[tz] Maritime time zones

Steffen Daode Nurpmeso sdaoden at googlemail.com
Thu May 24 15:08:59 UTC 2012

"Tim Thornton" <tt at smartcomsoftware.com> wrote:

 |Maritime time zones are well defined - basically every 15 degrees but with
 |the odd wiggle in them - see

Thanks for the pointer.
My question to the German Navy was more like

  Es geht im speziellen um das Umfeld um (Territorialgewässer) und
  die Landungen auf unbewohnten Eilanden, für die aber ein gültiger
  ISO 3166 [6,7] Länderkode vorliegt (wie also z. B. DE und DEU für

Roughly a question about "territorial waters and landings on
uninhabited islands, especially those for which a valid ISO 3166
country code exists". 

  Was interessant wäre, ist, ob es (international) gültige
  rechtliche Regelungen gibt, nach denen in solchen Situationen
  verfahren wird.

I'm asking wether international laws exist which handle this
situation (i.e., which are to be obeyed).

 |They are identified by a letter, as shown in the above diagram.
 |They were created in the 1920s and I think are virtually unchanged since
 |Note that the nautical date line is different from the international date
 |Also, it uses GMT (i.e. UT1, not UTC) - I'm not sure if the tz database can
 |cope with this, or if the difference (< 1 second) is relevant for most tz

Well i hope the german navy gets that right - as far as i know the
new generation of ships (ordered about ten years ago say) uses
Microsoft software even on the bridge.

It's quite fascinating to read about the history of timezones.
Hundred years ago different times were in use just a few
kilometres from here!  I don't think humans changed that much,
but the technology did.

And now i've looked into http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Time
and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nautical_time.  The latter states

  A ship is required to adopt the standard time of a country when it
  is in its territorial waters, but must revert to nautical time as
  soon as it leaves territorial waters.

But no references, nowhere.

 |So they could be included in the TZ database if people feel this is good -
 |it would make the database more complete. Perhaps in a separate file, as
 |they are not associated with any of the continents?

Aquarius time, maybe.  I yet see no cities under water and such,
but the dutch, for example, already plan and build houses that
swim; they are in trouble pretty soon - but have the technology
to face it.
But i agree that landings on uninhabited islands are not really
related to this timezone database.



 |Smartcom Software Ltd
 |Portsmouth Technopole
 |Kingston Crescent
 |Portsmouth PO2 8FA
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 |Smartcom Software is a limited company registered in England and Wales,
 |registered number 05641521.
 |-----Original Message-----
 |From: tz-bounces at iana.org [mailto:tz-bounces at iana.org] On Behalf Of Steffen
 |Daode Nurpmeso
 |Sent: 24 May 2012 13:52
 |To: Sascha Wildner
 |Cc: tz at iana.org
 |Subject: Re: [tz] time zone abbreviations - uniqueness and meaning
 |"Sascha Wildner" <saw at online.de> wrote:
 | |On Thu, 24 May 2012 12:11:32 +0200, Tobias Conradi
 ||<tobias.conradi at gmail.com> wrote:
 | |
 | |> was: Re: [tz] Propose new zone for Crozet Islands  |  |How about just
 |working out all your little "proposals" privately and  |posting a _patch_ to
 |tzdata* like it is good practice?
 | |I for one will subscribe to the announce list because I'm really getting
 ||tired of your seemingly endless, annoying dribble.
 |And i *don't* wanna do that, because there were really interesting topics
 |once in a while, and things good to learn about, and that's what it's about
 |for me.
 |And from what i know his last posts really revealed fuzzy stuff that could
 |be improved (or de-improved).  Here i'm with your first sentiment, though.
 |I in turn got response from the German Navy, the second.
 |Thanks to Herrn Kapitänleutnant Daub (Mr. Lieutenant Daub) and Herrn
 |Oberstabsbootsmann Jürgen Haak (Mr. Master Chief Petty Officer Juergen
 |For the German Navy:
 |  Wir können Ihnen hier lediglich Informationen darüber geben, wie
 |  die Schiffe/Boote der Marine es in der Praxis mit den Zeitzonen
 |  handhaben. So fahren diese in der Regel in den jeweiligen
 |  Zonenzeiten mit Erreichen des entsprechenden Gebiets.
 |  Sonderregelungen (z. B. während Manövern/Übungen) sind möglich
 |  und werden vorab bekanntgegeben.
 |So the germans basically agree with the post from the former Navy member
 |("normally local area time is used", "special arrangements are possible and
 |will be gazetted") if i recall correctly.
 |It was the "we have the better Kung-Fu" mail.  (And i was in doubt because
 |whoever has the better Kung-Fu actually didn't really understand what
 |Kung-Fu is about, but maybe it's simply a good job.  Sorry.)
 |  Möglicherweise kann Ihnen aber das Bundesamt für Seeschifffahrt
 |  und Hydrographie bezüglich der rechtlichen Regelungen Auskunft
 |  geben bzw.  zuständige Ansprechpartner benennen.
 |Yes, i didn't have had a clue and should of course have asked the Federal
 |Agency instead!
 |The question is - should i really do that?  Does it *really* matter what
 |timezone a ship uses regarding to the timezone database?  Maybe i have
 |mislead myself.  On the other hand i'll send another mail if some
 |international law actually exists (which is what i have asked for), for

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