<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">A response on Erich's last point:</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default"><span class="gmail-im" style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px"><blockquote style="border-style:none none none solid;border-left-width:1pt;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'times new roman',serif">WS2-HR should focus on the freedom of communication worldwide, subject to usual safeguard clauses + the international human rights treaty obligations.<u></u><u></u></p></blockquote><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'times new roman',serif"><u></u> <u></u></p></div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'times new roman',serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"></span><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif">This sounds suspiciously like "cherry-picking" (i.e., picking and choosing among human rights obligation), and I am firmly opposed to that. Also while human rights treaty obligations are relevant (and we need to determine what we are referring to as such)</span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"></span><span style="font-family:verdana,sans-serif"> they do not bind ICANN, except to the extent they have been adopted and codified by applicable laws. The Bylaw doesn't take us further than that.<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-size:12pt;font-family:'times new roman',serif"><u></u> <u></u></p></div></span><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:'times new roman',serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:rgb(31,73,125)">It is not cherry-picking, it is a suggestion which human rights are relevant to be considered. Free communication should be the main concern.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:'times new roman',serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:rgb(31,73,125)">You are right that human rights treaties formally do not bind ICANN but that sound not good in practice. We have to substitute this by self-commitment, as we do now.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:'times new roman',serif;font-size:12pt;margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11pt;font-family:calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><font color="#9900ff"><span style="font-size:14.6667px">We've been using the term cherry-picking to mean just that -- picking and choosing, menu-style, from the list of human rights and deciding that some are going to be considered and some won't. Whatever you call it, I'm opposed to it. I'm not opposed to choosing among human rights conventions and instruments; indeed, we must do that. But within, e.g., the UDHR, we should not be picking, we need to take it whole as a document. The extent of ICANN's commitment to human rights is stated in the Bylaw, -- to <u>respect</u> <u>internationally recognized human rights</u> <u>as required by applicable law</u></span></font><span style="font-size:14.6667px;color:rgb(153,0,255)">. This is critical in three ways: (1) ICANN's commitment is one of "respecting" (and not protecting or enforcing) human rights (and we need to define what "respect" means in the context of ICANN, which unfortunately does not align with Ruggie's idea of respect for business enterprises); (2) ICANN must look to "internationally recognized human rights" -- no more and no less; and (3) ICANN's commitment is limited to what is "required by applicable law." ICANN could go further of course (e.g., it could ensure there are gluten free food options at every ICANN meeting and event), but that is not a Bylaws issue and thus not a Framework of Interpretation issue.</span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span style="font-size:14.6667px;color:rgb(153,0,255)"><font face="verdana, sans-serif"><br></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><span style="font-size:14.6667px;color:rgb(153,0,255)"><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Greg</font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><br></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><font color="#9900ff" face="calibri, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:14.6667px"><br></span></font></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt"><font color="#9900ff" face="calibri, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:14.6667px"><br></span></font></p></div><div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px"><div class="gmail-adm"><div id="gmail-q_1576c82b6fdb5c99_13" class="gmail-ajR gmail-h4"></div></div></div></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 12:14 PM, Schweighofer Erich <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:erich.schweighofer@univie.ac.at" target="_blank">erich.schweighofer@univie.ac.at</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">My clarifications „inline“. Sorry for quick drafting and being unclear.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Erich Schweighofer<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">Von:</span></b><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Greg Shatan [mailto:<a href="mailto:gregshatanipc@gmail.com" target="_blank">gregshatanipc@gmail.<wbr>com</a>]
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<b>Gesendet:</b> D</span><span lang="DE" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">ienstag, 27. September 2016 17:35<br>
<b>An:</b> Schweighofer Erich<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Niels ten Oever; <a href="mailto:ws2-hr@icann.org" target="_blank">ws2-hr@icann.org</a><br>
<b>Betreff:</b> Re: [Ws2-hr] Proposed agenda meeting September 27 - 19:00 UTC<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">I agree in part and disagree in part:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Sep 27, 2016 at 6:05 AM, Schweighofer Erich <<a href="mailto:erich.schweighofer@univie.ac.at" target="_blank">erich.schweighofer@univie.ac.<wbr>at</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">...</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The more I read about Ruggie Principles I am convinced that they do not really fit for ICANN.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">I tend to agree with this.</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The hard legal core of ICANN's obligations is much less, even depending on the various jurisdictions.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">I'm not sure what this means. If it means that there are Ruggie obligations that don't fit ICANN, then I agree. Otherwise, this needs
further explanation.</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</span><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Yes – Ruggie do not fit properly. ICANN is essential for a global communication platform and must respect related human rights –the “hard core”,
subject to the interpretation in the various jurisdictions. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">ICANN is inclusive, e.g. also flexible. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">Again not sure what this means. If this means that ICANN must be inclusive of, e.g., New gTLD applicants and ccTLD operators (governments
and otherwise), whether or not they comply with human rights provision, then I agree. ICANN can't be a human rights filter for the Internet. If this means something else, it needs further explanation.
</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</span><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">It means that we cannot oblige new gTLD applicants or ccTLD operators to comply with human rights above the national interpretation of human rights
obligations. There are other fora to discuss compliance with human rights standards.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">WS2-HR should focus on the freedom of communication worldwide, subject to usual safeguard clauses + the international human rights treaty obligations.
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">This sounds suspiciously like "cherry-picking" (i.e., picking and choosing among human rights obligation), and I am firmly opposed to
that. Also while human rights treaty obligations are relevant (and we need to determine what we are referring to as such)</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""> they do not bind ICANN,
except to the extent they have been adopted and codified by applicable laws. The Bylaw doesn't take us further than that.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#1f497d">It is not cherry-picking, it is a suggestion which human rights are relevant to be considered. Free communication should be the main concern.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="color:#1f497d">You are right that human rights treaties formally do not bind ICANN but that sound not good in practice. We have to substitute this by self-commitment, as we do now.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB" style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">In an ethical code of ICANN, we can go much further, and here we can re-use Ruggie to some extent.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">An "ethical code of ICANN"</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">
is far, far beyond the mandate and scope of this subgroup. Our task is to provide a framework for interpreting the Bylaw.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">It is good to work on an idealistic world but we have to realistic, too.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">That I can agree with.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Best, Erich Schweighofer<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif"">Greg</span><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""></span><span style="font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif""><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----<br>
Von: <a href="mailto:ws2-hr-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">ws2-hr-bounces@icann.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:ws2-hr-bounces@icann.org" target="_blank">ws2-hr-bounces@icann.<wbr>org</a>] Im Auftrag von Niels ten Oever<br>
Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. September 2016 11:18<br>
An: <a href="mailto:ws2-hr@icann.org" target="_blank">ws2-hr@icann.org</a><br>
Betreff: [Ws2-hr] Proposed agenda meeting September 27 - 19:00 UTC<u></u><u></u></p>
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Dear all,<br>
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Please find underneath and attached the proposed agenda for the call of September 27, 19:00 UTC.<br>
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Comments and suggestions are welcome.<br>
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1. Administrivia<br>
Roll call, absentees, SoIs, etc<br>
2. Analysis of Ruggie Principles for ICANN - discussion on UN Guiding Principles 15, 13, 19 3. AOB<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
<br>
Niels<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Niels ten Oever<br>
Head of Digital<br>
<br>
Article 19<br>
<a href="http://www.article19.org" target="_blank">www.article19.org</a><br>
<br>
PGP fingerprint 8D9F C567 BEE4 A431 56C4<br>
678B 08B5 A0F2 636D 68E9<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
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