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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Dear All,</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Please find the attendance of the call attached to this email. The MP3, Adobe Connect recording and Adobe Connect chat below for the Review of all Rights Protection Mechanisms (RPMs) in all gTLDs PDP Working Group call held on Wednesday, 12 April 2017 at 16:00 UTC. Attendance of the call is posted on agenda wiki page: <a href="https://community.icann.org/x/E8zRAw">https://community.icann.org/x/E8zRAw</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='line-height:15.6pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>MP3:</span></b><span class=MsoHyperlink><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#111111;text-decoration:none'> </span></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#111111'><a href="http://mailer.samanage.com/wf/click?upn=BicbgE3FNUxHuHwOPdgXp7PxnHhpBITaBzfgAxdndi91OL8JzmbOffboGNtBS0YVdrbySrXVyXk2nC-2FA8etmt-2BpwOn0ENtHq-2F2GiFuqisjw-3D_nEX-2FaOijqgcJlSz5SkmueJu3tRbmaDiuX89gT35tStEeSHP9whdoceObpMxYsFLQddiMZpQjIv8dk6BsBGSJXH7VWN4SGLCJgbGKCk6E-2FTErjF4OKNQt65Dk9NF54IJ9kQpmDNySj7bbNz9G4dXi5BgbCZotTx8KNfyeB0z00f8KsMfETeTNKd7vy2kKI7tttQUIwid4NAhxXgT3nZYwmlRhCJ-2BMLdDMGHw9uGXEBUJP2KqYFe5I1RNAtrtQXvkdHbZZX83caHoIq6XoeJ94zDwJLzQw1zsyv2Me97iUfdhpukUb-2FdnSpd-2Bo0KDyMv45Nds6OI2wB-2Fv-2BSEdwbnGHPBDEct-2FFkcbBrXDHhBdgweWMBgVEi65dE7MUgVUyJtvPnfyzUXAUjfsCEqO6NJS2phqvpkcR-2BN-2Fln4OGsnK-2FWsC9vtb2UvcztmoEYHx8wAzbbr8RN1tq9G4BmYR3PdTYKoaHxyb8CusgoUFascmQoE9julGqfZlTzPztw-2BDAFOBU"><span style='color:#0066B2'>https://audio.icann.org/gnso/gnso-rpm-review-12apr17-en.mp3</span></a> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='line-height:15.6pt'><span class=MsoHyperlink><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext;text-decoration:none'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span class=MsoHyperlink><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext;text-decoration:none'>Adobe Connect recording: </span></b></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> <a href="https://participate.icann.org/p2rltvqowvg/?OWASP_CSRFTOKEN=436763efcaabf56fd0227f108d44d3c705d81ed2dd669eac5ee8f7b29a7d3189"><b><span style='color:black;background:white'>https://participate.icann.org/p2rltvqowvg/</span></b></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='line-height:15.6pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>The recordings and transcriptions of the calls are posted on the GNSO Master Calendar page:</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><a href="http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar">http://gnso.icann.org/en/group-activities/calendar</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>** Please let me know if your name has been left off the list **</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Mailing list archives: </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><a href="http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rpm-wg/"><span style='background:white'>http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rpm-wg/</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Wiki page: </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><a href="https://community.icann.org/x/wCWAAw">https://community.icann.org/x/wCWAAw</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'>Thank you.</span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Kind regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Terri Agnew<o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:black'> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'> </span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><b><u><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>Adobe Connect chat transcript for 12 April 2017:</span></u></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Terri Agnew:Welcome to the Review of all Rights Protection Mechanisms (RPMs) in all gTLDs PDP Working Group on Wednesday, 12 April 2017 at 16:00 UTC for 90 minute duration<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Terri Agnew:agenda wiki page: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_E8zRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=e7ZLBblIokCsStKkwQyyQsgaNi3WbizucE4GMfu4F3Q&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_E8zRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=e7ZLBblIokCsStKkwQyyQsgaNi3WbizucE4GMfu4F3Q&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Hi folks.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:bbiab<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:Hi all<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Welcome, Martin.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Hi everyone<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:On a mailing list matter before we get started: Would it be possible for the mailing list software to strip of the ATTnnnn.txt files as they don't seem to contain anything useful?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Seems to be just a bit of repeated text about the mailing list: gnso-rpm-wg mailing list - <a href="mailto:gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org">gnso-rpm-wg@icann.org</a> - <a href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/gnso-rpm-wg</a> etc<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:If the mailing list software could not add this text to out going emails this would be really helpful as it would make it much easier to spot emails with ‘real document attachments’<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Here is a link to the source of an example email <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.gpm.info_msg.txt&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=eviX77twWWJ55bbLJ_8xXWCYtwNgFiAlNDX90sTrAFI&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.gpm.info_msg.txt&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=eviX77twWWJ55bbLJ_8xXWCYtwNgFiAlNDX90sTrAFI&e</a>= if you scroll to the bottom you can see where the problem text is added, which causes [some] email software packages treat as an attachment. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:There had been an .eml attachment forwarded today, too.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Yes I saw that George I think that is a certificate<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:I don't know if ICANN is virus-scanning all the attachments.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:No, the .eml was someone forwarding an actual email.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:I opened it with a text editor, and then copied/pasted the BASE64 text to a website, to read it safely.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:But, the same email turned out to be within the body of the email that Brian sent. So, it was superfluous.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:ah sorry I was thinking of the .p7s that came today too<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Philip Corwin:Hello all. We will start in one minute.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marie Pattullo:Bless you, Phil :-).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Steve Levy:G'day all<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Attending without audio for a few minutes.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):Hello All<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Steve Levy:Thank you for reminding us of these critical core principles, Phil. If we cannot achieve consensus on any issues, all of the hours and energy we've spent on this WG will be for naught<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Phil, yes - please accept our apologies for mistakenly including Question 15 on this agenda and in this document.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Has Deloitte provided answers to any of the data requests yet?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@George, we have no further input from Deloitte at this time. Which specific data points were you interested in?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(e.g. top 500, also how they handle all those marks, e.g. CARS, etc.)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(the 5 or 6 examples of figurative/stylized marks that Rebecca prepared)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:THanks, George. We have followed up with them and hope to receive some feedback ASAP.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Kathy, yes<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:We've asked.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Only standard character claim word marks, yes.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Proposals only for Q7,8 and 10, though.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Do we have a description from TMCH provider answering the charter question?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Michael, do you mean these questions? If so, Deloitte has descibed how they deal witht these types of marks when submitted.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:I believe that all proposals would be presented equally.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Steve Levy:Perhaps we need a sub-team to try and harmonize the various proposals on a given topic (similar to how it's handled by legislators)?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary -- Yes. And thanks. I'll look back in the record for the answer.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:The question, however, has been answered by Deloitte.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:it's a fact question.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:I""<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Yes, 7 and 8 are fact questions.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:10 is more open ended.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:"Should"<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> bradley silver:+1 @J. Scott<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Agree with J Scott. A deadline is more fair I think.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:Hello all. Sorry to be late.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:We should field all proposals.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Colin O'Brien:All proposals would be better<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:+1 Lori<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:I'd like to see all the Deloitte results, to be able to identify problems, before presenting proposed solutions.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:George, I agree with your reading of the questions.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:+1 J. Scott - Council was quite upset<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Georges Nahitchevansky:I agree all proposals shoud be considered at the same time and that we should have teh Deloitte info before proceeding<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:@Greg: I agree with your agreement. :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:agreed.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:with Mary<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Agree with George/Greg/Mary. Very agreeable this morning.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:It also needs to be clearly labelled as a proposal for consideration.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Yes, all proposals should be marked as proposals and reviewed at once so as to not unduly favor one over the other<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Although we may all be coming from different viewpoints, we need to be objective and methodically in how we manage proposals and answers to questions that are provided to the group by 3rd parties<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary: Without looking -- I understand Charter calls for review, identification of issues, and proposals for change consideration. Does Charter also give us the task of proposing specific changes?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:For #10, I've been in favour of allowing "Fuzzy" matching for the ongoing notifications, instead of fees for every variation as per <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.trademark-2Dclearinghouse.com_content_ongoing-2Dnotifications&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=HriQl0AtqhneOCX78ArvY9FhdMtG1Yj49SqcFJNGU4Y&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.trademark-2Dclearinghouse.com_content_ongoing-2Dnotifications&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=HriQl0AtqhneOCX78ArvY9FhdMtG1Yj49SqcFJNGU4Y&e</a>= . But, not for TM Claims Notices or for Sunrises.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Agree we should Phil<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Michael, generally yes as long as the specific policy recommendations don't wander too much into implementation details. For example, a policy recommendation could say "a reasonable time frame" and then it will be for the Implementation Review Team (if the policy is adopted) to work out, operationally and technically, what that time period will be. Does that help?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Checkmark to agree, hand to queue.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:Why not do a green check mar kv red check mark instead of raising hands<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Set deadline for all proposals -- only then discuss towards decision.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Paul +1 <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Yes, we should use red and green symbols as provided by Adobe chat<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Georges Nahitchevansky:Agree should vote agree or disagree with re d and green symbols<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Here's Kathy's proposal, for easy reading outside Adobe: <a href="http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rpm-wg/2017-April/001320.html">http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/gnso-rpm-wg/2017-April/001320.html</a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Phil - when will the other positions to Kathy's be available?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary -- Okay, so directing specific changes of policy practices are part of Charter. Implementation of policy practice change not part.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Yes, clarification on scope is key<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Georges Nahitchevansky:Discussing one proposal before seeing the other proposals colors the entire process and starts an intial mental framework, so I urge that a date be set as has been suggested and then all proposals considered<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Agree with Georges.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Phil - hard to vote without information - when will the other positions to Kathy's be available<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Paul, the suggested deadline is 7 days from now (19 April)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:We can jump to #3 on our agenda, perhaps?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:I think it would be a helpful guide for others looking to submit a proposal<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:CCT-RT<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Proposal: Hold off discussion of any proposal until after receipt of all proosals with deadline.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:From a quick count, looks almost even on the vote<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Sorry, NOT vote - straw poll!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> John McElwaine:@Greg +1<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Let's go for sound marks. :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Staff supports a consistent usage that the Working Group can define or clearly explain, without only relying on one jurisdictional definition.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:*6 to mute<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:There is no consensus to entertain proposal.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:"private chat is disabled by host"??<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(couldn't reply to a private message)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman: In that case, let's use this time on Statute and Treaty marks as wel.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:as well.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@George, that's happened before - normally logging off and on fixes that.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:I'm on tablet, so when I stop talking it echoes until i turn off the microphone.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Kathy +1<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Kathy, Statute and Treaty marks bleeds into the next question and I don't think it is good to spring that one us.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Keating:Sorry for being late<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Right, the IGO Article 6ter stuff, for example.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> David McAuley:also sorry for being late<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:We've been in the murky waters!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Colin O'Brien:+1 Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:I think that discussing GI's should have Massimo Vittori on the call.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:Qusetions 7 and 8 are before us!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:He is part of the working group I believe.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Digital archery practice?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marie Pattullo:+1 to Lori<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:(as a use of our time).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Phil - thanks.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:All, please note that Deloitte has told us how they handle non-word marks (Q7) and "marks protected by statute or treaty" (which may cover Q8). The staff question for the WG after Copenhagen had been, what is the policy intent for the TMCH scope and does what is being accepted now into the TMCH go beyond that? We understood Phil's proposal was to discuss this.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:This is very usfeull, since different jurisdiction have different ways of addrssing this<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:for what I know, desing marks in the civil law tradition countries are usually called mixed marks<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:which are text marks that are represented in an specific figurative way (form+color)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:and are only protected in those desings<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:correct me if anyone knows better<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary: With apologies for being late to the "party" -- can you point me to materials/transcript where Deloitte describes their handling?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:I would like to speak to the economic efficiency of design marks and the need not to presume that the text portion of a design mark is always indistinct (to the exclusion of smaller businesses).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:I read an article yesterday about China becoming the dominant jurisdiction for IP soon. It'd be interesting to get their perspective, given they accounted for more than 50% of new gTLD registrations.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Martin -- Word and alphanumeric figures contained in mixed marks are also granted protection beyond the stylization unless "disclaimed"<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Martin: the answer to you questions is "it depends". The words and the stylization are protected.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/11/the-surprising-rise-of-china-as-ip-powerhouse/<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Marks are always looked at on the whole. However some elements dominate others. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Michael, I will need to look up the dates of the meetings but will do so.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Deloitte's TMCH Guidelines describe how they handle marks that are not exclusively comprised of letters, numerals or words.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:+1 Greg - would be good to develop a definitions list to harmonize all the ways that various trademark offices refer to design marks<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:so if I register "Martinish" in a certain font and in red I can exclude other to use "Martinish" regarldes of the desing they are using?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Paul Please do address this point. Most small businesses that develop a logo with words in the US are counseled that registraiton of a design mark/logo containing the words will protect both the Design Mark and the Words. If the words are not STRONG trademarks on their own, they receive proportional protection.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Phil - the mark may be older<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Martin, in the US you can.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:@graham<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:as long as Martinish doesn't have any other meaning<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Vinzenz Heussler:I may be able to protect a stylised mark but not the letters on its own<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:thkns Lori<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:adias is a bad example. this is usually a problem from small to medium enterprises.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:or I should says as long as Martinish is distinctive on its own<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Phil - the mark may be older<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:if Martinish is a common term that describes your goods or services that is a different story<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Rebecca L Tushnet:Are there a lot more small businesses in the TMCH than big ones?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:@Phil - a lot of brand owners, especially small businesses or individuals, can only budget for one application - and they choose the design form to try to protect both words and design.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:But, the "standard character claim" would be marked "yes" for those, right?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Marina -- Exactly.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Even big trademark owners may opt to register distinctive words with designs if they are registering in mutliple jurisdictions or multiple classes to reduce cost<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:@Rebecca - the TMCH was designed to protect all businesses, not just large ones.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Rebecca, there is no way to tell even if you saw all the TM records in the TMCH.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:@Rebecca - not sure why that question is relevant?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:I have certainly put smaller clients' marks in the TMCH.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Not that the question is relevant....<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:But nothing wrong with being informative.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:I represented a small business that had several TMCH filings<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Charities also use the TMCH<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:it depends on the reach of the market and the challenge a particular business or charity has with squatting<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Rebecca: Would it matter whether there were more small businesses or large in the TMCH? Across the board, smaller businesses that wish to protect their trademarks have a higher proportional cost than large companies. But consumers need to be protected regardless.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Is there agreement that a mark comprised of text (words, letters, numerals, punctuation, keyboard signs) may be a mark, but is not a "design mark" even if it is a stylized version of the word?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:+1 J Scott. We need to have clear definitions.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary: I would agree with you. My practice is even to refer to them as "WORD and Design" marks.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:We want to protect the Stronger marks. But, we don't have a clear definition of "strong" marks (and some want to squeak weak marks into the database).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marie Pattullo:Thanks for this Michael - "Across the board, smaller businesses that wish to protect their trademarks have a higher proportional cost than large companies. But consumers need to be protected regardless". + as many 1s as permitted.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:I think we deffintly need deloiite deffinition on this, we can't really discuss if each one has a different understanding. I don0t care which is the meanaing as log as we all know what it is.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Martin -- +1<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:is not bad faith<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:on the contrary, I am traying to build good faith!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:"Stylized" is being conflated with "Design" Its not the same<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:Tx you, J. Scott. History and background are important.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Correct Phil. Words are protected.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:+1 Paul<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Monica Mitchell:sorry<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Terri Agnew:@Monica, I don't see your mic active or on the telephone<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Paul, yes, it is not the same thing as we (staff) understood this discussion. A stylized word is still a text mark - I think that's what Deloitte goes by as well. By "design mark" they/we mean devices and logos and the like (not stylized text).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Terri Agnew:to activate your mic, top tool bar select the telephone icon and follow the prompts. To join on the telephone let me know if a dial out is needed<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Monica Mitchell:just found the answer ... sorry <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:@Martin: Deloitte's TMCH Guidelines can be found here: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.trademark-2Dclearinghouse.com_sites_default_files_files_downloads_TMCH-2520guidelines-2520v1.0-2520-5F1.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=L03PIKl0v4RlDkfjHtVioSvnyGThtArdMePuLxSzamc&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.trademark-2Dclearinghouse.com_sites_default_files_files_downloads_TMCH-2520guidelines-2520v1.0-2520-5F1.pdf&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=L03PIKl0v4RlDkfjHtVioSvnyGThtArdMePuLxSzamc&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Susan Payne:aplogies for joining late - overrunning prior meeting<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:One of the most important things the Policy & Implementation Working Group did to aid its deliberations -- and it carried through to our proposals -- was to identify TERMs we were using in our discussion and the develop and agree to specific DEFINITIONS that we stuck to in our discussions and proposals. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:https://www.uspto.gov/trademarks-getting-started/trademark-basics/representation-mark<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Can I propose that we establish a continuing working team to do that for this PDP going forward?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marie Pattullo:Fully support Paul's comments re SMEs.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:thnks Amr<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kristine Dorrain - Amazon Registry Services:Lots of active participation this week. I have to drop for a conflict but will pick up on the rest of the call later. See you all next week.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:The TMCH Guidelines specifically address the topic of a mark that is not entirely text. Deloitte's rule is that it is considered identical to the TM record if the words/numerals/letters/signs are predominant in the mark AND are clearly separable and distinguishable from the design element.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:doesn0t that gives too much power to delloite? <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Thanks, Mary. That seems appropriate.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Georges Nahitchevansky:Here is USPTO link on standard, stylized and design marks: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.uspto.gov_trademarks-2Dgetting-2Dstarted_trademark-2Dbasics_representation-2Dmark&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=-Di6r8jig1apTU-VL70XJqzNWmaKog0cyWoLCgw37Lw&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.uspto.gov_trademarks-2Dgetting-2Dstarted_trademark-2Dbasics_representation-2Dmark&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=-Di6r8jig1apTU-VL70XJqzNWmaKog0cyWoLCgw37Lw&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:it might create broader domain name protectio that ana trademark gives<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:Agree Paul.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Keating:That exact problem arises often in a UDRP context.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Martin: It shouldn't.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Susan Payne:There has also been at least one UK TM decision which said you must regiser in the form that you use - ie not as plan text. Further, the advice I routinely received from Chinese TM attorneys is that this is a requirement in China. So we must acknowlede the fact that not every country's law and practice is the same as that of the US. Something which is perpetually forgotten in ICANN land<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Martin, I think that treatment is consistent with the current state of TM protection. (Putting aside the disclaimer issue.)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:In a UDRP , the panelist will review the TM registration or the common law claim and make a determination based on the totality of the circumstances <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:With great respect, I don't agree Paul.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:TMCH costs $120/yr. Over 10 years, that's $1200. So, it's NOT small businesses signing up for the TMCH, given they paid less than that at the USPTO.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary -- Useful, but the wording "if the words/numerals/letters/signs are predominant in the mark AND are clearly separable and distinguishable from the design element." needs to be clarified I think.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:I think the key point is whether a trademark includes "literal elements", regardless of font, stylization, color, or additional design. ("Literal elements" is the term employed by the USPTO in this context.) Since the TMCH is designed to match to a literal element, this would seem to be where I focus should lie.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:Small businesses, and especially entrepreneurs, will be hurt.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Excellent Points from Susan Payne.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:With great respect, I agree with Paul.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:USPTO TM Fees: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.uspto.gov_learning-2Dand-2Dresources_fees-2Dand-2Dpayment_uspto-2Dfee-2Dschedule-23Trademark&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=SrXvKJ_c6ROp4rH4-yjojeN1hxZIQPHppIvkAUx6j4I&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.uspto.gov_learning-2Dand-2Dresources_fees-2Dand-2Dpayment_uspto-2Dfee-2Dschedule-23Trademark&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=SrXvKJ_c6ROp4rH4-yjojeN1hxZIQPHppIvkAUx6j4I&e</a>= Fees<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Thanks for reading that into the record, Phil. Staff hopes that's a helpful guide to this discussion.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Phil/Mary -- Problem for me is what is "predominant"?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Steve Levy:Sorry but I've got to jump onto the audio-only line for the remainder of this call<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Michael G - agree - sounds like Deloitte is re-examining marks. Yikes<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Marina -- Good point. Would be useful to check INTA or other Global Rules listings to see what variants there may be.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:There are a vast number of USPTO TM registrations owned by SMBs and individuals.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Yes, "predominant" could be a fuzzy concept.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Michael, if it helps, Deloitte has a Dispute Resolution Process where incorrect acceptances into the TMCH can be challenged: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.trademark-2Dclearinghouse.com_dispute&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=SHzgbgUvCEUwXsHtiBIv815XK16Xd9v2QSsxf6vuSDg&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.trademark-2Dclearinghouse.com_dispute&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=SHzgbgUvCEUwXsHtiBIv815XK16Xd9v2QSsxf6vuSDg&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Paul -- That's my concern as well -- my understanding is that Deloitte wanted rules that avoided it examining these.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:Have we asked Deloitee if any chanllegnes habve been filed? And, if so, how many?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:4.2 in the Deloitte Guidelines<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@J Scott, if I recall correctly, Deloitte's written response to the WG's initial questions was no. As of Jan 2017, the only disputes they had received was about TM owners not agreeing with Deloitte's verification. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary -- I presume our goal in this regard would be to ensure that challenges are the exception since the rules are appropriate to "real world" practice.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:Kathy. You need to review Susan Payne's email.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:Kathy. That is a huge assumption.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Kathy - we do a lot of pro bono work for non-profits and small entrepreneurs who will not be able to get coverage for their designs if they have to choose to spend their money on text alone marks in order to be allowed to participate in ICANN<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:I practiced for 13 yaars and routinely advised clients that were cost-concious to file one application for a design or composite mark.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:I'm with J Scott. That is not the advice that I have learned to give in 30 years of trademark practice.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:So it seems that 2 basic questions for the Working Group are: (1) is a mark comprised entirely of stylized text considered a word mark? (2) does the concept of "word mark only" exclude all marks that are device/logo plus text (even where the text part is disclaimed)?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:You can pick "Clear Status" to remove the hand/checkmark.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):colours ... are used sometimes (in case of Russia, few Telcos from one holding registered same image with different colours as different trademarks, for example), but I wonder how it should be reflected in TMCH ?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Rebecca - the same thing was happening to me. I think we have to "clear status" first to get rid of the green checkmark and then the hand being raised will work<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> John McElwaine:Many countries apparently require "a depiction" of the mark with no distinction between text, stylization or included designs. I repeat that we are being too U.S. centric in this analysis.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:+1 Rebecca<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:exactly!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:@rebecca. that is not true. You are misstating the law in the US at least.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:This is basic stuff.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):how to reflect RGB palette in TMCH?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Martin Silva:+1<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):to properly reflect the colour?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Rebecca -- Please provide cases supporting "weaker" protection statement for stylized word registered marks. I'll take a look for protection of both in the US.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:@Maxim: combine it with the TLD, e.g. mark.red, mark.black, etc. :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:What if the registered trademark is "logo plus word" and the word is not disclaimed, i.e. it is protected as part of the whole mark? Should that be accepted or rejected by the TMCH?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Georges Nahitchevansky:Rebecca you are wrong on the scope of protection afforded in the US on stylized marks<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:@rebecca. Second, also. The same argument cand be made to small or medium enterprises or civil liberatarians. Go get a cheap trademark and register it in the clearinghous.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(Afilias has a bunch of colour TLDs)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> John McElwaine:@mary good point<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Rebecca, that's wrong about PARENTS unless the word has been disclaimed (which in that case, it was).'<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:Tradearmarks are communicted by word of mouth. So, sound alike is very important -- even in design marks and stylized marks.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):@George ... the wors thing is green ... most browsers use green when proper TLS, SSL used .. so all owners of proper certificates will be violate it ... :)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):*worst<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Phil -- Good point as to different jurisdictional practices.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:@Rebecca - I didn't understand your comment about needing to file all over the world. Even filing in 1 jurisdiction for multiple marks can be daunting to a small business or non-profit<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Kathy Kleiman:@Phil, we have seen no examples of this issue. It would be good to do so.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Otherwise, there's massive jurisdiction shopping.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):@George +1 ... <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Google with their Tonga TM, to get priority date for "Alphabet", so even the big companies do it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Rebecca L Tushnet:PARENTS--the word was not in fact disclaimed.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(Instafile jurisdictions)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Rebecca L Tushnet:Because disclaimer is optional.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:@Rebecca. I agree with you earlier comment that disclaimer practice is inconsitent. Sometimes it is optional, but not always. Making an absoute statement is incorrect.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):@Mary Is it possible not to use small size of the chat history?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:Given domains are worldwide should there be a requirement for TM registrations in a minimum number of different jurisdictions to gain entry into the TMCH? <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Rebecca L Tushnet:In re National Data Corp.United States Court of Appeals, Federal Circuit.January 30, 1985 753 F.2d 1056The absence of a disclaimer does not, however, mean that a word or phrase in a registration is, or has become, distinctive in the registered mark, so that that part of the mark must be treated the same as an arbitrary feature. The power of the PTO to accept or require disclaimers is discretionary under the statute, supra note 5, and its practice over the years has been far from consistent.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Words subject to disclaimer in Stylized or Design marks should not be registrable in TMCH -- Agree.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:@Rebecca - I don't understand your comments on disclaimers being optional. Yes, an applicant has the option of proactively entering a disclaimer before being required to do so during examination - but once an Examining Attorney refuses registration unless a term is disclaimed, that would seem to eliminate the "optional" aspect of disclaimer practice. Can you please clarify?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Cross-talk.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Terri Agnew:finding the line<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Rebecca L Tushnet:Optional for the PTO, you're right, not for the registrant when demanded by the PTO if not argued out of it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:I don't see why we talkiing about disclaimers since the EUTM doesn't use them and many other jurisdictions do not.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Again, if staff may summarize, perhaps where there IS a disclaimer for the text part of a device mark then that text/word shouldn't go into the TMCH (per Susan Payne), but we cannot draw the same conclusion the other way when there is no disclaimer?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Perhaps instead of a black/white binary 0-1, there needs to be a scoring system from 0-100, e.g. 100 equals Verizon, Exxon, 0 = figurative mark for "CARS", and develop a points system.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Kind of like the Canadian immigration points system. :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:How do you make the "score" objective?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:@Mary -- I would agree with your distinction.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(or the points system for Community Applications for new gTLDs, as a precedent)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):fruit companies might object<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:@Lori: right, it'd be a tough job, but avoid the "binary" choices.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Just thinking out loud, outside the box.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:that seems like re-examination to me but I get your point George.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):unfortunately community eveluation failed ... ony rich communities prevailed :)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:only a re-examinination in some jurisictions <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:It'd need to be mechanical, some robotic algorithm. (that would also lower the cost). Feed it into an AI system. :-)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:A valid mark is a valid mark, so strength is not particularly germane in our discussions.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:+1 Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marina Lewis:+1 Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Public comments to the CCT Review Team Draft Report closes on 27 April: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_public-2Dcomments_cct-2Drt-2Ddraft-2Dreport-2D2017-2D03-2D07-2Den&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=Z3SGcjmQeXCcjlvUa5nIqx78HFdXWLxx9sqrbQYYsyQ&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.icann.org_public-2Dcomments_cct-2Drt-2Ddraft-2Dreport-2D2017-2D03-2D07-2Den&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=Z3SGcjmQeXCcjlvUa5nIqx78HFdXWLxx9sqrbQYYsyQ&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:Thanks Phil!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Lori Schulman:Yes, INTA has completed the study and is compiling the data now.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:For CCT-RT #10, a simple/obvious solution would be to charge less (say 50% off registry fees) if the domain name is registered, but has no nameservers. Defensive domains could then be removed from the zone file, not resolving. This should apply to all (including .com, legacy TLDs).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Column 1 is the recommendation, Column 2 the rationale provided by the CCT-RT<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:But, not just for "large brandowners" -- do it for everyone.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:But, if the name resolves (e.g. wwwbrand.com redirects to <a href="http://www.brand.com">www.brand.com</a>), that is in the zone file, and would be charged a normal price.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:(its defensive, but delivering value to the owner)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:So next WG meeting will be 26 April; no meeting on 19 April<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:I am going to need to jump soon. Thanks to everyone for their great participation today.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:If we can get Deloitte's answers before the 19th, it'll inform our proposals.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Marie Pattullo:Would still advocate any proposal being sent to the full list, please.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Not sure what to propose, until seeing that.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:@Paul. We have co-chairs call on 4/21 and that should result in an agenda for the WG by the end of that day for our 4/26 call.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:UTC 14:00 for sunrise and UTC 16:00 for claims.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Do we have lists of who is in both sub teams (or all 3)?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:Could we all get calendar invites for all of these subgroups? It would be good to know who is meeting when.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:@Greg: yes, they've been posted on the wiki pages for the Sub Teams. Please check the 3 pages. Links coming up.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:Thursday 27 April 0300 UTC (Weds night for North America)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:Members of Sunrise ST: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_nMrRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=L9vPjMKkLkl0Uhu9qQiMYRgG0BFuenqmsn5J2sGolxs&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_nMrRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=L9vPjMKkLkl0Uhu9qQiMYRgG0BFuenqmsn5J2sGolxs&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> George Kirikos:Bye folks.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:Members of Claims ST: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_qMrRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=Y5sH1sJZJBxLu30Wly4PJDTLKMJoR_KHfmG3RjIfcF8&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_qMrRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=Y5sH1sJZJBxLu30Wly4PJDTLKMJoR_KHfmG3RjIfcF8&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:howmany APAC people responded to the poll?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul McGrady:Thanks all! Great call.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Greg Shatan:Bye all!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> J. Scott Evans:ciao<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Mary Wong:@Paul T, I can't recall off hand but there were a few<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Maxim Alzoba (FAITID):bye all<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Elizabeth Featherman:Thank you!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:Members of AVPMs: <a href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_tcrRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=sb6befKntFNKHDoH3NozTJ_qXAmaLFhThD9KsBY5_m4&e">https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_tcrRAw&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=DRa2dXAvSFpCIgmkXhFzL7ar9Qfqa0AIgn-H4xR2EBk&m=4TB9lvO5J7iGvk_BLj09acfAyTBXXVmW_un6ywxjhr4&s=sb6befKntFNKHDoH3NozTJ_qXAmaLFhThD9KsBY5_m4&e</a>= <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Michael R Graham:Thanks@<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Paul Tattersfield:thnaks Mary, bye all<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Amr Elsadr:Thanks all. Bye.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> Monica Mitchell:thank you<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></body></html>