[CCWG-ACCT] Proposed Agenda CCWG ACCT Meeting - 12 July 2016 @ 20:00 UTC
Phil Buckingham
phil at dotadvice.co.uk
Wed Jul 13 22:01:56 UTC 2016
Greg,
I have to agree . The CCWG needs to retain an independent counsel. This should be Sidley Austin and Adler& Colvin. They clearly already have a deep understanding of the issues involved and you have confirmed that they are a global law firm with the expertise to cover all bases.
On a separate issue, following the call last night, as one of the few financial people on the CCWG , I am concerned about the budgetary control process going forward.
Perhaps I have missed a call , discussions in Helsinki . Will an independent budgetary committee be formed. I hope if formed that this should consist of ICANN 's CFO, members of the Board's Finance Committee and elected representatives from the CCWG.
Regards,
Phil
-----Original Message-----
From: accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org [mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org] On Behalf Of Niels ten Oever
Sent: Wednesday, July 13, 2016 10:07 PM
To: accountability-cross-community at icann.org
Subject: Re: [CCWG-ACCT] Proposed Agenda CCWG ACCT Meeting - 12 July 2016 @ 20:00 UTC
Also +1 to Greg and +1 to James
On 07/13/2016 10:50 PM, Dr. Tatiana Tropina wrote:
> Thanks, Greg. +1. Fully agree.
>
> CCWG shall retain the ability to ask for independent advice. Also
> agree that continuing with Sidley Austin and Adler & Colvin is the best option.
>
> + 1 also to James previous email about not reopening the debate.
>
> Best,
>
> Tanya
>
>
> On 13/07/16 22:42, Greg Shatan wrote:
>> Siva,
>>
>> The reasons are all in the record. Please go back and read all of
>> the materials and discussions relating to our desire and choice to
>> hire independent counsel. If you have any specific questions after
>> that, please ask them.
>>
>> I will briefly say the following:
>>
>> 1. This has nothing to do with competence, although being generally
>> competent and competent in a specific area are two different things.
>>
>> 2. Where we needed first-hand knowledge or history, we've turned to
>> ICANN legal as one source for such things. That won't change. Advice
>> is another thing entirely.
>>
>> 3. Ask yourself "Who is ICANN legal's client?" and you will have
>> answered your own question.
>>
>> Greg
>>
>> On Wednesday, July 13, 2016, Sivasubramanian M <isolatedn at gmail.com
>> <mailto:isolatedn at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Greg,
>>
>> How valid are your assumptions? What are the reasons for this
>> unwillingness to make use of ICANN Legal, who are competent, have
>> first hand knowledge and a complete understanding of the legal
>> nuances on matters concerning ICANN, may I ask? Saves money on
>> most matters requiring legal advice, and should there be areas
>> that require specialized advice, we could seek external advice.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 12:28 AM, Greg Shatan
>> <gregshatanipc at gmail.com
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','gregshatanipc at gmail.com');>> wrote:
>>
>> I object, and I think many others objected, to the idea that
>> advice from inhouse (i.e., ICANN legal) should be the
>> "default." We retained independent counsel to the CCWG for
>> good reason
>> s
>>
>>
>>
>> and those reasons are still applicable today. I hope we don't
>> need to rehash that.
>>
>> We need the continued ability and discretion to go directly to
>> CCWG's counsel. Requesting inhouse to solicit an opinion from
>> an external counsel is not only "cumbersome," it's absolutely
>> antithetical to the relationship between CCWG and its
>> independent counsel.
>>
>> I strongly believe that the "default" must be the status quo,
>> i.e., that the CCWG (through reasonable processes) has the
>> ability and discretion to turn to its own counsel. Further, I
>> strongly believe that CCWG's independent counsel must remain
>> Sidley Austin and Adler & Colvin. They have been up a
>> tremendous learning curve and worked with us every step of the
>> way. It would be folly to cast that aside. It's worth noting
>> that Sidley is a full-service law firm with offices outside
>> the US in Beijing, Brussels, Geneva, Hong Kong, London,
>> Munich, Shanghai, Singapore, Sydney and Tokyo. I'm confident
>> that Sidley (and Adler) will (a) tell us when they don't have
>> the expertise to help us, and (b) work with us on working
>> methods to make our use of the firms more cost-effective.
>>
>> Greg
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 9:22 PM, Rudolph Daniel
>> <rudi.daniel at gmail.com
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','rudi.daniel at gmail.com');>> wrote:
>>
>> Based on comments on the call today, IMO; A good body of
>> knowledge was accquired on the subject of legal requests
>> in wg1. WG2 legal resources would be both inhouse and
>> external, from start, We should be much more efficient
>> this time around. Each sub however will have their needs
>> and there may be requests applicable across the subgroups
>> and/or specific to a subgroup.
>> So, that suggests close relationship between budget
>> control and the former legal request team [reconfigured
>> and/or augmented] who would have to coordinate requests
>> across ws2 sub
>> groups as i see it.
>> What determines the initial choice inhouse/external
>> resources may be a matter of consensus, but it may be
>> prudent to consider the process as [default] inhouse with
>> the flexible and necessary option of external sources by
>> consensus [as the fog clears so to speak]. I think it may
>> be cumbersome to request inhouse to solicit an opinion
>> from an external, because there may arise an instance
>> where; on the strength of an opinion, [inhouse or
>> external] ; a wg2 may wish to reframe and seek
>> alternative advise elswhere.
>> rd
>>
>>
>>
>> Rudi Daniel
>> /danielcharles consulting
>> <http://www.facebook.com/pages/Kingstown-Saint-Vincent-and-the-Grenadines/DanielCharles/153611257984774>/
>> *
>> *
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 7:21 PM, Vinay Kesari
>> <vinay.kesari at gmail.com
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','vinay.kesari at gmail.com');>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> I was unfortunately unable to join the call as I was
>> on a flight at the time, my apologies. I've just had a
>> chance to catch up on the Adobe Connect recording, and
>> I'm happy to reconfirm my willingness and availability
>> to serve as a rapporteur. Also, I agree with the
>> thrust of Kavouss' comment at 0:24:30, and affirm my
>> commitment to serve impartially. I look forward to
>> working with Greg on the jurisdiction subgroup.
>>
>> Separately, on the issue of allocation of legal
>> requests, I agree that we need further discussion, and
>> endorse creating an Option 3 based on the points made
>> and the specific requirements of the different WS2
>> subgroups.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Vinay
>>
>>
>> On 12 July 2016 at 20:55, Mathieu Weill
>> <mathieu.weill at afnic.fr
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','mathieu.weill at afnic.fr');>>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Dear Colleagues,
>>
>>
>>
>> Attached is a short set of slides to support our
>> discussion on agenda item #4
>>
>>
>>
>> Talk to you in a few hours
>>
>> Mathieu
>>
>>
>>
>> *De :*accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org');>
>> [mailto:accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','accountability-cross-community-bounces at icann.org');>]
>> *De la part de* MSSI Secretariat
>> *Envoyé :* lundi 11 juillet 2016 19:46
>> *À :* CCWG-Accountability
>> *Objet :* [CCWG-ACCT] Proposed Agenda CCWG ACCT
>> Meeting - 12 July 2016 @ 20:00 UTC
>>
>>
>>
>> Good day all,
>>
>> In preparation for your call, CCWG Accountability
>> WS2 Meeting #2
>> <https://community.icann.org/x/FyOOAw>– Tuesday,
>> 12 July @ 20:00 – 22:00 UTC. Time zone converter
>> here
>> <http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=CCWG+Accountability+Meeting&iso=20160712T20&p1=1440&ah=2>
>>
>>
>> *Proposed Agenda:*
>>
>> 1. Welcome, SOI
>>
>> 2.
>> Articles of Incorporation : finalize submission
>>
>> 3.
>> Appointment of rapporteurs for WS2 – next steps
>>
>> 4.
>> Legal Cost Control Mechanism : initial
>> discussion
>>
>> 5. AOB
>>
>> 6. Closing
>>
>>
>>
>> *Adobe Connect:
>> *https://icann.adobeconnect.com/accountability/
>> <https://icann.adobeconnect.com/accountability/>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you!
>>
>>
>>
>> With kind regards,
>>
>> Brenda Brewer
>>
>> MSSI Projects & Operations Assistant
>>
>> ICANN-**Internet Corporation for Assigned Names
>> and Numbers
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Sivasubramanian M
>> <https://www.facebook.com/sivasubramanian.muthusamy>
>>
>>
>>
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