[CCWG-Accountability] [Area 2] Work Streams definition

Thu Jan 15 16:26:36 UTC 2015

+1 from me too. I support Matthew's points...it's both.

From: accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org [mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of Burr, Becky
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2015 11:19 AM
To: Matthew Shears; Jordan Carter; Kavouss Arasteh
Cc: ccwg-accountability3; accountability-cross-community at icann.org; ccwg-accountability2 at icann.org; ccwg-accountability1 at icann.org; ianatransition at icann.org
Subject: Re: [CCWG-Accountability] [Area 2] Work Streams definition

+1

J. Beckwith Burr
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From: Matthew Shears <mshears at cdt.org<mailto:mshears at cdt.org>>
Date: Thursday, January 15, 2015 at 11:16 AM
To: Jordan Carter <jordan at internetnz.net.nz<mailto:jordan at internetnz.net.nz>>, Kavouss Arasteh <kavouss.arasteh at gmail.com<mailto:kavouss.arasteh at gmail.com>>
Cc: ccwg-accountability3 <ccwg-accountability3 at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-accountability3 at icann.org>>, "ccwg-accountability2 at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-accountability2 at icann.org>" <ccwg-accountability2 at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-accountability2 at icann.org>>, "ianatransition at icann.org<mailto:ianatransition at icann.org>" <ianatransition at icann.org<mailto:ianatransition at icann.org>>, "ccwg-accountability1 at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-accountability1 at icann.org>" <ccwg-accountability1 at icann.org<mailto:ccwg-accountability1 at icann.org>>, Accountability Community <accountability-cross-community at icann.org<mailto:accountability-cross-community at icann.org>>
Subject: Re: [Area 2] [CCWG-Accountability] Work Streams definition

Not to belabor this much more, and I may be being pedantic...

It appears to read as if WS1 is about putting in place mechanisms that "provide the community with confidence" but not specifically about putting in place accountability mechanisms or measures.  There is a big difference between putting in in place process mechanisms to provide confidence (as it now seems to imply) and putting in place actual accountability mechanisms which is what the original definition suggested.  The second definition is fine for so long as it explicitly includes the first as well.

It might be better if it read something like:

Work Stream 1: is focused on mechanisms that 1) enhance ICANN's accountability and must be in place or committed to within the time frame of the IANA Stewardship Transition, and 2) that provide the community with confidence that any accountability measures that would further enhance ICANN's accountability would be implemented if it had consensus support from the community, even if it were to encounter ICANN management resistance or if it were against the interest of ICANN as a corporate entity.

Matthew

On 1/15/2015 10:40 AM, Jordan Carter wrote:
I agree with Paul, Mathieu etc - the Charter language is the skeleton. The language proposed sets out to characterise why we would select items - i.e. why they have to be done before the transition.

We have to set out transparently the criteria we are using to decide what has to be in place. This language helps do that.

best
Jordan

On 16 January 2015 at 04:17, Kavouss Arasteh <kavouss.arasteh at gmail.com<mailto:kavouss.arasteh at gmail.com>> wrote:
 Dear All,
I do not understand who agreed with whom
What has been changed from the Charter.
I personally fully agree with the following
Quote
" in the absence "mechanisms [that] would provide the community with confidence that any accountability  mechanism that would further enhance ICANN's accountability ( in relation with work stream 1 of CCWG ,for three distinct areas , Naming, Numbers and Protocols, including parameter ) could be implemented if it had consensus support from the community" the IANA Functions transition should not occur."
Unquote

Kavouss

2015-01-15 16:06 GMT+01:00 Edward Morris <emorris at milk.toast.net<mailto:emorris at milk.toast.net>>:
+1

Paul has eloquently expressed my views in a manner far superior to anything I could write. Thanks.

One could argue that our current system of accountability and transparency  (reconsideration, Appeal, CEP, IR, DIDP), with some tweaks,  should actually be sufficient going forward. It looks great: on paper. The problem is that a system designed for redress (per Bruce) actually functions as a system of review (per Robin), and a rather cursory review system at that. We simply must have mechanisms designed to ensure that we have real systems of accountability, ones that does not rely on the good faith and open-mindedness of any particular Board or staff member or group, in place before the transition can be allowed to occur.
-----Original Message-----
From: "Paul Rosenzweig" <paul.rosenzweig at redbranchconsulting.com<mailto:paul.rosenzweig at redbranchconsulting.com>>
To: "'Tijani BEN JEMAA'" <tijani.benjemaa at fmai.org.tn<mailto:tijani.benjemaa at fmai.org.tn>>, <accountability-cross-community at icann.org<mailto:accountability-cross-community at icann.org>>
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2015 09:22:26 -0500
Subject: Re: [CCWG-Accountability] Work Streams definition

Respetful disagreement.  I think the way it describes types of mechanisms in the "new" definition is exactly what needs to be in place before the Stewardship transition takes place.  Put another way, I think that the exposition in WS1 precisely describes the commitments that MUST be made before a transition is allowed to occur.  More importantly, I think there is growing consensus across the community that this is so.  To state it affirmatively - in the absence "mechanisms [that] would provide the community with confidence that any accountability  mechanism that would further enhance ICANN's accountability would be implemented if it had consensus support from the community" the IANA Functions transition should not occur.

Paul

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From: Tijani BEN JEMAA [mailto:tijani.benjemaa at fmai.org.tn<mailto:tijani.benjemaa at fmai.org.tn>]
Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2015 4:53 AM
To: accountability-cross-community at icann.org<mailto:accountability-cross-community at icann.org>
Subject: [CCWG-Accountability] Work Streams definition

Dear all,

I read again the new proposed definition of the Work Streams, and I found it too different from the one in our charter:

In the charter:
·         Work Stream 1: focused on mechanisms enhancing ICANN accountability that must be in place or committed to within the time frame of the IANA Stewardship Transition;
·         Work Stream 2: focused on addressing accountability topics for which a timeline for developing solutions and full implementation may extend beyond the IANA Stewardship Transition

The new proposal:
·         Work Stream 1 mechanisms are those that, when in place or committed to, would provide the community with confidence that any accountability  mechanism that would further enhance ICANN's accountability would be implemented if it had consensus support from the community, even if it were to encounter ICANN management resistance or if it were against the interest of ICANN as a corporate entity.
·         All other consensus items could be in Work Stream 2, provided there are mechanisms in WS1 adequate to force implementation of WS2 items despite resistance from ICANN management and board.

I don't believe that we are allowed to change any part of the charter without going back to the chartering organizations and ask for their approval.

On the other hand, the separation of WS 1 and WS 2 was for the purpose of having the accountability mechanisms necessary before the transition done in time, and the new definition doesn't satisfy this requirement

I would prefer stay with the charter definition for all those reasons

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