[technology taskforce] At-Large use of Group Chat applications - what's your take?

Dev Anand Teelucksingh devtee at gmail.com
Tue Mar 14 06:29:13 UTC 2017


Thanks for this Anivar. Reading
https://techcrunch.com/2016/09/19/riot-wants-to-be-like-slack-but-with-the-flexibility-of-an-underlying-open-source-platform/,
it seems that Riot is relatively new to the chat scene and adopted by
developers, judging from https://riot.im/app/#/directory

Do you think its user friendly enough?  Perhaps you can show this on a
TTF session.

There's a interesting graph of the various chat solutions out there:
https://cdn.sameroom.io/chat-timeline.pdf which shows the explosion of
chat servers in the past few years and the scene is certainly not
going to be static. I see for example, Google has posited Hangouts to
be a Slack competitor
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/03/google-is-turning-hangouts-into-a-slack-competitor/

Dev Anand






On Mon, Mar 13, 2017 at 9:40 PM, Anivar Aravind <anivar at indicproject.org> wrote:
> Hi Dev
>
> I understand th concerns are no hosting , easy for Public participation &
> chat history preservation
>
> The option I like to suggest testing  is matrix.org and its clients like
> Riot
>
> Matrix is an open standard for decentralised communication, providing simple
> HTTP APIs and open source reference implementations for securely
> distributing and persisting JSON over an open federation of servers.
>
> You can use Matrix for…
>
> Decentralised Group Chat - Fully distributed persistent chatrooms with no
> single points of control or failure
>
> WebRTC SignallingWeb  -friendly signalling transport for interoperable VoIP
> and video calling
>
>  Internet of Things  - Exchanging and persisting data between devices and
> services
>
> and anywhere else you need a common data fabric to link together fragmented
> silos of communication.
>
> In our Organization , we use IRC public rooms in freenode , but primarily
> connected using Riot clients  for web , Android and Ios.
>
> http://matrix.org/docs/projects/try-matrix-now.html
>
> This opens up participation room in a big way, and bring convenience on top
> of IRC
>
> any simple logging bot can log communication history. as in old days.
>
> There is no server involved .
>
> Anivar
>
> https://anivar.net
>
> https://twitter.com/anivar
>
>
> Anivar Aravind
> Executive Director
> Indic Project
> http://indicproject.org
> http://twitter.com/indicproject
>
> On Tue, Mar 14, 2017 at 6:16 AM, Raitme Citterio <rcitterio at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Greetings Dev
>>
>> I fully share the pros and cons of employing an opensource application
>> because of the potential risks involved.
>>
>> However the mattermost option seems basic and limited compared to slack.
>>
>> By the way, I would like to participate if possible in the slack group.
>>
>> A suggestion as a test could be the next test to broadcast the session on
>> Wednesday via streaming periscope using the following tool
>>
>> https://restream.io
>>
>> In combination with the following broadcast tool (OBS
>> https://obsproject.com)
>>
>> I think it would be an alternative to increase participation and open more
>> work sessions within ICANN to the community.
>>
>> If you need additional help for this experiment you can count on me.
>>
>> El 13 mar. 2017 4:02 PM, "Dev Anand Teelucksingh" <devtee at gmail.com>
>> escribió:
>>>
>>> Its very unlikely that ICANN will offer support (server resources,
>>> tech support) in the short term to deploy a self hosted solution like
>>> mattermost or Rocket.chat for ICANN At-Large Community. ICANN may be
>>> considering group chat solutions but given Slack export capabilities,
>>> it can be quite likely that conversations in Slack can be exported and
>>> imported into another group chat tool
>>>
>>> My copy and paste missed the last part of the text ...
>>>
>>> Dev Anand
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 13, 2017 at 12:53 PM, Dev Anand Teelucksingh
>>> <devtee at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > Dear All,
>>> >
>>> > I've been thinking (and tinkering) about group chat.
>>> >
>>> > I'm suggesting that the At-Large Community use the free tier Slack
>>> > version that we have at https://icannatlarge.slack.com/
>>> >
>>> > Key reasons why:
>>> >
>>> > - Its very unlikely that ICANN will offer support (server resources,
>>> > tech support) in the short term to deploy a self hosted solution like
>>> > mattermost or Rocket.chat for ICANN At-Large Community. ICANN may be
>>> > considering group chat solutions but given Slack export capabilities,
>>> > it can be quite likely that
>>> > - The challenge of a volunteer to deploy an open source solution for a
>>> > large number of users using their resources without payment and
>>> > support it to configure or fix things is too much and runs the risk of
>>> > a volunteer unable to fulfil such a task after valiantly starting and
>>> > the self hosted version goes down.
>>> > - from an end user perspective, Slack works. It has the key features
>>> > we want in group chat - threaded conversations, mobile apps, ability
>>> > to create public channels, private rooms, and direct messages, search
>>> > across channels.
>>> > - the free tier offers 10 integrations - I've integrated Twitter,
>>> > Skype, a translation tool, and an archive tool bot and was able to do
>>> > this using the browser. Just like any other cloud service.
>>> >
>>> > here's a screenshot of the Slack channels
>>> >
>>> > https://www.dropbox.com/s/xgka1gpxnhpwv24/ttf-icann58-slack-channels.png
>>> >
>>> > The approach I've done is to create channels for interests and wgs
>>> > that didn't neatly fit the interests  - I've used the Key Policy
>>> > issues of the At-Large Community
>>> >
>>> > https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1f81kugty0hulh/Policy-Issues-of-Interest-to-ICANN-At-Large.png
>>> > (this screenshot was from the O&E Community Onboarding presentations
>>> >
>>> > https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/At-Large+Community+Onboarding)
>>> >
>>> > - Slack content can be exported on a regular basis as a backup and
>>> > also for importing in any future group chat solution that could be
>>> > deployed/supported by ICANN
>>> > - I've also installed and configured this service which creates a
>>> > public archive of the Slack room -
>>> > http://icannatlarge.slackarchive.io/ so we can make our conversations
>>> > public facing
>>> > We can link to the conversations in a channel, for eg
>>> > http://icannatlarge.slackarchive.io/technologytaskforce or
>>> > http://icannatlarge.slackarchive.io/idn/page-1 to a specific message.
>>> > And in theory, I think it means that the search limit can be overcome.
>>> >
>>> > Thoughts? The TTF session is Wednesday
>>> >
>>> > Dev Anand
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Fri, Mar 10, 2017 at 2:59 AM, Chris Gift <chris.gift at icann.org>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >> Dev
>>> >>
>>> >> Thanks for this. It’s great stuff. I would also look at visibility,
>>> >> archiving, and data access – all core to our transparency and accountability
>>> >> mandates.
>>> >>
>>> >> Chris Gift
>>> >>
>>> >> On 3/9/17, 6:45 AM, "ttf-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org on behalf of
>>> >> Dev Anand Teelucksingh" <ttf-bounces at atlarge-lists.icann.org on behalf of
>>> >> devtee at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >>     ;-) which is what happens when I try to have too many drafts
>>> >> onscreen.
>>> >>
>>> >>     As I was saying, I do need feedback on what this group wants
>>> >> regarding
>>> >>     group chat applications
>>> >>
>>> >>     Some of my thoughts
>>> >>
>>> >>     - we use Skype for At-Large chat
>>> >>     However there are disadvantages of using Skype
>>> >>     - chat history is not preserved - a lot of At-Large discussions
>>> >> over
>>> >>     the years have already been lost as persons upgrade their machines
>>> >>     - conversations on various topics happens in one group so as
>>> >> multiple
>>> >>     persons chime in at different times, potential
>>> >> conversations/insights
>>> >>     on a particular topic/issue are lost in the one stream.
>>> >>     - no ability to search messages across all skype groups - one has
>>> >> to
>>> >>     remember what skype group a potential message was in to find it
>>> >>
>>> >>     QUESTION : Any other disadvantages to note?
>>> >>
>>> >>     - there are a myriad of group chat applications - Slack, Hipchat,
>>> >>     Rocket.chat, Mattermost
>>> >>
>>> >>     - all share common features
>>> >>          - creating public rooms or channels for groups and/or topics
>>> >>          - creating private groups not visible to persons outside of
>>> >> such groups
>>> >>          - mobile apps to get push notifications and to respond to
>>> >>     messages via mobile more effectively
>>> >>          - ability to search across all channels and rooms
>>> >>          - can be administered by staff to create/archive/delete
>>> >> rooms/channels
>>> >>           - staff/admins have more control to add/remove/invite
>>> >> persons
>>> >>          - allows for extensions/integrations so that different
>>> >> services
>>> >>     can be integrated (eg Twitter notifications to a channel, email to
>>> >> a
>>> >>     channel)
>>> >>
>>> >>     QUESTION: Any other core features to note?
>>> >>
>>> >>     Based on these core features, Group chat offers significant
>>> >> benefits than Skype
>>> >>     - potential for At-large community members to be added by Staff
>>> >> and
>>> >>     added to channels of their interest
>>> >>     - potential to reduce email overload
>>> >>     - ability to find messages and conversations when they have time
>>> >> and
>>> >>     new found interest to learn/participate more
>>> >>
>>> >>     QUESTION: Any other core benefits?
>>> >>
>>> >>     QUESTION - Are there any specific feature that makes a specific
>>> >> group
>>> >>     chat stand out in terms of which one should be picked?
>>> >>
>>> >>     QUESTION - What do we want to recommend for ALAC/ICANN as next
>>> >> steps?
>>> >>
>>> >>     Looking forward to comments
>>> >>
>>> >>     Dev Anand
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>     On Thu, Mar 9, 2017 at 10:02 AM, Dev Anand Teelucksingh
>>> >>     <devtee at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >>     > Dear All,
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > Here's the slides for the TTF session at ICANN58
>>> >>     >
>>> >> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__docs.google.com_presentation_d_1uAxM-5Fi9hUBV2ZtqsGe3nKk8C0CDkJDDrtUfLV8XjOwE_edit-3Fusp-3Dsharing&d=DwICAg&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=zS0x8pK8z0FnanGSXbXvoRVfpJzE1Xmo0ZZP9Gl3-rw&m=gFod0ez7zYcG_fvtwhex4-dIzXSyKaKPlrG2TPx7ij8&s=L3HxyXbLbVub6rdDAJkf8TTemqvxJRv8GSSluEytMYE&e=
>>> >>     > (editing link, no Google login required)
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > Still have work on Policy tracking and how At-Large should use
>>> >> group
>>> >>     > chat applications
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > Whilst I put together the policy tracking slides, I do need
>>> >> feedback
>>> >>     > on what this group wants
>>> >>     > regarding group chat applications
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > Some of my thoughts
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > - there are a myriad of group chat applications - Slack,
>>> >> Hipchat,
>>> >>     > Rocket.chat, Mattermost
>>> >>     > - all share common features
>>> >>     >      - creating public rooms or channels for groups and/or
>>> >> topics
>>> >>     >      - creating private groups not visible to persons outside of
>>> >> such groups
>>> >>     >      -
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > - Group chat applications have signf
>>> >>     >
>>> >>     > Re: Group chat applications,
>>> >>     _______________________________________________
>>> >>     ttf mailing list
>>> >>     ttf at atlarge-lists.icann.org
>>> >>     https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ttf
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ttf mailing list
>>> ttf at atlarge-lists.icann.org
>>> https://mm.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/ttf
>>
>>
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>


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