[CCWG-ACCT] [Acct-Legal] community powers comparison: designator & membership model - what powers can we create and how to enforce them?

León Felipe Sánchez Ambía leonfelipe at sanchez.mx
Thu Apr 16 01:08:16 UTC 2015


Dear Jordan,

Could you please confirm whether you will be needing the lawyers to attend your call on Friday?

Staff, if Jordan does confirm the need to invite the lawyers, could you please make sure they get the invitations with the call details?


Best regards,


León

> El 15/04/2015, a las 19:56, List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam <ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org> escribió:
> 
> Dear Leon and Jordan,
>  
> Could you please let us know if outside counsel is being asked to join the WP1 call on Friday referenced below, and if so, could you let us know the time of the call and arrange for an invitation to be sent to us?
> 
> Thanks,
>  
> TYLER HILTON
> Associate
> 
> Sidley Austin LLP
> +1.213.896.6130
> 
> thilton at sidley.com <mailto:thilton at sidley.com>
>  
>  
> From: ccwg-accountability5-bounces at icann.org [mailto:ccwg-accountability5-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam
> Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2015 4:01 AM
> To: ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org; Jordan Carter
> Cc: ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org; Accountability Cross Community
> Subject: Re: [Acct-Legal] [CCWG-ACCT] community powers comparison: designator & membership model - what powers can we create and how to enforce them?
>  
> Dear Leon and Jordan,  We should be able to have this ready within the next day or so and definitely prior to Friday's call.  Kind regards, Holly. 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent with Good (www.good.com <http://www.good.com/>)
>  
> From: ccwg-accountability5-bounces at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5-bounces at icann.org> on behalf of List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam
> Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2015 12:32:18 AM
> To: Jordan Carter
> Cc: ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org>; Accountability Cross Community
> Subject: Re: [Acct-Legal] [CCWG-ACCT] community powers comparison: designator & membership model - what powers can we create and how to enforce them?
> 
> Dear Holly and Rosemary, 
>  
> Would Jordan’s request be possible?
>  
>  
> Best regards,
>  
>  
> León
>  
> El 15/04/2015, a las 0:26, Jordan Carter <jordan at internetnz.net.nz <mailto:jordan at internetnz.net.nz>> escribió:
>  
> I know this is bold, but is there any chance a reviewed copy might be available for discussion in WP1 on Friday?
> 
> Many thanks
> Jordan
>  
> On 15 April 2015 at 17:00, List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam <ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org>> wrote:
> Dear Holly and Rosemary, 
>  
>  
> Please do review Robin’s table. I apologize for the delay on assignment and don’t expect you to have elaborated for our call tomorrow but rather give an initial review so we can further discuss in our call tomorrow.
>  
>  
> Best regards,
>  
>  
> León
>  
> El 14/04/2015, a las 16:42, List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam <ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org>> escribió:
>  
> Happy to review with direction from Legal Subteam.  Please provide direction ASAP. Holly
> 
> 
> 
> Sent with Good (www.good.com <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.good.com_&d=AwMF-g&c=Od00qP2XTg0tXf_H69-T2w&r=1-1w8mU_eFprE2Nn9QnYf01XIV88MOwkXwHYEbF2Y_8&m=L61uyQoMoLQNKeNS8IeUq8PGBHFxIbf8OsQyldAA_x8&s=LHjEeG-lgFP24N041IFPvPpBrLyEgzqw7SUm06JPFj4&e=>)
>  
> From: ccwg-accountability5-bounces at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5-bounces at icann.org> on behalf of List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam
> Sent: Tuesday, April 14, 2015 03:45:49 PM
> To: ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org>
> Cc: Accountability Cross Community
> Subject: Re: [Acct-Legal] [CCWG-ACCT] community powers comparison: designator & membership model - what powers can we create and how to enforce them?
> 
> Fantastic work Robin and much appreciated!
>  
> I echo Greg's comments concerning  the role of litigation in both models. I do like the format and I think it would be a great idea to have it reviewed and improved upon, if necessary, by counsel, for distribution to the general list.
>  
> Best,
>  
> Ed
>  
>  
> On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 8:19 PM, List for the work of CCWG-Accountability Legal SubTeam <ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org <mailto:ccwg-accountability5 at icann.org>> wrote:
> Robin,
>  
> Thank you for this.  A great deal of effort clearly went into this and this should develop into a very useful tool.  However, I think we will need to have this reviewed by legal counsel before we rely on it.  Having reviewed this briefly, I am uncertain that at this stage this document accurately captures the legal advice, particularly with regard to how the rights can be enforced.  
>  
> Specifically, this seems to give the impression that, if the membership model were chosen, the members would be limited to running off to court in most cases should rights need to be enforced.  I'm fairly confident that is not the case.  I believe that the remedies listed for the designator model, particularly changes to the bylaws and the IRP, are equally available in the member model.  With regard to litigation, I think the distinction is that the designators have no ability to litigate on behalf of the corporation, while this is one possibility (but far from the only one) available to members.  In other words, such litigation is an extra power, not the only power, available to members.
>  
> The Legal Sub Team (copied here) should discuss how to proceed.
>  
> Thank you again for taking the laboring oar in pulling this together!
>  
> Best regards,
>  
> Greg
>  
> On Tue, Apr 14, 2015 at 2:35 PM, Robin Gross <robin at ipjustice.org <mailto:robin at ipjustice.org>> wrote:
> Hello Team,
> 
> What we need to do is take a hard look at both the membership model and the designator model and understand what rights can be created and how will they be enforced.  Once we understand what we *can* do, we need to look at the pros/cons of the different models and evaluate accordingly.
> 
> But first, we need to understand what *can* be done so we can discuss *if* we ought to do it and what is the best means.
> 
> So I've taken a first pass of each of the 6 community empowerment goals and created a comparison table to lay-out what rights can be created and how they can be enforced.  I've combed through all the 200+ pages of legal memos, today's CCWG call, and calls of the legal sub-team to compile this info into one table so the models can begin to be evaluated side-by-side.
> 
> The doc is attached and also here is a link to the table comparing the 2 models:
>   https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kkkRBpMUkTpD5_RP_Ogo1PTGzGt2kC6f1xooHfJXRBc/edit?usp=sharing <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__docs.google.com_spreadsheets_d_1kkkRBpMUkTpD5-5FRP-5FOgo1PTGzGt2kC6f1xooHfJXRBc_edit-3Fusp-3Dsharing&d=AwMFaQ&c=Od00qP2XTg0tXf_H69-T2w&r=1-1w8mU_eFprE2Nn9QnYf01XIV88MOwkXwHYEbF2Y_8&m=nyDQdlri5xYHMimBihFhuPRDmv90jS4gFWrucTjoxrM&s=nn6UHsMF-YpzD09pBcaHOa5b41fXAi_G4BJGOV2NU4A&e=>
> 
> I am hopeful it can begin to help us to wrap our minds around what our goals are and how they could be accomplished by the two models at play.
> 
> Thanks,
> Robin
> 
> 
> 
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> -- 
> Jordan Carter
> 
> Chief Executive 
> InternetNZ
> 
> 04 495 2118 (office) | +64 21 442 649 (mob)
> jordan at internetnz.net.nz <mailto:jordan at internetnz.net.nz> 
> Skype: jordancarter
> 
> A better world through a better Internet 
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