be
>>>> > sensitive to that, and actually do the work, instead of pretending to do the
>>>> > work to support a predetermined
>>>> > (rigged) outcome of "no change to the status quo" that some people seem to
>>>> > feel should happen, despite evidence identifying numerous problems.
>>>> >
>>>> > This is probably going to be one of the most scrutinized PDPs in ICANN's
>>>> > history --- let's do the work so that its reports/conclusions can stand up
>>>> > to scrutiny.
>>>> >
>>>> > Sincerely,
>>>> >
>>>> > George Kirikos
>>>> > 416-588-0269
>>>> > http://www.leap.com/
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 12:09 PM, Phil Corwin <psc at vlaw-dc.com> wrote:
>>>> >> WG members:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> We have been having some very lively and occasionally heated
>>>> >> discussions on TMCH-related matters. However, these discussions have
>>>> >> been somewhat amorphous as they have not been focused on any specific
>>>> >> proposal for altering the TMCH. That is about to change, as the time
>>>> >> for discussion of TMCH matters is closing and the time for decisions is
>>>> >> fast approaching..
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> In that regard, please take special note of this portion of the email
>>>> >> sent by Mary---
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>                 For Agenda Item #2, please note the following:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> As these questions have already been the subject of substantial
>>>> >> Working Group discussion, the aim at this meeting is to allow Working
>>>> >> Group members who wish to propose recommendations for the full Working
>>>> >> Group to consider to do so. Any such proposals or recommendations
>>>> >> should be specific, include a list of the benefits and costs,
>>>> >> advantages and disadvantages, and be sent to the Working Group mailing
>>>> >> list no later than 7 days following the call this week (i.e. 19 April).
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> In other words, starting tomorrow we are both soliciting, and will
>>>> >> soon be setting a final deadline, for the presentation of proposals to
>>>> >> alter the current policy concerning the TMCH and its implementation,
>>>> >> with such proposals relating to specific TMCH questions.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> That means that if you are of a view that the TMCH should be
>>>> >> eliminated because you believe it gives unfair advantage to TM owners
>>>> >> you will have a chance to present a proposal to that effect.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Likewise, if you are of the view that additional terms besides
>>>> >> registered trademarks should be eligible for placement in the TMCH
>>>> >> database you will also have a chance to make your case and seek consensus
>>>> >> support.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The above two examples are merely illustrative and by no means
>>>> >> intended to limit anyone’s ability to advocate any question-specific
>>>> >> response.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> In an April 9th email I laid out my expectations for how proposals
>>>> >> would be presented -- Since then the co-chairs have engaged in a
>>>> >> conference call and concurred on this approach, and that is reflected
>>>> >> in Mary’s advisory--
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Here’s how this co-chair would hope our internal decision process
>>>> >> plays out on this or any other policy/implementation matter:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ·         A proponent of making a change to present policy and practice
>>>> >> should articulate the rationale for the proposal and the benefits
>>>> >> expected to flow from its adoption.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ·         The proponent should also be candid about what costs or burdens
>>>> >> might be imposed on various parties if it is adopted and explain why
>>>> >> those costs are outweighed by the envisioned benefits.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ·         If an adopted change would not be self-executing but would
>>>> >> require
>>>> >> significant implementation details then the proponent should at least
>>>> >> explain the basics how that would be practically effected.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I believe that if proponents of making a change follow those
>>>> >> suggestions it will set the stage for at least a fully informed debate
>>>> >> and subsequent decision-making.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The co-chairs have also agreed that when the WG is presented with a
>>>> >> specific proposal we shall, after some reasonable time for discussion,
>>>> >> take a straw poll of WG members participating in the meeting in which
>>>> >> it is raised  to ROUGHLY gauge the level of support/opposition for it.
>>>> >> However, that straw poll will not be binding and whether or not
>>>> >> consensus exists for a particular proposal will be determined by
>>>> >> polling the entire membership of the WG.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> If you have any concerns or questions about this approach please let
>>>> >> us know. Again, the main message is that, so far as the TMCH is
>>>> >> concerned, the time for concluding talk and making decisions is fast
>>>> >> approaching.
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Thank you and best regards,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Philip
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Philip S. Corwin, Founding Principal
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Virtualaw LLC
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 1155 F Street, NW
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Suite 1050
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Washington, DC 20004
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 202-559-8597/Direct
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 202-559-8750/Fax
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 202-255-6172/Cell
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Twitter: @VlawDC
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "Luck is the residue of design" -- Branch Rickey
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> From: gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org
>>>> >> [mailto:gnso-rpm-wg-bounces at icann.org]
>>>> >> On Behalf Of Mary Wong
>>>> >> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 5:56 PM
>>>> >> To: gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> >> Subject: [gnso-rpm-wg] Agenda and documents for Wednesday Working
>>>> >> Group meeting (12 April)
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Dear all,
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> The proposed agenda for our call this Wednesday (12 April), which is
>>>> >> scheduled as a 90-minute call commencing at 1600 UTC, is as follows:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 1.       Roll call (via Adobe Connect and phone bridge only); updates to
>>>> >> Statements of Interest
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 2.       Discuss remaining open TMCH Charter questions (see attached table
>>>> >> and notes, below)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 3.       Overview by Co-Chairs on preliminary recommendations related to
>>>> >> RPMs from the Competition, Consumer Protection & Consumer Trust Review
>>>> >> Team
>>>> >> (CCT-RT) (see attached document)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 4.       Administrative details: e.g. Working Group & Sub Team meeting
>>>> >> dates
>>>> >> for the weeks of 17 & 24 April 2017, confirm scheduled day for 4th
>>>> >> rotating
>>>> >> (0300 UTC) Working Group call
>>>> >>
>>>> >> 5.       Next steps/next meeting
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> For Agenda Item #2, please note the following:
>>>> >>
>>>> >> As these questions have already been the subject of substantial
>>>> >> Working Group discussion, the aim at this meeting is to allow Working
>>>> >> Group members who wish to propose recommendations for the full Working
>>>> >> Group to consider to do so. Any such proposals or recommendations
>>>> >> should be specific, include a list of the benefits and costs,
>>>> >> advantages and disadvantages, and be sent to the Working Group mailing
>>>> >> list no later than 7 days following the call this week (i.e. 19 April).
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Thanks and cheers
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Mary
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ________________________________
>>>> >>
>>>> >> No virus found in this message.
>>>> >> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>> >> Version: 2016.0.8012 / Virus Database: 4769/14262 - Release Date:
>>>> >> 04/07/17
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> gnso-rpm-wg mailing list
>>>> >> gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> >> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > gnso-rpm-wg mailing list
>>>> > gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> > https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg
>>>> >
>>>> > -----
>>>> >
>>>> > No virus found in this message.
>>>> > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>> > Version: 2016.0.8012 / Virus Database: 4769/14262 - Release Date: 04/07/17
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > gnso-rpm-wg mailing list
>>>> > gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> > https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > ________________________________
>>>> >
>>>> > No virus found in this message.
>>>> > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>> > Version: 2016.0.8012 / Virus Database: 4769/14262 - Release Date: 04/07/17
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > gnso-rpm-wg mailing list
>>>> > gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>>> > https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> gnso-rpm-wg mailing list
>>> gnso-rpm-wg at icann.org
>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg
> 
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