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Peter,<br>
For one, it's a new idea. I had always been of the sense that we
were trying to correct the problems of "findability" for thin
registries, such as the broken links we were seeing between thin
registries and registrars, making it difficult to link easily
between them. Knowing to link between the registry and registrar and
actually executing that function is, I agree, a complicated task.<br>
<br>
Also, we noted that all future gTLD registries are Thick, and that
leaves .com and .net as real outliers.<br>
<br>
But never in our discussions, did I ever think we were changing the
systems for the existing thick gTLD registries. That is an entirely
new dimension to the Whois problem, takes us in a completely
different direction.<br>
<br>
I have to raise a flag. It's an entirely different solution. It's
policy. If you want me to raise the myriad of problems it might lead
to, and data protection issues, I would be happy to. But my fingers
are tired :-).<br>
<br>
All the best,<br>
Kathy<br>
<br>
<br>
Classification: UNCLASSIFIED<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:636771A7F4383E408C57A0240B5F8D4A333D642262@EMB01.dept.gov.au"
type="cite"><font
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><br>
Hello all,<br>
<br>
I've missed a lot of discussion on this overnight my time, so I
apologise if I've missed something that answers my question.<br>
<br>
The references to an ICANN database are confusing to me, and may
be part of the contention here.<br>
<br>
I had understood that we would recommend that ICANN create a
smart web portal for consumers that would effectively do a WHOIS
search for them. As I understood it, ICANN would not need to
make its own database, thereby avoiding some of the data
protection issues, and instead purely focus on the user
experience.<br>
<br>
Is this what others had understood?<br>
<br>
If so, does this address the concerns about scope - ie why
wouldn't ICANN provide a comprehensive search tool for all
gTLDs?<br>
<br>
Please let me know if I've got this wrong.<br>
<br>
Cheers<br>
<br>
Peter<br>
</font><br>
<br>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<font
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""><b>From</b>:
Susan Kawaguchi [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:susank@fb.com">mailto:susank@fb.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent</b>: Thursday, December 01, 2011 03:27 AM<br>
<b>To</b>: James M. Bladel <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jbladel@godaddy.com"><jbladel@godaddy.com></a>; Emily
Taylor <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:emily@emilytaylor.eu"><emily@emilytaylor.eu></a>
<br>
<b>Cc</b>: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rt4-whois@icann.org">rt4-whois@icann.org</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:rt4-whois@icann.org"><rt4-whois@icann.org></a>
<br>
<b>Subject</b>: Re: [Rt4-whois] Centralized Whois Query system
run by ICANN - Scope and concerns
<br>
</font> <br>
</div>
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I
agree that we should not try and answer all the questions
but I was under the impression that the centralized WHOIS
was only targeting .com and .net to solve the problem of
having to search for the correct registrar out of the almost
1000 possible.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I
do not agree to include all gtlds.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rt4-whois-bounces@icann.org">rt4-whois-bounces@icann.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:rt4-whois-bounces@icann.org">mailto:rt4-whois-bounces@icann.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>James M. Bladel<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, November 30, 2011 8:21 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Emily Taylor<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rt4-whois@icann.org">rt4-whois@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Rt4-whois] Centralized Whois Query
system run by ICANN - Scope and concerns<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">No,
I don't think we should attempt to answer these questions
in RT4, nor presume that we have even identified all of
the dependent questions.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
believe our recommendation should task the Board, within a
reasonable timeframe (90 days?), to request an issues
report on a Centralized WHOIS system for all gTLDs,
including how it should be operated and what measures
would be adopted to protect against abuse / privacy
violations / data harvesting.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">(This
will initiate a PDP which, while slower, will be a more
comprehensive approach)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
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id="replyBlockquote">
<div id="wmQuoteWrapper">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black">--------
Original Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [Rt4-whois] Centralized Whois Query system
run by ICANN -<br>
Scope and concerns<br>
From: Emily Taylor <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:emily@emilytaylor.eu">emily@emilytaylor.eu</a>><br>
Date: Wed, November 30, 2011 10:15 am<br>
To: "James M. Bladel" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:jbladel@godaddy.com">jbladel@godaddy.com</a>><br>
Cc: Kathy Kleiman <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>>,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rt4-whois@icann.org">rt4-whois@icann.org</a><br>
<br>
Hi James<br>
<br>
Thanks for raising these points. Can you suggest some
language which you think would work? Also, Kathy raised
a good point about whether this is limited to thin
registries (.com, .net) or all? I don't think we've
ever discussed this.
<br>
<br>
Kind regards<br>
<br>
Emily<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black">On
30 November 2011 16:06, James M. Bladel <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:jbladel@godaddy.com" target="_blank">jbladel@godaddy.com</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
don't oppose this recommendation, but my issue
with this is that we are once again being too
vague in what we're asking.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">ICANN:
Who? Staff? The Board? The GNSO? Contracted 3rd
party?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Set
up: How? By launching a PDP? Sending out an
RFP?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Deadline?
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Are
we confident that this group has considered all of
the consequences to privacy, security, access,
SLAs, etc.? (Reasons why a PDP can be more
helpful for things like this...)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Thanks--<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><br>
J.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black">--------
Original Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [Rt4-whois] Centralized Whois Query
system run by ICANN -<br>
Scope and concerns<br>
From: Kathy Kleiman <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:kathy@kathykleiman.com"
target="_blank">kathy@kathykleiman.com</a>><br>
Date: Wed, November 30, 2011 9:56 am<br>
To: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rt4-whois@icann.org"
target="_blank">rt4-whois@icann.org</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black"><br>
<br>
All,<br>
Is this the current version of the Lutz
proposal now in circulation? I <br>
thought it applied only to a centralized
database of the current "thin <br>
registries," namely .COM and .NET. If so, I
can see the advantages and <br>
support sending it out as a recommendation
in the draft report.<br>
<br>
But if this is a single database of all
registries, thick and thin, now <br>
and in the future, I think we creating a
database problem. It's an <br>
enormous amount of data and creates a focal
point for abuse, for <br>
warehousing, etc. It's the type of policing
job that ICANN has never had <br>
to do, and is not operationally set up to
do.<br>
<br>
So thought summary: If ICANN is helping
remedy a bad situation by <br>
operating a single registry for .COM and
.NET to fix a historical <br>
problem, I think I am OK for now (pending
review of the draft with <br>
registries -- after publication is fine).
One database of all Whois <br>
information to Rule the World, not so good.<br>
<br>
RECOMMENDATION EDIT:<br>
<br>
Detailed recommendation:<br>
ICANN should set up a dedicated,
multilingual website to allow<br>
"unrestricted and public access to accurate
and complete WHOIS<br>
information" **FOR .COM AND .NET, THE
EXISTING "THIN REGISTRIES"** even for those
people which have problems with the plain<br>
WHOIS protocol.<br>
<br>
The WHOIS information should be collected by
following the thin WHOIS<br>
approach starting at <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://whois.iana.org"
target="_blank">whois.iana.org</a>. The
service should display the<br>
contractural relationships which are
revealed by the WHOIS referals in<br>
a clear and understandable way. The results
should be mark clearly the<br>
relevant information "including registrant,
technical, ** DELETE BILLING** billing, and<br>
administrative contact" data.<br>
<br>
** NOTE: Billing data, which includes credit
cards Folks, is simply not <br>
displayed in any other Whois search results.
It is only registrant, <br>
technical, and admin contact.**<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
Kathy<br>
<br>
<br>
> Proposal:<br>
><br>
> Summary:<br>
> ICANN should set up and maintain a web
interface to access<br>
> all the WHOIS services in order to ease
access to the WHOIS data.<br>
><br>
> Presumption:<br>
> The AoC requires that "ICANN implement
measures to maintain timely,<br>
> unrestricted and public access to
accurate and complete WHOIS information,<br>
> including registrant, technical,
billing, and administrative contact<br>
> information."<br>
><br>
> Observation:<br>
> An User Insight Report came up with the
following results:<br>
> + Almost nobody is aware of whois<br>
> + Almost nobody is able to query a
whois server correctly<br>
> + Whois queries were done on websites
which occur first in the search<br>
> engine results. Usually those pages are
overloaded with advertisments.<br>
><br>
> Detailed recommendation:<br>
> ICANN should set up a dedicated,
multilingual website to allow<br>
> "unrestricted and public access to
accurate and complete WHOIS<br>
> information" even for those people
which have problems with the plain<br>
> WHOIS protocol.<br>
><br>
> The WHOIS information should be
collected by following the thin WHOIS<br>
> approach starting at <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://whois.iana.org"
target="_blank">whois.iana.org</a>. The
service should display the<br>
> contractural relationships which are
revealed by the WHOIS referals in<br>
> a clear and understandable way. The
results should be mark clearly the<br>
> relevant information "including
registrant, technical, billing, and<br>
> administrative contact" data.<br>
><br>
> The server needs to be run by ICANN
itself, because the "timely,<br>
> unrestricted and public access" is
usually rate limited, stripped or even<br>
> blocked by the various WHOIS server
administrators for uncontractual<br>
> third party access. ICANN itself is the
only party having the power to<br>
> overcome those limits using its
contratual compliance.<br>
>
_______________________________________________<br>
> Rt4-whois mailing list<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Rt4-whois@icann.org"
target="_blank">Rt4-whois@icann.org</a><br>
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href="https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/rt4-whois"
target="_blank">https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/rt4-whois</a><br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
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