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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-GB link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><a name="_MailEndCompose"><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'>Hi Parminder,<o:p></o:p></span></a></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:windowtext'>“</span></span><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'>I have asked for immunity and/or shift to international law. In both these cases no nation will be able to use its legal system to unilaterally assert its own national interest over ICANN's working. I hope I make my position clear.</span></span><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:windowtext'>”</span></span><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'>Crystal.<o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'>Yes, every jurisdiction has pros and cons. Unfortunately the system of jurisdiction you suggest moving ICANN to is insufficiently robust or even developed. Moreover, I don</span></span><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:windowtext'>’</span></span><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'>t see anything remotely approaching global consensus on such a move nor even the desirability of such a move. As a thought experiment it is interesting and engaging but from a pragmatic, practical standpoint is it sorely lacking.<o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'>Best regards, <o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:16.0pt;font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'>John Laprise, Ph.D.<o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'>Consulting Scholar<o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'></span><a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/jplaprise/"><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:#0563C1'>http://www.linkedin.com/in/jplaprise/</span></span><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'></span></a><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span lang=EN-US style='font-family:"Garamond",serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'><o:p> </o:p></span></span></p><span style='mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose'></span><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:windowtext'> ws2-jurisdiction-bounces@icann.org [mailto:ws2-jurisdiction-bounces@icann.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>parminder<br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 19, 2017 10:54 PM<br><b>To:</b> Mueller, Milton L <milton@gatech.edu>; Paul Rosenzweig <paul.rosenzweig@redbranchconsulting.com><br><b>Cc:</b> 'ws2-jurisdiction' <ws2-jurisdiction@icann.org><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Ws2-jurisdiction] Blog post on ICANN's jurisdiction<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>On Sunday 19 February 2017 11:37 PM, Mueller, Milton L wrote:<br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Parminder said:</span><o:p></o:p></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><p>The travel bans make the simple but clear point that a nation will use its legal machinery for all purposes that it considers being in national interest, no matter if that rides roughshod over the interests of people from other countries. The many lessons from this for the issue of ICANN being under US jurisdiction are rather obvious.... <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>MM reply: It is obvious that your use of the indefinite article is correct: “a nation will use…” </span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><br>So, we agree here that US government can very plausibly be expected to use all existing or possible new laws, within its constitutional competence to make, to direct ICANN (aka interference with ICANN's policy processes) as its sees to be in US's national interest, which we all know cannot be supposed to fully conflate with global public interest.<br><br>BTW, do see the recent order of Trump administration which expressly says "<span style='font-size:11.0pt'> “Agencies shall, to the extent consistent with applicable law, ensure that their privacy policies <b><i>exclude </i></b>persons who are not United States citizens or lawful permanent residents from the protections of the Privacy Act regarding personally identifiable information.” (emphasis added)<br><br>Now, I know most national laws afford protection only to citizens but insisting on specifically excluding protections to non citizens looks like a overkill, but its the US gov's privilege, as we have been discussing.<br><br>In the circumstance, since this position , that US state can very plausibly interfere with ICANN's policy implementation, can a priori be established, we really do not need that questionnaire and its responses, (which has deliberately been specifically rigged to exclude such extremely justified a priori considerations) to work on solutions against such expected eventualities. Does this not logically follow from your agreement with my "indefinite article"? <br></span><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>That is, ANY nation will or might use. So moving jurisdiction out of the US does not change this problem in the slightest. Indeed, it could make it worse, as I can offhand think of 8-10 nations that would make it worse. I think this is the point you keep missing.</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><br>My deal Milton, I do not miss this point. I have never, and I have insisted on this point several times on this elist, asked for ICANN jurisdiction to be moved to another country from the US. I would consider any such demand to be disrespectful of the US, as much as I consider present ICANN's jurisdictional status to be disrespectful of all non US nations. Dont know why not just you but many others keep missing this point again and again. <br><br><br>best, parminder <br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Dr. Milton L. Mueller</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Professor, School of Public Policy</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Georgia Institute of Technology</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>