Re: [lac-discuss-es] At-Large: Parte del sector privado? Parte de la Sociedad Civil?

To: <lac-discuss-es@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [lac-discuss-es] At-Large: Parte del sector privado? Parte de la Sociedad Civil?
From: "Alberto Soto" <asoto@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 3 Sep 2015 00:47:08 -0300
Estimado Carlton, lamento tu equivocaciÃn, este es el cajÃn de manzanas, y has 
traÃdo peras.
Disculpas al resto de la lista.
Saludos cordiales

Alberto Soto

-----Mensaje original-----
De: lac-discuss-es-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:lac-discuss-es-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] En nombre de 
carlton.samuels@xxxxxxxxx
Enviado el: miÃrcoles, 2 de septiembre de 2015 4:19 p. m.
Para: lac-discuss-es@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
CC: lac-discuss-en@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; ALAC <alac@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Asunto: Re: [lac-discuss-es] At-Large: Parte del sector privado? Parte de la 
Sociedad Civil?


[[--Translated text (en -> es)--]]

 Asunto: Re: At-Large: Parte del sector privado? Parte de la Sociedad Civil? 
 De: carlton.samuels@xxxxxxxxx

 Alberto: 
 AquÃ estÃ, presumiblemente, citando la ley argentina: 


 '* En Argentina, la Ley de ProtecciÃn al Consumidor, dice en su artÃculo 1. 
Este  ley tiene por objeto proteger a los consumidores o usuarios. consumidor 
se considera a la  persona fÃsica o jurÃdica que adquiere o utiliza, de forma 
gratuita o por  consideraciÃn, bienes o servicios como un fin en sÃ mismos o 
para su  familia o grupo social. * 


 * AquÃ y en todo el mundo, el usuario final tiene dos defensores. Uno para 
cuando  tiene problemas con productos o servicios; y para defender sus 
intereses  dentro de ICANN. '* 


 Hubiera sido tan Ãtil si este bit de beca fue ejercida  perteneciente a la 
acusaciÃn en contra de Lance Hinds en las Ãltimas elecciones [en]  acciÃn en 
LACRALO. 


 Supongo que usted ve el ALS Iberoamericana como defensor de los consumidores y 
usuarios  los derechos de la ICANN, sÃ?


 AsÃ que ahora, en el derecho argentino, los consumidores y los usuarios son 
co-definidos y son 
 reconocidos como los dos &quot;personas naturales y jurÃdicas&quot;. Piense en 
la cantidad de dolor que 
 podrÃa haber salvado a nosotros mismos con una pequeÃa demostraciÃn de 
liderazgo? Usted 
 podrÃa haber salvado a todos nosotros de escuchar la opiniÃn de la dullard del 
mundo 
 que suelen enmascararse opiniÃn en cuanto informado en LACRALO. 


 Ese punto de vista de la dullard originÃ en Argentina me hace doblemente 
seguro de que 
 lo que ocurriÃ en esa elecciÃn fallida fue una conspiraciÃn y con apariencia 
de 
 ignorancia. 


 Ritz-Carlton Samuels 






 ============================== 
 Carlton Un Samuels 
 MÃvil: 876-818-1799 
 * Estrategia, PlaneaciÃn, Gobierno, EvaluaciÃn y plazos de entrega * 
 ============================= 


 El Lun, 31 de agosto 2015 a las 8:12 de la tarde, Alberto Soto 
<asoto@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
 escribiÃ: 


> Dear Alan, I did a semantic analysis, using the dictionary of the Royal
> Spanish Academy.
>
> Public Sector: all public organizations and agencies, organizations and
> companies subject to them.
>
> Private Sector: That is not public or state property, but belongs to
> individuals.
>
> Society: natural grouping of people agreed that unit are different from
> each of the individuals, in order to meet, through mutual cooperation, all
> or any of the purposes of life.
>
> Civil society, private sector, citizens and society relationships and
> private activities.
>
> In the Latin world, we have two large sectors: the public sector
> (government) and the (non-governmental) Private Sector. In the latter
> enters the civil society and non-governmental sectors all we know.
>
> This is quite consistent with the definition of the World Bank. Although I
> agree that it should include the end user.
>
> In Argentina, the Law on Consumer Protection says in his article 1. This
> law aims to protect consumers or users. consumer is considered to the
> natural or legal person who acquires or uses, free of charge or for
> consideration, goods or services as an end in themselves or for their
> family or social group.
>
> Here and all over the world, the end user has two defenders. One for when
> you have problems with goods or services; and we to defend their interests
> within ICANN.
>
> But in my opinion, again, the end user must appear as such when the
> components of civil society are described.
>
>
>
> Regards
>
>
>
> Alberto
>
>
>
> *De:* alac-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
> alac-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *En nombre de *Alan Greenberg
> *Enviado el:* lunes, 31 de agosto de 2015 12:59 p. m.
> *Para:* ALAC <alac@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> *Asunto:* [ALAC] At-Large: Part of the Private Sector? Part of Civil
> Society?
>
>
>
> These two questions seem to be coming up regularly. The current draft
> proposal of the CCWG-Accountability refers to ICANN being leg by the
> "Private Sector (as opposed to the Public Sector - Governments), and
> includes us in the Civil society part of the private sector.
>
> Looking at definitions can be useful. There are many of both terms.
>
> The most common definition of the Private Sector says it is everything
> that is not funded or controlled by government. Many definitions even
> explicitly list individuals as part of it. That certainly includes us.
>
> Some definitions talk about three groups, the public sector, the private
> sector (referring to for-profit organizations) and the "Voluntary Sector".
> The latter certainly includes the formal parts of At-Large, but really
> leaves individuals, who are no longer part of ANY of the sectors.
>
> From my perspective, that means that if we are part of the "Private
> Sector", we better be explicitly listed as such.
>
> I would appreciate hearing how these terms are defined in other languages
> and cultures.
>
>
> The Wikipedia defines Civil Society as "aggregate of non-governmental
> organizations and institutions that manifest interests and will of
> citizens." Civil society includes the family and the private sphere,
> referred to as the "third sector" of society, distinct from government and
> business.
>
> The World Bank has a more detailed definition: the term civil society to
> refer to the wide array of *non-governmental and not-for-profit
> organizations that have a presence in public life, expressing the interests
> and values of their members or others, based on ethical, cultural,
> political, scientific, religious or philanthropic considerations. Civil
> Society Organizations (CSOs) therefore refer to a wide of array of
> organizations: community groups, non-governmental organizations (NGOs),
> labor unions, indigenous groups, charitable organizations, faith-based
> organizations, professional associations, and foundationsÃâÂ.*
>
> In both definitions, Civil Society is listed as essentially being defines
> as groups of one form or another. By those definitions, At-large and our
> components parts are certainly civil society, but the individuals whose
> interests we defend are not part of civil society per se.
>
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>



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--]]




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